'Make accused rapists prove consent': experts
Published: 7 May 09 07:07 CET | Print version
Online: http://www.thelocal.se/19296/20090507/
Two legal experts want to see changes to Sweden sex crimes laws to require a man accused of rape to prove he had the consent of the woman with whom he had sex.
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Eva Diesen, a lawyer and researcher, and Christian Diesen, a professor of criminal law at Stockholm University, have followed up on around 1,200 rape reports and presented their results in a report due this week entitled Övergrepp mot kvinnor och barn (‘Attacks against women and children’).
Since 1965, when Sweden first enacted a sex crimes law, roughly 100 to 200 rapists have been convicted every year.
However, the number of rapes reported annually has increased from around 300 to more than 5,000.
Many of the reports are written off because they boil down to he-said-she-said disputes, writes the Dagens Nyheter (DN) newspaper.
Diesen is convinced that it’s not only the number of reported rapes, but also the number of crimes, which is increasing.
The victims are also getting younger, with the median age of date-rape victims sinking from 27- to 22-years-old during the last decade.
Rape should be classified as a violation of personal integrity, rather than a violent crime, according to the researchers.
The way the law looks now, women are sexually available until they say no or put up resistance.
A law based instead on a requirement for consent, would those not require evidence of violence or threats.
Rather, a man would have to show that he had done something to ensure he had the woman’s consent, according to Diesen.
What do you think? Leave your comment below.
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We follow "innocent until proven guilty" in Sweden, not "guilty until proven innocent." I can see it already. Dislike someone? Tell the police he raped you and he can't do anything to disprove it. There's no evidence and it's her word against his - her word will always win. Wtf?!
How long have these people been studying law?
The problem in SE is that they have no idea how to handle rape cases... The rising number of rapes is due to cultural issues... NY in the 80 had the same problem... but in SE they know the best and God NO, They will never look outside of the box to see the real problems and how to solve them...
Add to that the punishment system for rapes... and you see why the numbers are so hight...
It makes no sense to enact stupid laws to cover for inept law enforcement.
Rape is so complex from a legal perspective, I'm beginning to think a change in attitudes rather than law is the only way to reduce it.
what a country.....
Sweden's punishments for Sexual Assault and Child Molestation are in all honesty, pathetic. There is practically no deterrent to commit the crime, you probably will not be caught. If you are caught you will get a lighter sentence than the guys from Pirate Bay, and after you get out you can just move somewhere else and no one will be the wiser.
It is ridiculous that in a country where everyone's financial records are public fodder, that people are not allowed to be made aware that there is a sexual predator living next door.
ha ha ha...... I will aim for this from now on.
On a serious note, I think this is going too far. The government should concentrate on prevention and a change of attitute rather than changing the law.
If I really wanted something done, I would have waited til Sweden takes the Presidency of the EU this summer...and then ask them in front of the whole world, about their pathetic rape statistics. Or perhaps their opinion on the high correlation between non-western immigration and a rise in crime including sexual assaults.
I do think the state of Louisiana had it right when they decided the Death Penalty was suitable to rape of children under 12. Than the stupid Federal Government said you can't execute for crimes that aren't murder. Oh well....one day.
@Princess P: Her solictor is the state (which has the legal monopoly on female sexuality).
@WeekendWarrior: It is the RIGHT step, but it is in the WRONG direction.
And if a muslim does it stone him
That's the problem. You will probably not be caught because of aforementioned reasons. It's difficult convicting a rapist. I hardly think the problem is how long the jail sentence is. The problem is that rapists aren't convicted in the first place.
Rape sentences are not light - you're speaking from a foreigner's viewpoint. Like I've said - Sweden's system focuses on rehabilitation rather than punishment. People who make mistakes should have a second chance. Hanging them out on the internet is certainly not a way to do this. There's the risk that they'll be discriminated against or abused.
They should really tell us how many of those convicted of rape have been accused of rape again. I'm guessing the number is quite low.
That's your opinion. And the drinking bit referred to the victim, not the rapist. It is far easier to rape a drunk man/woman of course and since they can't resist properly resist/remember details/or whatever the rapists hardly ever get convicted (unless there is physical evidence of violence).
This is a stab at me, I take it. As a note, I'm female.
Fair point about the drinking though, I misunderstood you.
And ok. But like I said, stopping the Swedish drinking culture might be even more difficult. But since many Nordics share this drinking culture it doesn't explain the rate of rapes. So it would only partly solve the problem anyway... so we really need to focus more on the rapists and their motive.
Certainly the way things are now is a problem and something must be done, but this is not the solution.
Don't forget that whilst rape may in many/some cases be a "power thing" which is certainly wrong, there are also plenty of documented cases of "cry rape" by the "victims" to get back at someone.
Is it right to rape someone??? is it right to put an innocent person in prison??? I say no to both!
Sweden has a history of putting in to law things that are not well thought out because it is on someone's ideological agenda and I guess this will be sadly no different.
Now we can push up the conviction rates by making it harder for innocent men to defend themselves....
Of course no woman would ever falsely accuse a man of raping her; they are all sweet and lovely without an iota of vindictiveness at all.
Maybe we should also allow people to be convicted of murder even though no ones been killed... the accused would have to prove conclusively that they have never killed anyone or face prison.
Or maybe everyone should be sent to prison untill they can prove that they have never raped, killed, stolen etc....
A stupid suggestion made by idiots and intended for morons....
That being said I do not believe this "prove consent" idea has any merit. The problem is more lack of police work and lack of sufficient punishment. When it comes to Sex Crimes, Sweden is a joke. A very cruel, base joke.
Rape is a crime, and rapists should be punished, but trying to make it "guilty until proven innocent" as an exception to the norm or the legal system is ridiculous.
Stupid idea. Really stupid in fact.
It seems that most posts here are fully supportive of the victims who mostly are women. We just don't want a law that is poorly thought out and against the general principle of the presumption of innocence. To want a law that WILL put innocent people behind bars with those people being men, seems a very misandry attitude to me.
Point here is that every drunk blondie you see on a Friday/saturday morning is ready to give a pass at any stranger just for the fun of it, and then makes a 360 degrees turn when sobre to call 911 and say she has been raped.
Let these blondies stop getting stupid drunk in the first place, and they will have a case against mutual consent that proves their rape charge.
Swedish girls will never say hello to strangers when sobber, but when drunk, they get frivolosly social and give themselves up..so who is to blame>????
both of them may be drunk, so they should blame themselves for what happened ...
How come Systembolaget controls alcohol sales and yet we see so many under aged girls and boys reeling dead drunk along the streets??
@@@@@
Oh, it's definitely the woman's fault. When I get frivolously social and give myself up, I deserve everything I get. Having one drink too many in a public bar, during Girl's Night Out, SHOULD result in my being raped. Absolutely. Poor men just can't control themselves over my blondie lusciousness. I really should be home repairing my clothing where it got torn from the last beating you gave me cos the fried chicken was cold. Sorry, boss, I will NEVER do that again.
Dont get me wrong...I said its the fault of both of them......cos they may both be drunk.. the fact that the man doesnt call 911 after the act to express his remorse over the fact that he got lured into an act of consent in their drunk state doesnt make the man a rapist and the blondie a victim.
Sometimes those who judge these cases see beyond what we see..and when they pass judgement that doesnt punish the man society goes haywire and cries FOUL...
Think it out and maybe you shall see it in a different light..BOTTOM line is rapist should be punished..but consent that gets reported as rape without taking into consideration what remorse a guy feels for being lured into the act is WRONG...
Assuming they actually did have sex and neither of them could prove it was consentual, surely both parties would have to be convicted of raping each other...
Jesus effin Christ, have I been transported back to the 1970s?
I think the issue here is because rape is generally considered a gender( male against female) problem.
I have heard boys who claim they were raped, and I chided them for not calling 911 to state their claim...We all know this happens to boys and girls in the name of rape and it is WRONG....But I feel no sympathy for someone giving of themselves in a consensual environment & then turning around to shout RAPE!
Perhaps the girl has regrets or needs a good cover story for her boyfriend/husband then it is a easy way to save her relationship by "crying rape". If neither remember the evening then the guy has no chance of proving consent. If the judge and prosecutor want follow the proposed law by the book then the guy is screwed.
Aggressive assault by either male of female on the other ,resulting in forced intercourse that leaves the raped party emotionally scarred . Such victims will not even venture to go to placesor indulge in activities that remind them of the event.
For a drunken person to say he/she was raped while in stupor & return another friday night even more drunk than ever is an open solliciation for a repeat of events which they LOVE..and that is REVERSED rape..such people who make themselves victims of rape surely have something they want to dish out to others
Be warned when last week's rape "victims" resurface to Victimize more people into their plight....
Watch the TV and U shall see women and men in war torn areas who have been raped over and over by soldiers...here we see no consent, we see aggression, and such victims beg to run away from their captors..
But when a victim dresses up to go meet his/her fate and get screwed..That is not RAPE
Because we disagree with an unjust law proposal to solve an injustice?
Fact:
Men get drunk too. There must be thousands of Swedish men who have been raped by Swedish women.
Fact Two:
The Swedish government is full of communists and feminists. This is no joke and I say Be Warned.
Fact Three:
Misandry (hate of men) is On the Rise.