Sweden rules 'gender-based' abortion legal
TT/The Local · 12 May 2009, 07:27
Published: 12 May 2009 07:27 GMT+02:00
The Local reported in February that a woman from Eskilstuna in southern Sweden had twice had abortions after finding out the gender of the child.
The woman, who already had two daughters, requested an amniocentesis in order to allay concerns about possible chromosome abnormalities. At the same time, she also asked to know the foetus's gender.
Doctors at Mälaren Hospital expressed concern and asked Sweden’s National Board of Health and Welfare (Socialstyrelsen) to draw up guidelines on how to handle requests in the future in which they "feel pressured to examine the foetus’s gender" without having a medically compelling reason to do so.
The board has now responded that such requests and thus abortions can not be refused and that it is not possible to deny a woman an abortion up to the 18th week of pregnancy, even if the foetus's gender is the basis for the request.
Your comments about this article
Cant you here what you are saying? So you are willing to kill each of your children until they get it "right"?
There was a man with a funny little mustache who said the same thing half a century ago I believe.
You all stink!
I am for an abortion if a woman chooses to have one. And although this is an odd case I agree with the ruling. You can't possibly monitor who chooses to have abortions and their reasoning behind it.
I equate it to drinking. You can drink in a socially responsible way or you can get pissed and become violent. We don't ban alcohol just because we don't like pissed violent people, just like we don't ban abortion simply because many people dislike abortion based on gender.
It may be immoral but it's not illegal, and rightly so. But I see people here are against all abortions, so there's no reasoning with them... so I guess I'm talking to myself. :)
roe v. wade?
I'm told that in parts of London they won't tell you the gender and that is because people are more likely to abort girls.
Inlet
What happens when my boy grows up?
no girls he's gonna have to go gay!!! Do YOU want to be responsible for that?
Or how about a compromise...?
Get rid of the uglies (no matter their sex) but leave the good looking ones?
Ugly females are gonna join the feminist camp anyway, and become leaders and lesbians.
Ok, flame away ;)
If Paulo +fab muscular than Jonnhy wants to p##s on me for being American it's OK. Come tomorrow I'll still be American and he...won't :D
In America, blacks supported Obama, the most pro-abortion president ever, by perhaps 95%. Now about 40% of abortions are perpetrated upon 12% of the population. Every ill in the world is rooted in moral issues.
The feminist movement started this mess and now they are the victims.
Over 83% of terminations occur by week 11 according to the statistics for 2008.
Week 4-8....75.9%
Week 9-1....17.4%
Week 12-17...5.8%
Week 18+....0.9%
Mephiso, before critisising other people and their views, perhaps you should look a the that piece of rasist scum staring back at you from the mirror. Shame on you.
Mankind is still animaistic, "Eating their own young" is the rule of law in Sweden. Evil lives in Stockholm.
Inletwatcher
KILL, KILL, KILL THE BABY!!!
Shame on you merciless, murderous Sweden. You shrug your shoulders and do the bloody work without a moment's guilt or hesitation.
Unbelievable. You are savages masquerading as civilized human beings.
My grandchild was killed in the womb and I hope we meet in the next phase.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsGrhXjOoPo
Here's a question for you Swedes: If this isn't evil, what is? Is there any limit to your depravity?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDUg0dmkONo&feature=related
It seems very straightforward - 1) Is it human? (of course, what else would it be?) 2) Is it alive? (without question) 3) Has it done anything wrong? (of course not)
Therefore, it is an innocent human life. To put to death an innocent human life is the very definition of murder.
"the pregnancy has not exceeded its twenty-fourth week and that the continuance of the pregnancy would involve risk, greater than if the pregnancy were terminated, of injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman or any existing children of her family;"
It's not too hard to argue that for some families in certain cultures having a child of the "wrong" gender could have a detrimental effect on the woman's mental health (irrespective of whether the woman herself holds the same beliefs or not).
But is it any worse (morally) than having an abortion because a child has (or is likely to have) mental or physical disabilities? An abortion is an abortion at the end of the day. The law already says it is OK in some situations (although a lot of people argue they are not justifiable). Which makes it incredibly hypocritical to say it is not in others.
So in a way I guess I can understand the reasoning behind this decision. Although morally I think I still disagree with it. I wish they would assess it on a case by case basis rather than having a blank statement.
What's the view of Swedes on abortion in general and this type of situation in particular? And does anyone know what are the legal reasons for abortion in Sweden?
Anyway, I made a direct question - do you believe that someone who is pro-life could support capital punishment?
The vast majority of terminations after 12 weeks are because of abonormality
83.3% are carried out by week 11
Is abortion also evil in these situations?
If not, why not? Are some pregnancies more important than others? Who decides? And how?
mark.three@ comcast.net
Let me make sure that I understand you.
Do you really equate the killing of animals for meat and/or other products with the aborting of a human fetus? Do you actually believe that a person who is against the taking of the innocent life of an unborn child, must also be against the death penalty for a tried and found guilty murderer or he is a hypocrite?
And people from your side of the issue look at us (pro life people) as absolutists. Human life is sacred. Because of this, we sometimes must take the life of someone else who takes the life of others so that they will not do it again and so that others contemplating this course will hopefully be dissuaded. Unfortunately, it is used so little and even with prejudice at times, and so it has not proven to be a very good deterrent.
But, I do understand that this ruling is consistent with the laws on abortion, and if anyone who is pro-choice has a problem with it, then they are being a hypocrite.
See, this is how evil propagates. Shut down dissenters (calling for the editor to quash comments), focus on side issues (incest and rape aren't the topic; aborting based on gender choice is the topic), and ignore what you know to be true: This is wrong.
Yet, I wonder if those who disagree with it think it's OK to decide termination upon the fact that the fetus eventually had a physical disability - that is - let's hypothetically imagine the fetus was diagnosed with Down Syndrome.
Is the life of a disabled person(provided that it was the reason for the abortion) less important than the life of someone else not having the same disability, thus fairly accepted as a decision criteria rather than gender which means something horrible and much worse?
Your question is more along the lines of whether the law (as it stands) is wrong. That's a different question to the OP/news article.
Also (just as in real life) conversation moves on.
I think I've answered your question on my first post but you haven't answered mine.
How can you always make sure that everybody subjected to capital punishment is 100% guilty? In addition, what makes you believe that if this person won't be stopped he/she is going to keep killing other people! Is it an attempt at being God yourself?
what do you mean by 'late term'? - few abortions in Sweden are 'late term' - abortion is illegal where the baby has a chance of independent life
Most are medical abortions - with no surgery involved
Even at around 8 weeks the fetus shows signs of feeling pain. They say that abortion is ok up to 18 weeks! How many of you who are ok with this new ruling have SEEN an abortion at 18 weeks?? And then to do this just because it is not the gender that you wanted it to be?? I find that often when it comes to abortion people tend to be accepting of it but refuse to see how it works. The human fetus is far more intricate than many people think. I understand that in cases of rape/incest there should possibly be exceptions, but you need to catch the pregnancy really early on in those cases. As far as this story is concerned, if you are *trying* go get pregnant and decide to kill your child because it is a girl or because it is a boy you are SICK.
Those were my first thoughts too, but I was mindful of not taking it too far. It seems, it wasn't that far fetched...
When I was about 10 weeks pregnant i had to see a gynacologist. He asked no less than 5 times during our 20minute visit if I was sure i wanted to have the baby and didnt want an abortion. Almost made me want to reconsider having my first born. I dont know if thats the norm, a woman tells you she is happy to be pregnant and you keep asking if she is sure or would prefer an abortion . I was a bit annoyed to be honest .
With regards to abortion, despite the overwehlming love for life on this forum, i thinks its not a big deal in sweden. Have an abortion and go about your business, its like getting a tooth filling.
Does killing an innocent child somehow only become wrong if you evaluate gender first?
Does consideration of gender somehow instill a new found moral center to those lacking one?
Baby killing is always wrong.
So I won't but need to make my point that abortion is the right of the individual and has many sound reasons for being carried out. Gender choice should not be one of them though.
Legally, I can see why the decision was made. But I also see the absolute logic and sense behind what became Germany's mass murder during the 30's and 40's. Ever read the propaganda posters they made in the beginning of it? One I've seen: Why spend so much public money supporting a handicapped person who will never contribute to society? My answer to the poster is the illogical: Because it's right to do so. To deny this leads you down a path which ends in horror.
(I suspect that many pro-abortion women change their tune when confronted with this argument.)
Ohh! Think of the children!
I think the title of this topic (and the article) is misleading. This is not a new rule, a new law or anything like that. In fact they are just stating the obvious. If abortion without a reason is legal up to 18 weeks, it seems a bit futile to focus on the gender issue only. You don't need a reason at all to have an abortion!
Clearly, assessing cases individually does not appear to be an option either. This case has shown that medical staff cannot be trusted to be impartial or leave their own moral/religious/ beliefs out of the workplace.
How many people died in the war in Iraq? Can I be pro-life and support any war whatsoever?
.
I am pro-choice. In that I mean, if you choose to have sex, you better be prepared to be a parent. Even if you use contraception. If you make the choice and become pregnant, IT IS NO LONGER YOUR BODY! It's NOT your choice!
With technology advancing the way it has, we see now that a baby will start to develop their central nervous system around 6 to 8 weeks. If these women are having abortions at 18+ weeks, those babies WILL feel it! How f***ing barbaric! Soon enough abortion is going to be looked at as The Holocaust and every woman whose had an abortion for the sake of convenience should be ASHAMED!
Hope you have a lot of gays too. With no more girls, that's about your only choice, dudes!
My question (not to anyone in particular) is who gets to decide where the line should be drawn and what are they basing their decisions on?
Should one person's beliefs be used to make decisions about someone else's choices? Should individuals be able to decide how to live their lives? Does the foetus have a choice? Can it choose? How do you know what it would chose?
I don't think it's morally right to force a victim of rape/incest have a child that is a daily reminder of the crimes they suffered. It's not fair on the mother or the child. But how can I (or anyone else) assess or know the effect an unwanted child is going to have on their mother or the child itself. If some have a choice, why don't others?
I know what I would do, but does that mean that everyone else has to do the same?
And is giving people a choice the same as turning a blind eye? The same as the beginnings of eugenics policies and so on?
Jeez, I honestly don't know but it seems this law is the least of 2 "evils"...
Some people believe in popular myths, aka religion. Some people derive a "pro-life" conviction from their beliefs. All fine. Just don't expect others to be convinced by a morality based on myths.
As it happens, Sweden allows abortion, under certain circumstances. Sweden also separates church and state. And Sweden is not America, nor is it Nazi-Germany.
The news item that led to this discussion was about gender-based abortion. My personal opinion? I find it immoral. But given existing laws in Sweden it is probably not illegal. I would rather live in a country that applies its laws consistently, than in one where fundamentalists feel inclined to tell me what to think and do.
The news item was not about abortion in general. So most comments here are off-topic. I hope Editor Bob or the clean-up fairy will delete them quickly. I also hope that the fundamentalists who posted here will go back to their woodwork and consider their religion a private matter.
If not, then I guees we need to start exchanging cheesecake recipes again.
I also wonder if human life is sacred, what is wrong with life imprisonment without parole.
little more than 30 days after the Jun 7, 1965 creation of a 'new constitutional right, the right to privacy in marital relations', by the U.S. Supreme Court in Griswold v. Connecticut --- H.H. Paul VI foresaw the links between Griswold v. Connecticut and Roe v. Wade, decided on Jan 22, 1973; as well as the link between the former and Lawrence v. Texas (Jun 26, 2003).
As you read those decisions, -- and this one by the 'Swedish health authorities' (what will the Swedish courts say?) -- one can clearly see a pattern. This pattern is called 'Slippery Slope'.
Arguably, what the 'Swedish health authorities' did is well in line with the example set by the SCOTUS. This all reminds me of the Moses' plea, on behalf of the Hebrews, in the story of Exodus. Sad.
You reasoning sounds very unbalanced - first you say they you want to adopt - then that you would reject a child that carried the genes of the child of someone who had gone though an abortion - doesn't sound like unconditional motherly love!
After all, that's what the creator would want.
Oh sorry, I didn't realise...
But somehow I think this is not the time and place for a philosophical discussion.
Perhaps one day your absolutist convictions can also help you to explain the US air raids in Afghanistan that killed some 100 innocent civilians last week.
Flip the question; Can you believe in abortion and not believe in capital punishment?
(attached image not shown)
I wish pro-life people would have more compassion and benevolence towards all our brothers and sisters. At the end of the day, aren't we all made EQUAL?
There are many of who really want to believe the Americans did it, and that includes Obama and Hillary Clinton who immediately accepted the charge before the investigation was completed.
Can you beleive in liberty and force someone to risk their life in childbirth
A woman's life is always more at risk by going ahead with childbirth rather than having an early termination
We should also consider the biologial ramifications of this issue. Lets say in ten years the male to female ratio drops to 60:40, or vice versa, and the natural evolutionary balance of primates is skewed. I could write a list of possibilities, but you can draw your own conclusions.
I personally believe that with the emerging sonogram technology, and that we can now see babies laughing and showing emotion in the second trimester, that it is only amount of time before abortions become more tightly regulated. How about a biological borderline? No abortions after the development of the nervous system (approximately 12 weeks), unless their are mitigating circumstances (such as a young girl that was raped and didn't want tot tell her pareents, etc.).
This was obviously my choice as my children were very much wanted - however I don't beleve in forcing people to take these risks
Do you know of a good / repuable website where I can go to try to fill this rather obvious gap in my knowledge? I would appreciate it...
About the argument, basically, how could it be up to us to decide if it's wrong? Well, it's up to us, as voters, as members of society, to decide what is illegal and what isn't. We've chosen to make murder illegal. Ditto for stealing, assault - many things which involve harm to another. We don't ask the murderer if he thinks it's ok to murder people; it's not for him to decide. Society made it illegal; the murderer's personal beliefs are not germane; society will punish him despite his beliefs. Likewise the woman who wishes to kill the child she helped create. It's up to society to decide if that is allowable. That's the value of this discussion.
I think human life starts very early, at the latest when the zygote cells have specialized into various tissues - no one still has any idea how that happens. But even at fertilization, it's alive, and it's human.
The crime I (and others) see with abortion on demand is that it's society-sponsered and allowed ending of human lives, which is what happened in Germany. Then, as now, millions of people allowed it to happen. To be honest, just as you don't know how you can be "pro-war" and "pro-life", I don't see how you can be "pro-choice" and against the Nazi Action T4 program, which directly led to the Holocaust. Sure, it's not the same specifically, and you can make arguments as to how deep the wrongness is for each, but both are still wrong.
And that's what is betrayed by your changing of the subject to war and everything else. If you knew it was really fine to kill a series of babies until you get the right gender, you would make a cogent argument explaining why. But instead you start talking about the Iraq war. Your own actions show that you know what's right and wrong, but it's too inconvenient for you to think about the consequences of your beliefs.
Anyone who would choose the life of their unborn child over the life of their wife is an idiot.
And regarding the Drudge clickers...not everyone that reads Drudge is a pro-life, right-wing nutjob. I just wish some of them would shut up though - because some can't articlate an arguement for sh!t. Reminds me of that scene from The Abyss when the grouchy lady (cant remember her name) tells the crazy guy to "Hey - stay off my side!"
I personally don't know why people argue about abortion, I mean, it's up to the person getting it done, right? No matter what you think, it's ultimatly their desicion, and it's them that's got to live with it for the rest of their life, not you.
It's all fair and good to express your opinion to the person, or reccomend things, but (especially when it's someone you don't actually know) I don't think it's right to condemn them for what they've done.
Yes, in your mind it might be killing another life, but surely it is better to kill/terminate that life then raise it in a home that doesn't want it, or to give birth to it and put it up for adoption adding to the already overcrowded statistics of children with no homes to go to?
Surely it's better to go against what people think you should do rather than do something that could put a strain on your life in many different ways?
I'm only 15, and so obviously never had an abortion or been in that situation, but I honestly think, with my head as far out of my arse as it could get, that my thinking is probably more mature and practical than some of the posts being said on this thread here today, which is kind of scary, considering.
Yes, it is a strain on your life to have a child you were not expecting. To simply kill a person because it's stressful for the person to be breathing is, as I said, pretty much the pinnacle of evil. Please tell me you have a better reason than it's stressful.
I agree that at least you're thinking better than some of the other posters, including the folks who agree with me. Please think about what you're saying, though, to the conclusion - where are the lines between abortion and infanticide, between infanticide and euthanasia, between euthanasia and murder. I think once you begin to devalue human life, it is a small task to expand that to include anyone whose life is inconvenient to others.
This argument loses all merit when you consider abortion the taking of an innocent life. That makes it murder and it is everyone's moral responsibility to stop innocent peoople from being killed.
Forget about the merits of individual cases. Abortions are intended to prevent lives of misery for women (often couples) who are simply not in a position to raise a baby (whether they're too old or too young), or a pregnancy has occurred under duress (rape, etc.).
It was never intended to prevent the arrival of a person of a certain gender.
Your lawmakers need to jump all over this one, and I do mean quickly. Eugenics were supposed to disappear with the Nazis, for pity's sake!
If you want to spread democracy, or fight terrorism or implement regime, or change abortion laws around the world; then Ive got some news for you... Your current strategy is all screwed up, and your tactical implementation of these strategies are in many cases criminal or just down right negligent acts.
You are a great country with some very smart people. So lead by example, and if your right, others will follow.
I doubt many people in Sweden thinks that gender based abortion should be an acceptable social practice in Sweden. We will fix it ourselves. Your insults and ignorance of our society is not helping the matter.
To get an abortion, one should have to listen to the child's heartbeat before deciding to kill the unborn child. Kill an unborn child is okay, but no death penalty for murderers?
Go ahead and lower your birth rates. Muslims, with their rabbit like breeding, will eventually overtake Sweden and then you'll have Sharia Law.
Sweden was 'neutral' in WW2. Now you are neutered in morality. And don't pass out this BS about the US in a war on terror. Other than plunder and pillage other countries, what has Sweden contributed to making this a safer world? What has Sweden done to improve the lives of anybody other than it's own people?
http://www.oecd.org/countrylist/0,3349,en_...1_1_1_1,00.html
Bottom line: in 2007 the US spent 0.16% of its gross national income on ODA, Sweden 0.93%.
Hint: military spending is not seen as official development assistance.
Yes it is. The Raptor is close at hand...
what i thought was most frightening to demonstrate the depraved mentality of the swedish psyche was this. "jag är så nöjd att see vår mest saknad svenska medlem, stebro, tilbax. välkommen tilbaka"
there are so many who are united in fighting against this evil, thank god. you must write your parliamentarian. you can simply copy and paste this "jäg älskär riktig ostkaka."
shame on you sweden. shame on you swedes. hitler lives in sweden.
Now, the Swedes are too cowardly to stand up to murder, taking the low road of accepting abortion as "choice." Sadly, what respect can you have for people lacking any morality or bravery?
I bet they even have those ticket queuing machines at the clinics too...Hell, next time I end up in one of these clinics because I've been raped by a immigrant yet again, I'll ask for some ham and 'slaw. Maybe try some of the olives too. If i'm peckish. Or maybe some pickles. I LOVE pickles when I'm rapenant.
Or is that don't mention the Norweigen Blue?
instead i turned around and replied: "men kan jag inte skojar med de jankarna som snackar skit"
i have read that the police and fire departments won't go near there and there are now curfews. sweden will get what it deserves for allowing these immigrants into their once idyllic land. i'm embarrassed that there is viking blood flowing in my unaborted offspring.
ostkaka nån?
kul att se dej här igen gubben!
the most polluting thing on the earth is women. because she produces more people to destroy the nature.
(attached image not shown)
yet it is not every person in Sweden or the United States
or other places in the world that thinks this way.
I do think however we all share blame for not helping and encouraging mothers who are pregnant to have their baby's . We should treat these young parents with extra respect, pride, and gentleness . After all little babies and their parents should be a country's pride and boast.
If we cant be proud and give a heart felt hand to the future of this world .
it will continue on to be so sad a place where grand parents wont even have little graves to mark the comming and going of their grandchildren .
Please, point that high powered finger of perception at yourself.
**refills can of "Troll-B-Gone"
Inletwatcher
If you have no connection to Sweden, fück off and mind your own bloody business. What a Swedish (or any for that matter) woman chooses to do to her own body is her choice and hers alone.
Pro life nutters make me want to call for retrospective abortion laws to be in place
If I am old in a nursing home and are no longer capable of even groping the hotty nurses during sponge bath time, then I want to be euthanatised
I just pointed out that it seemed contradictory for people like yourself to support the killing of war - yet fight to protect the 'rights' of a bunch of cells with no recognisable shape as human - seems like a big paradox - you seem able to pick and choose - not all life has to be protected at all costs - so why do you deny others to make their own determination on this issue?
I vote Grandma Death for prime minister.
Don't you just despair of people who confuse opinion with fact and then call those who know the difference idiots.
So abortion is ok in some circumstances and not in others and those circumstances should be decided by you, and a country at the other side of the world should change it's laws to fit in with your opinion. Anything else you want O Great And Powerful One?
The aquaduct?
You call us nut-jobs yet you think babies come in white, black or icecream!
Yes I'm sure it is, if the closed minded and intolerant sh1te on here is your norm.
That's the funniest of the lot. You do realise that this forum is based in Europe and that the countries of most of the regular poster were invaded by Hitler or fought like hell to remain free. What a numbnuts.
Here's a small extract from a letter posted in the The Guardian several years back that points to the fact that Hawkish Americans wished THERMONUCLEAR WAR on Europe.
"A major area of concern lay in the Mediterranean, where Soviet "fishing boats" had been patrolling for some time. Nato wished to prevent the real Soviet navy from entering the Mediterranean from the Black Sea and being able to join up with their other fleets, as well as supporting Nasser in Egypt.They were to be prevented from doing so by the use of conventional torpedo technology even if this resulted, as was probable, in nuclear war. Three British submarines armed with live torpedoes were dispatched from the first submarine squadron in Malta to intercept such an incursion that had recently occurred.
British naval intelligence was naturally closely involved and, before the submarines could reach the Soviet ship (or ships), they were recalled. We have, I think, to thank Lord Louis Mountbatten, then commander-in-chief Mediterranean and Nato supreme allied forces, Mediterranean, for averting a major risk of nuclear war at that time. The Americans, I believe, were furious."
So other than dressing in cheap gaudy clothing, being very loud and fat, they also WANTED TO ABORT ALL EUROPE!!!!!*
Dreadful really...
When you think about it.
*Wipes saliva from chin and screen & fires up tobacco pipe
Getting confusing isn't it
Maybe they should arm the foetus so it can defend itself before the abortion is attempted
I'll see your hilarious post and raise you...
Thought you'd like to know that not all Pro Lifers are Christian! Check out:
Feminists For Life
The Pro Life Alliance of Gays and Lesbians
Pagans for Life
And this from American Feminist Elizabeth Cady Stanton:
"When we consider that when women are treated as property, it is degrading to women that we should treat our children as property, to be disposed as we see fit."
Have a nice LIFE!
(Church scholar works and theological findings are excluded)
What evidences do you have to envision such a horrible scenario in which any life seen as inconvenient would be eliminated? Your analogy is imaginary as much as like those who believe gay marriage is going to open doors to bestiality and paedophilia.
(attached image not shown)
Remember Terry Schiavo?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GtyMeEcPPE
I have never understood the logic of women being so pro-abortion, and saw this coming a long time ago. It's a very sad wake-up call. But will they listen?
As beautiful looking as the women are here, there's an emptiness that pervades most of their eyes, and they don't seem to understand why. God doesn't like the killing of babies. Call me crazy if you like, but first prove me wrong. The women here are hurting.
BTW, for the record, I'm against capital punishment as well.
Who made you the authority on the happiness (or misery) of Swedish women? Every Swedish woman I know, including my girlfriend, is neither happier nor unhappier than any women I've known in my home country of Canada, or the UK, where I lived for twelve years prior to moving here.
And for the record, some of these very happy women (in all three countries I've lived in) have had abortions as well. God doesn't like the killing of babies? I won't go into quoting verses, but I think you'll find passages in The Bible which contradict that statement.
Abortion used as culling the unwanted away - be it basis of race, gender, disability or ethnicity is nothing short what the Nazis did not too long ago. Sweden has now authorized exactly similar eugenics policy as what the Nazi Germany practised sixty years ago.
I am pro-life, and abortion is at best a tragedy and at worst an outright murder. And gender-selective abortions are nothing but murder. Simply and plainly. A healthy unborn child is killed in mother's womb - simply because what he or she is, not because what he or she has done. Sweden is now on slippery slope - the same slippery slope which sixty years ago began with eugenics and ended in gas chambers.
And if someone whines pro-lifers are all some nutcase Xtians, I am a Mahayana Buddhist.
I love how "pro-lifers" call "pro-choicers" "pro-abortion".
we should start a buzz game. anytime you see the use of the following terms
a. slippery slope (this decision is just the beginning of a slippery slope)
b. fascism
c. hitler
d. eugenics
other suggestions of repetitive commentary (that is, without the poster's own thought and just a regurgitation of some other "collective" opinion)
Inletwatcher
Edit to add more buzzwords for abortion bingo
Freedom isn't free- this one is so stupid I will award 4000 extra points for any use
China
God
Baby Killers
Grandchildren
Communist
Okay, regular posters. This thread has gone beyond moderately amusing, into the downright stupid and sometimes scary zone. These guys will be gone in a day or two, one hopes devoutly, but until then, isn't it time for the östkaka? Claiming territory back from the great unwashed masses is NOT just a time honoured American tactic- surely we can do the same?
and i propose an additional:
unborn
GD, you do make sense, but sometimes it's fun to just rassle with the hogs, anyway, although the farmer may make the money by charging admission to the gaptoothed idiots crowding round the fence.
I base my statement on the personal conversations I've had with women who have had abortions, and I can't recall a single one not having regrets, not to mention some still having nightmares about it. Ironically, I've noticed women here in Sweden have more rights and opportunities than most women in the world, yet they are realizing they STILL lack something. They are no less worthy or brighter than most. Far from it! They are some of the most intelligent and ambitious I've come across in my life. Yet they still lack something. They know it, admit it privately, and it bothers them. It should. Abortion isn't helping them.
10. juni 2008 00:34
A British woman 'out on the town' on a friend's hen night in Blackpool, has given birth to a baby without realising she was pregnant.
To add to the surprise at the time she was dressed as a bumble bee!
Newcastle woman 30-year-old Ally Ashwell was on a pub crawl with girlfriends when she became ill - she returned to her hotel room and went into premature labour and found herself delivering her own baby in the hotel bathroom.
Baby and Mother are doing well...and so shines a light in a dark, dark world.
"Abortion isn't helping them?"
Where the hell did that come from? You seem to be implying that all Swedish women have abortions.
Bollocks. Have some cheesecake.
Get real. You are posting your own views on a board that is aimed at English speakers in Sweden. Many, if not most, will find your opinions amusing, at most. If you are going to get hurt feelings about that, take a Midol or go amuse yourself with firearms practice.
Missus Brady, you pore chile. I will adopt yer younguns. I got 8 of mah own, seriously. I love babies. But I hopes that this one, ifn you give it to me, will be toilert trained before he starts skoool.
Harlemite, and everyone else except the Buddhist Deputy of Morals, nobody here is going to change their mind about anything, because someone else posts something else. In these parts, we have two time honoured ways of dealing with fascist babykilling moral majority type booshwa while still allowing everyone to have their own opinion. One is the Ignore function. Poof. Magic. Ironmistress is now gone, and I didn't even have to go to a clinic. The second, even more interesting diversion from usless threads is...cherry, blueberry, strawberry and does kex make a decent substitute for graham crackers?
Fer the rest of yews
NEWS YOU CAN USE
Look up in the blue bar at the top of the page here, where it says control panel. If you click on that, you can then find a command that says manage your ignored settings or somesuch. If you pull that menu down and start typing in the name of people who deserve Siberian banishment, EB has made it easy to populate your own little Gulag. Try it. It's fun.
You see where I'm from I'm not sure it is
It hurts my heart to hear/read my favorite people here falling for this crap. It is actually scaring me. Or is it scarring? I can't tell what is real and what is not.
Sorry for the threadjack, but I've read page 3 and pages 14 and 15 and realised that this isn't a thread, it's an abortion.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkeGOH5vy7I
Inletwatcher
And it is sad to hear what some women do to their unborn baby, any way How will they be sure that the coming baby with the gender they want is a good one? It is sad because some couples are doing their best to have just one child and on the other hand you see women thinking this way.
Not only in Sweden , it is all over the world!!
... or should it have been terminated long ago?
Thanks. Now I've got to clean the coffee of screen.
Ewww. Compared to the classy pics just posted, ah might have gone over the top. Ah done mah duty here. Ah am gone.
Thank you Granny death, that done went and made my mind up.
My black, gay jewish babies are soon gonna be riding that feelgood freeway to the pearly gates of everlastin' joy...Yee Haw!
P.S Oh, btw, If I'm not back in 5 minutes. Well, I probably won't be...
Yee HAW, TAWANDA!!!
Was that bridal delux dress a tube top? Cos I'm getting a mental image.
Laughing my gay small person ass off- this has been the best thread EVER.
[attachment=174:24248423...efb8704a.jpg]
And can we run around Stockholm before and after drinking gin based cocktails, wearing plastic breasts, devils horns and tee-shirts with funny slogans on saying like "Just Murdered" and "Abortion: Just Do It!", or "Lose Weight - Have an abortion!".
Can we bring pets and children, only i have a cat and a daughter , they're both 8, a bit slutty and I don't want them getting ideas.
Can I stay off gin though, it makes me insanely horny and I usually try and leave it a couple of months in between before I get knocked up again. Otherwise I end up with stirrup-chafing.
Or maybe they're busy volunteering at all the charities that support victims of abuse/trafficking/neglect/poverty/deprivation/hunger/homophobia/racism, try to eradicate malaria/HIV/AIDS/postnatal tetanus/fistula work with children in care/in the justice system/on the streets and the like, you know? Coz all human like is sacred...
If so, I s'pose we should bear in mind that folks there are somewhat less likely to be reading the cack that closet case, Drudge slaps up on his blog.
Or preparing to invade Sweden, force their religious views on everyone and kill the majority who don't agree or fit their religious extremis shoes (as they've threatened). Oh no sorry! Wrong year, wrong country and wrong guy....
They really go on about that too.
Really grinds my gears.....
Grandma death: your pics are PRICELESS and between you and VHW ... well I haven't been this entertained for a while!
Something to be said for letting some nutters in once and while...(um not your guys but the other ones... haha)
I am going now to work with a smile! AWESOME!
With luck they won't wake up....
http://news.bbc.co.uk/cbbcnews/hi/newsid_8...200/8045254.stm
You know, when I stopped laughing and started getting the nursery ready for the poor tainted midget rape baby (nearly got the pig shite shoveled out now) it was the comment by the Grandfather stating that his grandchild was aborted that bothers me most. Let me just state the obvious for the obvious-challenged, particular mah fellow Amuricans:
People. This is the Web. You might be trying to win your little arguments about abortion, but stating that your grandchild was aborted means that at least one person here would be able to track find your family member. Assuming our beloved B was also sworn to kill all baby killers, he or she wouldn't have such a very hard time figuring out who you were. Don't share information on this board that doesn't belong to YOU . Don't tell us your girlfriend was the victim of child abuse. Don't tell us that a family member had an abortion. Don't tell us about your cross dressing husband's urge to advertise in Pig Farmer Weekly. IF a loved one or acquaintance feels information like this belongs out here for every nitwit in the world to comment on, and, in the case of Drudge, make money on, let this person go to Springer or Dr Phil or here and post it him- or herself.
Nimrods. Okay, my quota is up for the day, too. I feel much better, and there's a baby shower-barbecue-pig slaughter to plan. Yee haw.
*Chomps
[attachment=175:kfc_1.jpg]
*i'm out of here*
If I ever decided to buy some advertising space on this website I would be more critical and analytical rather than only trusting in internet traffic numbers as they're supposed to be presented.
If a woman doesn't want to continue a pregnancy all the way. for any reason, she should have the freedom to end it, safely and easily. For the health and well being of that woman whose life we should value and cherish more than that of a partially formed fetus. Isn't it in the greater interests of all of humanity that women not be slaves?
As a family member of someone who tried for over 5 years to fall pregnent with her husband, I can say that you should seriously consider giving the child up for adoption ratehr than abortion. Just look into it.
My cousin tried for a very long time, and allshe wanted ws to have a family with her husband. This was lenghy and costly IVF period, which actually worked in the end. It was the last time she could try legaly, so she has also investigated the option to adopt a new born. Although things worked ou for her in the end, there are thousands of parents ho a not so lucky and you would be giving them the greatest gift possible.
I wish you the best of luck with his tough decision.
If women don't want to continue a pregnancy (for whatever reason), she should have the freedom to end it, safely and easily. This is for the health and overall well-being of that woman, whose life we should value more than that of a partially formed fetus. And for the greater good of humanity. After all, isn't it in the greater interests of all of humanity that women not be slaves?
The real discussion here should be, Why Do We Allow the Killing of These People? I defy anyone to look at this and tell me that is not a human person. If you support abortion, you support the killing of people for convenience. Even people conceived in rape or incest are still human beings. You support the indiscriminate killing of people for any reason? What about babies surviving induced abortion at 18-25 weeks, who survive the forced labor? You think the doctor should snuff out that life OUTSIDE the womb? Now we are talking euthanasia. How far we have fallen! Even dumb animals treat their offspring far better than this. How can we not be judged for this?
Important: Christianity Condemn Abortion but as the people are now a days living in Soul free society , may be that is another status quo.
IDialogue
Hurts being impotent, dunnit.
I think you have just hit the nail on the head.
"If you're so pro-life, do me a favour: don't lock arms and block medical clinics. If you're so pro-life, lock arms and block cemeteries." Bill Hicks.
A.N.I.M.A.L. http://www.animalpicturesarchive.com/view...2&did=27861
GAY!!!!
Someone somewhere in Sweden is having doggy-style gay sex and not feeling the least bit guilty about it.
(Although, to be fair the pro-lifers probably wouldn't object to that scenario because there's absolutely no possibility of someone getting pregnant.)
Those fundies must really be into bestiality if pregnancy prevention is the goal!
:bleats like a sheep:
- there's no sexual desire & homosexual filthy thoughts
- there's no sodomy action
- there's no mutual masturbation or single masturbation at all
- there's no ejaculation
Hence, it must be purely sublime and spiritual in which only pre-cum and soft boners are allowed. Is it similar to Holly Spirit-Mary bang?
Seriously, though...would y'all like me to drive to the nearest Baptist Church and have a look around? I bet someone's jacking off behind the building.
- there's no sodomy action
- there's no mutual masturbation or single masturbation at all
- there's no ejaculation
This sounds like a lot of American marriages. Are you SURE you're not my straight ex-husband posting under an anonymous name?
What, exactly, is forced labour?
Priceless.
<ponders whether taking Activist's embryo picture and captioning it "Abortion - better out than in" would be a step too far>
How do you know when a baby is a dead baby?
The dog plays with it more.
What's funnier than a dead baby?
Two dead babies.
What's funnier than two dead babies?
Two dead babies in clown suits.
And what's funnier than two dead babies in clown suits?
NOTHING is funnier than that.
I was just waitin on you, Princess.
- Swedish welfare has got substantially improved
- Swedes enjoy one of the most equal societies
- Swedish *children* are much better off than most children in the world and are happier than those from the United States according to recent reports
- Sweden is top ranked positively in the first 5-10 positions in most global statistics
Is this society similar to anything you found in Nazy Germany?
Half a litre of coke, two scoops of ice cream and two scoops of dead baby.
A dead baby sitting next to a kid with down syndrome.
(two birds, one stone! I thankyou!)
A homesick abortion.
Because they're hand made.
Anyhoo, talkin' bout babies etc wouldn't it be a little off-topic to discuss *pregnophilia*, would it?
Dollars to donuts, good old Tom in Pennsylvania and the rest of the Fundie lot confuse Sweden with Switzerland, though.
What I perceive, and I'm not old enough to know what western culture was like prior to 1974, but I perceive a degradation of the value of life among people. I see parents who don't take their jobs as parents seriously, who look at raising children as more of a hobby rather than part of their identity. Children, people, family - these things don't seem as important as I imagine they once were. And the mental gymnastics we go through to allow the unborn to be summarily killed doesn't help us to reverse this trend.
For me, it's just wrong, I can't explain adequately why, I just know it's wrong. So my question yesterday was an honest one, if you think terminating a string of pregnancies until you get the right gender is OK, then what IS wrong in your opinion? Where are your lines drawn? Wherever convenient, or is there something there in your core guiding you, a line you won't cross no matter what it costs you?
Kang, Princess P and Mutters ya aint getting well informed about things of life, eh?
http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Maiesiophilia
Godwin's Law is now in Play.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law
This thread how now entered into the realms of ridiculous!!
(attached image not shown)
Look - I realize you're lacking in activities given the fact that it's not buck or doe season and you're not exactly sure what to do with that gun gathering dust in the corner of your trailer, but that doesn't exactly give you the right to pollute a forum with your Neo-Con, Fundamentalist, Bigoted, Religious Right agenda. Isn't there some Focus on the Family/Dobson radio program to occupy your little mind?
I'm going to be as blunt as I can conceive of being (no pun intended):
1. Your opinion is not valued (as a matter of fact, I think you will find that most of us find you offensive).
2. You are not going to convert the masses.
Instead of wasting your precious time firing off words into the ether, why not get off your ass, go to a local charity (non-denominational) and change the lives of those who are already on this earth who need it? After all - isn't that what your Lord and Savior would do?
[attachment=186:motivato...4b49d424.jpg]
*oh well*
I was just reviewing the entire thread and marvelling at the new one post wonders and feeling a little sick as they stream in spewing their ignorant opinions.
H8'rs of pro choice people - build a bridge and get over yourselves.
Some of you are clearly fundamentalists, go to the pope thread and do some catholic bashing.
I am pro choice, anti war and anti death penalty and really anti-hypocritical.
Why am I pro-choice? because if we go the "Christian direction" God gave me a choice and the right to make that choice.
Why am I anti death penalty? because the justice system is flawed and relies on human nature to make an objective decision that is always going to be subjective.
So - gender based abortions,whilst not my cup of tea, can be used for medical reasons and for these reasons alone should be allowed. Some Genetic "diseases" are fatal and you must look at the quality of a child's life. Below is a list of diseases that can be screened for - NOT NECESSARILY ABORTED OVER but this is a huge list. Moralists be aware that we are not doing favours to kids if we give birth to chronically disabled children that may never or can never survive without medical intervention.
Some with treatment can lead productive lives (that's awesome), whilst others will remain in a pretty much vegetative state.
Food for thought!
Achondroplasia Cystic fibrosis Hypophosphatasia PKU ADPKD1 Down syndrome Incontinentia pigmenti Retinitis pigmentosa ADPKD2 Duchenne muscular dystophy Kell disease SCA6 oSickle cell anemia Adrenoleukodystrophy Dystonia Klinefelter syndrome Sonic hedgehog mutations Age-related aneuploidies Epidermolysis bullosa LCHAD Spinal muscular atrophy (SMA) Alpha-1-antitrypsin Familial dysautonomia Lesch Nyhan syndrome Tay-Sachs disease Alport disease Fanconi anemia Marfan syndrome Tuberous sclerosis Amyloid precursor protein (APP) mutation FAP Multiple epiphysial dysplasia Turner syndrome ARPKD Fragile X syndrome Myotubular myopathy Von Hippel Lindau Becker muscular dystrophy Gaucher disease NF1 and NF2 X-linked hydrocephaly Beta-thalassemia Hemophilia A and B Norrie disease X-linked hyper IgM syndrome Charcot Marie Tooth disease HLA genotyping Osteogenesis imperfecta 1 Chromosomal translocations HSNF5 mutation OTC deficiency 1 Congenital adrenal hyperplasia Huntington disease P53 mutations
And do you not think that most women who go through abortion already feel bad about the fact they are doing it? Or do you not think they have gone through every alternative and come to stop here because there IS no other way for them? It may be "Killing an innocent life" for you, but from what I know, the majority of women don't just do it because they can't be bothered to carry it for 9 months.
No, I don't think it's right for her to do this, but as I've said, it's her choice. If she wants to live with herself after doing so, it's up to her. It is not you who has to carry that thought for the rest of your life, and if she did do it, you don't have to see her again if it disgusts you.
In a society that has "freedom of speech" and fredom to choose, why should we be alowed to choose such a life changing thing for someone else, and potentially for hundreds of people we don't even know exist?
I'm glad Obermeister Bob never shut it down
Pretty much all of your descriptions of me are wrong, it's kind of funny. And as I said, I change the lives of people who need it by adopting several special-needs kids. I don't just yell at people and try to further an agenda, I actually live to make a difference.
And you are absolutely right. It is insightful to speak to people who think differently. We have all learned that you are a narrow minded moron from Pennsylvania who is using a Swedish news forum to promote *your* concept of morality.
Really? My descriptions of you are wrong? How is that, Tom?
Are you personally involved with Sweden? No.
Are you pushing your moral agenda on a random forum? Yes.
Do you have any respect for those who don't agree with you? No.
Make no mistake. I don't, "yell" at people whose ideas differ from mine. I do, however, have a phenomenally grand old time showing hypocrites the err of their ways. If you have a problem with my tone and approach, perhaps you should think about how your tone and approach is interpreted by those who have to listen to you, your condemnation and unfounded judgement.
You don't have a uterus. You cannot carry children. Yet, you feel oddly entitled to tell another living being what to do with her body.
Tend to your own garden before your start pointing out the weeds of others.
Have you ever gotten to know children with some of the diseases you mentioned? Many of them have a zest for life, and understanding of what is important, not matched by healthy children or adults. Do they suffer? Yes - so does everyone. Do they die? Yes - so does everyone. Life is short and painful for all humans. But my son, who is severely physically afflicted, has lived more deeply and richly in his 7 years than most people do in a lifetime. Certainly more than I did in the 30+ years before him. These children have the potential to be great people, and often are. Not "productive", in terms of finance, but great human beings nonetheless; there are things more important than money.
Not trying to promote anything; just offer a potentially different point of view. Could just ignore me, you know. I'm several thousand miles away; I can't actually hurt or even annoy you.
My apologies - I really didn't mean to imply that you were yelling. I only meant to differentiate myself from some of the close-eared and close-minded people just spewing vitriol, anti-Swedish, anti-European crap and then leaving. I just meant that I wasn't yelling; I didn't mean to say that you were. I don't have any problem with the way you get your point across. I really had hoped that there would be SOMEONE who actually wanted to have a good old logical, Socratic type of argument, discussion, or whatever, about something that we all obviously care enough about to keep on this topic. If all you have to offer is, "Shut the hell up, Yank", then I guess I'm wasting my time.
1) We are a lot closer than you think.
2) Your agenda is going to directly impact the physical well-being of women in the United States.
See, not only do you annoy me with your perceived morality, you can hurt me and hundreds of thousands of women if you got your way. You are the one trying to inject your morality into the governing law of *my* land (the United States). You and you ilk have absolutely no right to govern the body of another.
Stop making this about my being mean and start thinking about the crowd you run with. The group you associate with. The group of people who harass women for seeking a legal, safe abortion. The group of people who threaten physical harm to health care practitioners who perform this legal procedure.
You cannot demand respect when you're unwilling to offer it yourself.
As far as morality being injected into the law, that's done every day. Somewhere we decided it was wrong to kill people, even if they really really pissed you off. I know there are Americans who believe that if they are disrespected, it is their right to kill that person. They think it's morally wrong for me to want that behavior outlawed. We disagree with each other, and vote accordingly. Thankfully, the majority of people agree with me, and manslaughter is actually illegal.
Concerning this issue, if it were EVER decided democratically in this nation that abortion should be universally legal on demand, then I wouldn't have much problem with it. But it never has. Clearly, a plain reading of the Constitution would put this as a state issue. Even ignoring the 10th Amendment, which everyone does, the Constitution is a document limiting federal power, not entitling it to every issue it wishes to foist itself upon. But what has happened is that a very un-democratic very small group of appointed officials determined what is now the law throughout the country. And so-called representatives of the people are too chicken to do anything about it, despite public opinion.
As far as your concern, the health of women, I'm concerned too. However, we need to learn to live with the consequences of our actions. Adults know how pregnancy happens and how it is avoided. Is it fair that only women have to endure months of discomfort, the risk of death, as the result of sex? No. Is it more fair to deny life to someone because it's inconvenient? I don't think so. You do - vote that way. But it should be votes of the people that determine the outcome, not a handful of oligarchs.
In any event, some of these practises should be limited - I think a majority of Americans would agree with that. Like in Sweden - limited beyond the 18th week. Prohibit partial-birth abortions. Certainly find a way to avoid successive abortions until you get the gender you want. Something. There are things to discuss, where the lines should be.
You really don't think so? Have at it, it's like having a sneeze?
Democratically decided? FTW? You want a national referendum on abortion? The Supreme Court's decision making abilities is now inadequate? Who are you to make that judgement call?
And spare me the rhetoric about State's rights. All that tells anyone is that you feel you are smarter than the Federal Government and you get to pick and choose, out of convenience, what laws you will abide by (but heaven forbid you lose Federal funding for your pet projects in the process).
I'm still trying to figure out what sort of credentials you possess which allows you to be the legal scholar you profess to be and the medical scholar you profess to be. Because, as I see it, you're not exactly the brightest bulb in the box and the fact that you may have a role in decision making that directly impacts me scares me to death (FACT: a fetus is not viable without a host at 18 weeks, let alone 20 weeks).
Alas, you're a conservative. All for smaller government when it suits you and for legislation when things don't go your little way.
The United States was founded exactly with the idea of LIMITING the power of the federal government. And yes, the people in Utah know better the policies and laws they should live under than some nameless, faceless and often times unaccountable to them pol in Washington DC.
Frankly I find that hilarious. Wait until my girlfriend hears about that one.
Edit: What is your source of this "information"?
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
Where is the right to end pregnancies defined in the Constitution? Would that be in Article III? I missed it.
The point is that th entire reason for the American Revolution in the first place is we decided it was better to be ruled by locally elected folks rather than be dictated to by a far-off, removed government. In many ways, the accomplishment of the Revolution has been undone, merely replacing London for Washington, DC.
And I'm for smaller government, all the time. I don't need legislation; I just need to be left alone. All I want government to do is to protect the weak from abuse from the strong. Oh, and roads are nice, too.
Oh, and I don't care when it's "viable"; children are not viable without support from adults for several years. It's just a matter of how much support is needed.
And you can call me a dummy; you're the one resorting to name-calling and subject-changing instead of formulating cogent responses. Which one takes more thought?
None of the practices that you mention above are legal in SWEDEN where most abortions are induced medically - not surgically - and over 83% occur by week 11. It is illegal to abort a baby in SWEDEN if it can survive independently outside the womb
Any dead babies lying around?
Markbase, are you calling avon customer service in the USA or the local one in Malmo? You could have different answers.
But he never mentioned having to hang out behind dodgy clinics waiting to pick up tiny corpses. I guess some things are better left unmentioned, eh?
Is that how the law is written, by the way, that the determination is if it can survive? Because the age that babies can survive outside the womb decreases over time. My 2-year-old son was born at 26 weeks, and while he has some complications from the care he received, his mind is 100% intact. He's actually very bright. But 10 years ago he could never have survived at all.
OMG! That's exactly what I'm looking for!
During the early years placenta cosmetics was considered a luxury only available to the rich and famous. The treatment was very expensive selling at up to $10,000 per injection. Today you can buy a whole range of Plazan natural skin care products including anti wrinkle creams and cosmetics masks based on placental extracts for as cheap as $30-90. Particularly placenta collagen mask regularly used by Jennifer Lopez will cost you only $86.55.
http://www.prleap.com/pr/73918/
...and this one a cutting edge non surgical treatment offered worldwide but in Europe in the Netherlands. Although it needs further research it sounds very promising! I hope these new technologies based on stem cells will also one day produce a treatment capable of increasing lean muscle mass and reducing body fat rather than being used solely in the cure of so many degenerative diseases!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-...ind-beauty.html
I think they are fair and logical.
I wish I lived in a less conservative country, but I don't, I live here in AU.
I noticed you failed to comment on my post when I pointed out the various genetic disease available to choose from based on Gender too.
You're more than happy to debate emotives, but not facts?
It's natural for us to want to protect the weak, the feeble and look after them. It's a pack instinct. We look after those who are not able to look after themselves, after all, that's what socialism is about.
We're at a cross roads here.
Nature Vs Nuture.
If I had a 1 in 2 chance of having a baby that would end up with a fatal disease, what action do you think I would take to prevent this?
Back in the dim dark ages when medicine was a natural concept, babies who were too sick to live due to their various birth defects or diseases usually died before they hit puberty. Nature would take it's course and the kid would die before it could breed. This is part of Darwin's theory of Evolution. The strongest survive, or adapt to change.
We are unnaturally extending the lifespan of children who have and will have no quality of life. We even treat humans who are dying of cancer or other diseases worse than we treat animals when they are dying or in distress and keep them alive when clearly, once it's terminal, you should let them go. [pro euthanasia here too].
I would imagine that in a society like Sweden there will be guidelines on when it's appropriate to abort due to Gender. I also think too many people think the worst of others and assume that Swede's will start aborting all their girls.
You cannot control peoples MOTIVE. If you try to people will lie anyway.
Besides, I have not seen a single convincing argument here against it. All those posting have been against all abortion and are therefore hardly the people to make a judgment on this.
The far left liberal mindset here has finally reached the point of ethical/moral insanity.
This decision on gender-based abortion is a human atrocity and an indication of a society in decline. Do they somehow rationalize that abortion is just a simple and harmless procedure where a lifeless chunk of fetus tissue is extracted from a pregnant woman's womb? Do liberals like to pretend this procedure doesnt cause the baby any pain and that theres no trauma involved?
Now, if the mother is not content with the gender that, too, is justification for the extermination of the baby. (Or fetus as liberals prefer to think of it)
Make no mistake here; abortion is a hideous act of violence performed on a thriving, living baby. (On behalf of a womans right to choose)
I'm sick of hearing that it's "the mother's body and her choice.
Watch a LIVE ABORTION and tell me if you think it's the mother's body that's being dismembered or the bloody legs and arms of the BABY'S body!
(Separate human entity)
Liberals detest a visual exposure of this gruesome reality, yet they support it at every turn - They dont want to burden the mother with any sense of shame and accountability for her decision. This woman from Eskilstuna in southern Sweden - who had twice had abortions after finding out the gender of the child should have been reprimanded for neglecting the use of contraceptives and treating pregnancy in such a casual manner; Instead, Sweden rules in favor of her gender discrimination and provides an abortionist to accommodate.
If Sweden is to retain any sense of ethical dignity around the world, it should fire all those individuals at the National Board of Health and Welfare for this barbaric decision.
Special footnote: Upon further reflection, Ive changed my mind about some abortions;
I think we should, in fact, make abortions available for mothers of future TROLLS! After all, they don't have a life anyway.
Regards,
Teacha
Here:
You see, I have several children with dibilitating diseases, as you described, but I do not see them as having a life inferior to my own. In fact, they thrive in ways you may not imagine, especially if you have not known children like them intimately.
Thanks for considering this. I do see your point, and agree, that the weak dying is a natural part of evolution. I just think that we as compassionate humans should be better than the cold heartlessness of survival of the fittest. (I can see you're not cold and heartless; but nature is.)
and, call me crazy, but I think something can only be truly alive once it starts living - i.e. there is a certain level of experiencing things that goes along with living, you know?
further to the point: it is much more fair to this unborn baby (that you seemingly care SO much about?) for it to be aborted, than to be born into a family that either
-doesn't want it
-can't afford it
it is far more cruel to have an innocent child grow up in needlessly difficult situations just because YOU don't like the idea of death
p.s. WE HAVE TOO MANY PEOPLE ON THIS PLANET ANYWAYS
p.p.s. I am not an extreme liberal - just a rational, intelligent person. People often confuse the two...
The Swedish abortion act has allowed abortion for any reason until week 18 - a doctor asked for clarification whether he could 'vet' patients resons and declare some patients reasons unaaceptable such as gender - the answer was that the law that has stood for 34 years is still valid - and reason means any reason
Also abortion of a fetus capable of independent life outside the womb is not allowed in Sweden - hence the 18 week limit
And by that they actually mean the centre left but somehow the extreme left also exists. But then to such nutters socialist is a insult
As said FYI anti-choicers more right wing people are liberal than left.
It also seems to work out that if you believe in limited government, individual responsibility and free markets you get lumped in with the religious, social right. Not always the case either.
Such is the way it works with a two party system and broad coalitions under one umbrella.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8076253.stm
Maybe we should mob their website...
Not surprised really: no sex ed = more unsafe sex
I cant believe how unborn children are treated like trash in Sweden.
I pity you people Swedish people.