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Let teachers ban face veils - Liberals

Let teachers ban face veils - Liberals

Published: 04 Aug 2010 11:31 GMT+02:00
Updated: 04 Aug 2010 11:31 GMT+02:00

Sweden’s schools and universities should be allowed to ban students and teachers from wearing face veils, education minister and Liberal Party leader Jan Björklund has said.

“Teaching is communication, it is about being able to look each other in the eye and in the face and to be able to communicate with each other. In this context I argue that it is extremely inappropriate to allow clothing that covers the face,” Björklund, speaking in his capacity as party leader, told Swedish Radio.

Swedish law is currently unclear on the issue of schools’ and universities’ rights to prevent students from wearing face veils such as niqabs or burquas. An adult education college in Stockholm was last year reported to the Discrimination Ombudsman after it banned a student from wearing a veil in class. The case is still pending.

“I want Sweden’s principals to have easily interpreted laws - you shouldn’t have to go to court in order to find out what the law is,” Björklund said.

The National Agency for Education (Skolverket) issued guidance in 2003 in which it said that a headteacher could ban a teacher or pupil from wearing a face veil if it was having a negative effect on pupils’ education.

Ann-Charlotte Eriksson, deputy chairwoman of the Swedish Teachers’ Union (Lärarförbundet), welcomed the Liberals’ approach, which she said would give teachers clear guidance:

“It has to be clear what a principal is allowed to do. This is something we have sought,” she said.

Eriksson underlined that any decision on banning face veils must be taken following a dialogue between teachers, families and pupils.

“If this is to be successful and not create polarization in society, I believe in creating dialogue. Schools should never be felt to be harassing people. We must therefore explain why why take decisions, what the purpose is and what solutions one can find,” Eriksson said.

One problem that Eriksson identified with students who cover their faces is that teachers cannot identify pupils turning up for exams.

“Teachers need to be sure that they are grading the right pupil,” she said.

TT/The Local (news@thelocal.se)

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Your comments about this article

11:53 August 4, 2010 by Puffin
This is just populist electioneering from the Björkland who appears to have no idea what the actual rules in schools are

A ruling from the School's Agency Skolverket on 24 October 2003 makes it clear that head teachers have the power to ban burkas and other clothing that covers the face from the classroom

http://www.skolverket.se/sb/d/246/a/501

So the Education Minister appears completely ill-informed about what the current rules of his own department actually are!!
12:01 August 4, 2010 by Serendipitiz
No religion in schools and no religion in politics. No matter whether you're Christian, Muslim, Hindu or a believer in the Flying Spaghetti Monster (though I will make an exception for FSM - he's right there, every day, at lunch time). That's the only way forward. And no, you Christians are no better than the Muslims, so don't you start. All fairy tales and no logic, and that has no place in our schools. Leave your beliefs at home, or in your designated places of worship. The way most people have problems with gays and lesbians and immigrants on The Local, that's the way others feel about religion.
12:29 August 4, 2010 by byke
What would trainee bee keepers do?
12:47 August 4, 2010 by Nemesis
School is for learning.

School is not a place for the indoctrination of ideologies about various sky god myths.

Religeon should be banned in schools.
12:49 August 4, 2010 by Syftfel
What do you mean "should be allowed to ban..". There shouldn't even be a question. This is a debate that shouldn't even be allowed to take place.
13:09 August 4, 2010 by the fonz
I agree with byke, who makes a valid point in fact you could include astronauts too
13:22 August 4, 2010 by Nemesis
@ byke & the fonz,

When was the last time you saw a beekeeper in full bee keeping equipment studying in a school?

& the fonz,

When was the last time you heard of an astronaut taking classes in a school?
13:36 August 4, 2010 by Marko2010S
Fatheads and Goons MUST understand that people are born free and they should remain free. Also, they MUST understand that if you have a diamond, then, you gonna cover it and protect it NOT unveil it and let it walk with bikini. This is how much Muslims love and respect their women. It is so sad that many people in the West can't sense or imagine such deep love and respect.

@Nemesis #4

I'm having some free few minutes and I'd like to analyze your perspective regarding this issue. Who knows maybe I can come up with a conclusion about what kind of person are you....

"School is for learning."

Who ever claimed otherwise?

"School is not a place for the indoctrination of ideologies about various sky god myths."

I guess we already agreed on that point !

Schools are for learning.... why on earth do you keep on repeating same words....

Ohhh wait I guess you are pretty confused and your little brain makes you think when a proud Muslim woman wears Hijab or Burqa then she is praying to the God who you bluntly denied his existence (FYI, Muslims believe in the same God that Christians and Jews believe in. So, I think you are not only having serious issues against Muslims! Apparently with others too :) ).

"Religeon should be banned in schools." P.S. It is "Religion"

An irrelevant statement that reflects only how the writer/commenter has no idea about what s/he tries to say. Basically such behavior comes out of insecure personality. Seriously I can't imagine how you can barely gibber your way through a conversation with other sane human beings.
13:36 August 4, 2010 by PonceDeLeon
"The more you define freedom, the less you have." Time and time again "Liberals?" are redifing what personal freedoms people should and should not have. When are people here going to wake up. You say you are free, you say you believe in freedom, yet you let fear and ignorance take away the freedom of others. Eventually you lose your own freedom. Zero tolerance = zero thinking.. Please stop dictating how people should live..
13:37 August 4, 2010 by diegoveggie
face veil!?!? it feels like the middle ages again
13:37 August 4, 2010 by europeman31
If Sweden is a democratic and stand for Human rights declaration as IT claims . So there must not be any kind of push or laws against personal freedom. If Sweden cannot stand for Human rights Values , it is better to declare so openly .

According to HR declaration of UN, " People are allow to dress without any subjecution".

who the Hell Politicians are how should we dress ?
13:51 August 4, 2010 by Streja
Read Puffin's post.

I don't see the problem, so far only two girls in Gothenburg wanted to cover their face but the teachers needed to see their faces in the classroom as they were in the same class, so they compromised and let them cover their faces outside the classroom.
13:51 August 4, 2010 by Kaethar
@europeman31: Sweden is a exceptionally free country where people have the RIGHT to freely communicate with one another. A face veil hinders this right. Since a face veil is not religious in origin wearers can not hide behind the freedom of religion act. People are NOT allowed to dress however they want. Do you see people walking around naked at random either? Do you see people wearing balaclavas and hockey masks in public areas? Face masks have always been frowned upon - and if you enter a bank wearing a ski mask you're probably be arrested on suspicion of crime. There is no reason why the veils some muslims wear should be an exception. My confidence in Folkpartiet hasn't altered. :)
13:54 August 4, 2010 by Joshe
Being a practicing muslim, I think that veil should be completely prohibited....because this is not part of our religion but an old cultural thing. One big example is when all muslim men and women go for Haj in makkah, there God/Allah has forbiden from wearing veil.......if God/Allah asks you open your face in front of men in makkah then why not at other places.

And to those who think that veil should be allowed, i'll ask them will you allow western women to wear bikini or short skirts in your own countries??? if not then just follow what swedish state wants!!! or just go to a country where you can wear veil.
13:57 August 4, 2010 by wifey
Last I heard, if I were to go to a muslim country I'd have to cover up or I'd risk getting shot....Also, people, take into account that at the end of the day it's got a lot to do with security. In Australia you can't go into a bank wearing a motorcycle helmet. Same thing really....
13:59 August 4, 2010 by maakm
I have been noticing that every issue like freedom of speech, the one in this article and many other are always against Muslims. Why not against any other group of people. It feels like people have target only this group and every law is practiced against Muslims.

How the heck you can say that you are living in a free country when a person cant wear cloths of his choice.
14:11 August 4, 2010 by Marc the Texan
If you don't have a hard and fast rule and leave it open to some interpretation on how it affects the teaching environment then you will have constant challenges.

Just ban the thing. Its oppressive and those who say it isn't are suffering from Stockholm Syndrome.
14:12 August 4, 2010 by sadiejo400wcn
I am saddened by the fact that Sweden being such a great country has fallen prey and hostage to some its own wonderful rules and regulations. I mean personal freedoms. I will not say anything about religion because it is not my buisness.

The Niqab as it is known should be banned totally in Sweden here are my reasons.

It frightens children and this not funny because i have seen this happen to my kids. We were in a lift in a hotel going up to the 7th floor and in comes a darkly dressed form (cant say if it was man woman) totally coverd from top to toe. Wearing sun glasses. My kids started to scream and get fits (they are 3 and 4 years old)

We crossed our fingers and hopes the 7th floor would come sooner than later. Honestly we were very happy when our journey ended.

Now here is my question and I think its a relevant one. If in a room you got 20 of these ladies wearing Niqabs how will the husbands or kids recognise their wives or mums? Is there a gps attached to the cloth?

Now here is one more very valid reason. It is well known that many terrorists wear the Niqab and carry deadly bombings. This has happened in several Islamic lands. Including Jordan were a marriage was ruined by a sucide bomber wearing a Niqab. In Pakistan and Iraq several sucide bombers have been wearing the Niqab (men and women)

In Pakistan One Mulla tried to escape being arrested by wearing a niqab (the red mosque story in Islamabad) I do not say all who wear the naqab are terrorists but terrorists use the niqab to destroy our modern way of life. So on day to day basis there is no gurantee for the population to feel safe and sound as long as we have terrorists who would use this niqab to kill and injur innocent people.

thanks thats my take on this story.

Sadiejo400
14:18 August 4, 2010 by shame, shame
religion should not be banned, it should be ridiculed for what it is - utter nonsense.
14:19 August 4, 2010 by locaxy
I wouldn't say the liberals are populists. Quite the contrary.

Screw religions! Islam, Christianity and other controlling fairy tales have outlived their usefulness.

http://www.humanisterna.se/
14:21 August 4, 2010 by Puffin
Some posters don't seem to see the correlation between

- yesterday it was revealed that the anti-immigrant Sverige Demokrat party was gaining ground in the pre-election polls

- Today that well-known political opportunist Education Minister Björklund comes out with a populist statement about greater controls on - of course immigrants - in order to grabb some of SDs votes - despite the fact that this is already a directive from Skolverket

Björklund is the type of politicians who would likely sell his own grandmother if he thought it would get more votes
14:22 August 4, 2010 by maakm
@Joshe "Being a practicing muslim".hahahahahhaha :).yet you are challenging GOD's words.

@wifey Who f**k have told you about being shot and which country you are talking about. I have been in most practiced Muslim countries and I never knew that.
14:47 August 4, 2010 by byke
@ Nemesis

Bee keeping school is quite the buzz, I have heard.
14:50 August 4, 2010 by Nemesis
@ Puffin

Got it in one.
14:52 August 4, 2010 by asim513
Being a muslim, i dont think face covering is a part of islam. It is an Arab/Babylonian tradition that muslim women adapted during Arab Imperialism.

Actually it was meant to protect the face in deserts and not hide the face
15:04 August 4, 2010 by seychelle_18
Joshe: I agree with you

Sad to say for Sweden, that in some instances immigrants already claim the place as their own and even wanted every people to adapt to them. Respect is not an issue but why do others always have to adjust to them. If they cannot give up their culture or belief about wearing this clothes then why bother to live in Sweden? Why not go to place where they would totally have the freedom that they are longing. And then there would be no more issue.
15:23 August 4, 2010 by The Nine
I think the real issue here is about the suggestion that teachers should be landed with the responsibility of this. That is wrong. Whatever the rights and wrongs, pro or cons of this issue, it should be a blanket decision made by the state. They either band veils in school or they don't.

it will crate conflict of parents demanding their kids are taught by teachers who allow veils as opposed to those who do not. Also, inevitably some teachers are going to get greif off parents of Muslin kids if they personnaly don't want veils in the class room. Teachers should not have to be distracted by that. If veils are banned, the teachers should be able to appear to remain impartital 'Sorry, its a gov't decision and not my personal decision' Once again, that very Swedish trait of not wanting to take accountability. This should be a state decision one way or another and not left to a teachers personal like or dislike.
15:23 August 4, 2010 by byke
So when will these plans be unveiled?
15:29 August 4, 2010 by jwlundgren
I suppose the teacher could go to the student and ask them to briefly remove the veil to assure the correct student was in the class or taking the test. But, the biggest problem I have with the veil is that it is an open sign of lack defiance. It is a political statement. It means that the wearer has no intention of integrating into Swedish culture.
15:31 August 4, 2010 by locaxy
@maakm "@Joshe "Being a practicing muslim".hahahahahhaha :).yet you are challenging GOD's words. "

Sorry to burst your bubble, but there's nothing from Allah that requires Muslim women to wear face veils. What you have written is just ignorant.
15:44 August 4, 2010 by Renfeh Hguh
Why should Muslim women be treated any different to the way everyone else is treated in society?

The closest equivelent to wearing a veil that any males or non-muslim women wear are the full faced balaclava or a full faced motorcycle helmet.

Is it acceptable to wear full faced balaclava or a full faced motorcycle helmet in -

A bank: NO

A store at petrol station: NO

Any store or public building: NO

A school classroom: NO

Why are these items not acceptable to be worn? for obvious reasons!

Why should the veil be any different!
16:14 August 4, 2010 by Jes
If you are confused , read @marko2010S`s lips . He says : if you have a diamond , won`t you cover it ?

Marko is only comfirming what most of us already know : to muslim men , a woman is a property like a piece of diamond . In other works , she is OWNED by men and must therefore stay hidden away from thieves .

Personally , I am all for freedom of religion . But I don`t agree that one should rub his faith , his sexuality and other private beliefs or practices in other peoples faces . For that reason , I say that those women who want to cover their diamond faces , there are places where they can do it without offending anybody ; Soud Arabia , for example .

If muslims don`t see anything wrong with a christian being arrested for wearing a cross around their necks in Soud Arabai , why should they wonder why Europe is unwilling to have their kids be taught by someone whose face they cannot see ?

I think this Minister is dishonest . He knows that schools can decice on their teachers clothes choices . Would a school , for example , need to consult the law before banning a female teacher who comes to work in a bikini ? And what is another teachers "religion" is Nudity ?
16:22 August 4, 2010 by glamelixir
I have to say that I agree with this.

Besides, in my opinon, religions only tear us aparts as humans.
16:22 August 4, 2010 by jackolantyrn356
Since it is a question of a "sliding scale" of Religion, mixed wih a heafty dose of Culture. The Veil comes up "Short". ........ To take an examination we need to know who tou are.

A multi-cultural nation starts becoming stable when the cultural Guests get to discover what they need to alter to get along.
16:25 August 4, 2010 by Beavis
The first country in the world to ban this was Turkey...... Recently joined by Syria... so stop whinging at the "west" doing this
16:45 August 4, 2010 by hpunlimited
If I can't wear a G-string and be topless to school then no-one should be allowed to cover your face either. How about a robbers mask or a panty hose on your head while in class?

Schools should be allowed to define "dress code" in my opinion.

I think that veils are more about culture than being a good muslim. These girls can cover their faces when they are home out outside the school in private.
16:46 August 4, 2010 by Puffin
These discussions just make me laugh

Given that head teachers already have the right to ban face covering veils and burkas etc as part of their whole school rules - and have had this right for almost 7 years

Where is the news?

Oh yes there is an election in 6½ weeks and the Education Minister wants to be seen to be talking tough on immigration LOL
16:54 August 4, 2010 by boby
All you guys are waisitng your time. Demography does not lie- today about 40% of school children in Sweden are Muslim or from Muslim origin. So write all you want on sily forums, its only a matter of some years before you all have to ware veils. And there is nothing you can do about it hahahah
17:01 August 4, 2010 by Puffin
@boby

Your knowledge of Swedish schools is woeful
17:02 August 4, 2010 by Nemesis
@ byke

That would be an interesting school:)
17:26 August 4, 2010 by countrysidedrive
Most humans believe in a God. But what is happening is that imperfect man has created ways to honor his god. Religion was created by man not God. Wearing a veil, burka, cross or praying 100 Hail Mary's, kneeling toward Mecca and so on and on. All these things were created by man, not God. To be a slave to a made up religion by imperfect man is why there are so many wars. Religion is the evil. Not the belief in God.
17:42 August 4, 2010 by Swedesmith
@Marko...if you have a diamond you should cover it up? I think cats have it right, you know what they cover up.
18:18 August 4, 2010 by tuerd1982
"Teaching is communication, it is about being able to look each other in the eye and in the face and to be able to communicate with each other. In this context I argue that it is extremely inappropriate to allow clothing that covers the face,"

what kind of argument is this? Teaching means teach some thing to your student not looking at your students eyes or face. For natural science, the demonstration, doing on board, drawing and writing works well not steering on eyes or face.

But I agree, with a many people who commented here already. There should be no any religion effect at school and inside of the class room, since you come to school for the belief of education make changes in your future.

It will be more strong and pervasive if he use some other expression for his argument.
19:08 August 4, 2010 by mr.frog
I'm against wearing hijab or burka in public place because of a simple logic. Being nude and covering everything are two extremes of people's choice of clothing. Nudists are allowed to be nude in a separate nude beach or other limited place. They don't come to school or any other public place naked. Because it is offensive to others. This rule is not discrimination; it just makes sense. Similarly, people covering everything can do so in a mosque or at their own house but it should not be allowed in a public place.
19:36 August 4, 2010 by FFF
Wake up Sweden, Wake up!!!!
19:40 August 4, 2010 by redfish
mr.frog,

The reason it should be okay to prohibit nudity in public places isn't because it offends some people, but would be disruptive. And the reason it should be okay to have rules on face coverings isn't because it offends some people, but because there are problems that occur when people's identity's are hidden. Reasons should always be practical.

The whole issue with religious sensitivity is misplaced, because in cultures in which the burqua is required to be worn, women are forced to go to sex segregated schools where they only see other women and are allowed to show their faces. They're also prohibited from driving, so there's no issue with them having to show their faces on drivers licenses.

So, Saudis obviously understand that these things are impractical, which is why they disallow them. What we're talking about is a clash of two incompatible cultures.
19:46 August 4, 2010 by izbz
@maakm,Renfeh Hguh

Got nothing against women with veil but in school??????

Say....a girl sit for an examination, how can the teacher really tell who the heck is really behind the veil?

Of course everyone have the right to practice what they believe. But since you are in Sweden, if the government decide to ban that so be it. But they didn't really mention anything about banning after school.

@mr frog

They sure are allow to do so in public places, If they don't mind the heat in summer, why should you?
20:48 August 4, 2010 by Jes
I did not believe that there is group of men who have such tiny penises until I saw the nudists . The Swesish government should remove the burkas from these muslim women and place them on these men .
21:08 August 4, 2010 by PaulTheOctopus
"Religion is the opium of the people"
21:32 August 4, 2010 by jbat
This type of clothing is not A MUST for muslim. So, I am a muslim and I agree if Sweden want to ban it. This is just a part of ARAB cultures.. so please don´t confuse with Islam and Arab.... its not always the same! For those ARABs who claimed this type of clothing is A MUST for all muslim, you better learn more about Islam before you claim what you do is related to Islam!
21:34 August 4, 2010 by Nemesis
The first countries to ban the Burqa were muslim countries.

Tunisia actually has a government campaign against it. Turkey has banned it.
23:03 August 4, 2010 by mr.frog
@Jes

Hahaha
23:27 August 4, 2010 by shiplu
i'm ahmed ..... and i totally support it .......
00:24 August 5, 2010 by proteasome
Worry about being a good teacher and not the differences between cultures. It should be a new Swedish rule, if you want to make a new rule or law that makes people conform more.... don't make the rule! This is the country of conformist to the extreme. The sun rises in the East, taxes will be high, and immigrant's children will all become little conformist Swedes.
00:25 August 5, 2010 by hogwort
@Marko2010s #8

What is irrelevant is your comment. Please explain why shouldn't religion be banned in schools, otherwise don't bother posting here.

I agree with @Nemesis #4 because I suffered from religious discrimination while I was at school for not being a Roman Catholic and a son of divorced parents. But since every single person in the school was Catholic, I was considered and "rotten apple", and it wasn't long before they expelled us, just to enter another school from which we received this exact type of abuse.

I also agree with those who said that religion should be left for home. People from many different religions attend the same schools and a lot of conflicts of this type could be avoided if people were taught that their religion is no better than anybody else's.

I've read your comments in other articles and when you get into an argument, you attack the other person with things like " Ohhh wait I guess you are pretty confused and your little brain makes you think when a... ", and you try to defend your religion by making irrelevant observations. What has orthography got to do with this? I know plenty of Catholics who like to argue this way. They tell me theirs is the only way to follow God. They tell me that I am confused for being tolerant of other religions and that someday I will realize I was wrong and I will thank them for helping me find the path to God. But they never tell me why. They haven't even asked themselves why.

What caught my attention the most in your comment, however, was how you compare women with diamonds. Women are not a valuable property. They do not belong to us. You have no idea what "deep love" and "respect" mean.
00:57 August 5, 2010 by JoeSwede
face veil!?!? it feels like the middle ages again.

Swedes are compationate and understanding people. So what do they get....a bunch of muslims immigrating that demand that their women be veiled and some sort of muslim law. If Sweden challenges it then they're not being understanding.

Sweden has already changed. I remember the topless beaches...
07:45 August 5, 2010 by Antonioparco
Sweden should close all schools that have any religious connections. They do no good for the society. Just plain brainwashing instead of developing the children's future. Sweden should ban any kind of veils..chadors,burkhas or niqabs. They represent discrimination of women, forced marriages, extremism and terrorism. If the authorities are not active and aware..soon those muslim fanatics will demand that they want the syariah laws in Sweden. Wake up Sweden before it is too late!!
07:54 August 5, 2010 by silly t
WHO IS TALKING ABOUT TOLERANCE AND FREEDOM? for goodness sake Muslims are the most intolerant of people and islam the most intolerant of religions.yet they are the first to feel attacked by issues such as above.

would you carry a bible or put on a bikini even in the beaches of Dubai?

would you profess christianity openly in saudi arabia? you would be stripped off of all social benefits.
09:35 August 5, 2010 by jwlundgren
Boby: Keep it up! You will help land the Swedish Democrats in power. It's that kind of talk that has 'normal' Swedes in fear of muslims.
11:17 August 5, 2010 by Jes
You are alier @hogwort !

Except in seminaries or convents , there is no catholic school anywhere that can expel a student for not being catholic . How did you get in anyway if the school was discriminative .

I think you are confused . The issue here is about Islam and burkas for muslim women not what happened to you in your sad childhood .

@ mr.frog ,

did you hear one idiot when he shouted that a mans wife is his diamond that he has to hide ?

@ silly t

you don´t get stripped off your social benefits for professing christianity in Saudi Arabia , you go to prison for at least 25 years . Its the same crime like drinking alcohol or using / selling drugs .

You could even be hanged if you were a citizen of Saudi Arabia

What if a wife were to consider his husband a diamond -- should place a helmet between his stupid hairly legs ?
11:54 August 5, 2010 by jbat
Hello helloo again!!!

Burkas is not part of Islam

Burkas is just a part of Arabs culture... yes most Arabs are muslim, but this does not mean what they do is always what Islam tell them to do.

So the issue here about Islam and burkas for muslim women IS NOT TRUE!!!

The true issue here is about stubborn Arabs and their traditional burkas clothing for their women!
13:05 August 5, 2010 by Antonioparco
jwlundgren.it is not only 'normal' Swedes in fear of muslims.This is more than that. The issue with the muslims shouldn't occur if the swedish authorities were to take action 30 years ago. Instesd they just close 1 eye until..these so called muslim fanatics were encouraged to demand more of their righs and all that craps. Many foreigners like me are also damn fed up with these idiots who take the most attention in the society and just give craps back. Take a look at Rinkeby and Tensta in Stockholm, Rosengård in Malmö..these are muslims(majority from Somalia and the ME) who refuse to integrate in the normal society. Send them home!! Or even better drop them over their countries without any parachutes if they refuse!
13:26 August 5, 2010 by Audrian
I think the veil should be done away with. I see no use for it, unless a person wishes to hide a physical deformity of extreme type, e.g., third degree burn that destroys the face!
13:28 August 5, 2010 by the fonz
I rekon there's been some sort of cover up!
18:44 August 5, 2010 by hogwort
@Jes

First of all, I never said anything about my childhood being sad. I wrote what had happened to me and my brother during our school days because I wanted to say that this doesn't happen only to Muslims and to respond to another comment that said "religion should be banned from school".

We got in because the school wasn't supposed to be discriminative in the first place but every pupil and every teacher were, so the authorities found a way of getting us expelled. But we were not sad people.
22:37 August 5, 2010 by Jes
Come on @hogwrt , I am not impressed !

You go to a school that is not "supposed to be discriminative" and you end up suffering discrimination anyway . The you go to another school and the same thing happens to you again - - Years later , as an adult - you still want religion to be banned from schools because of what you experienced as a child and yet you want to tell me that your childhood was alright ?

Sorry , I don´t buy that one .

Listen : there is nothing wrong with having religion in schools . I have met a lot of very intelligent , well-balanced productive people who studied in catholic schools .

I have also met a lot useless bums , criminals , idiots and social out-casts who have never touched a bible or a karan .

Try and vist cuba , where religion has been banned for 40 years and see for yourself what I mean

Take a look at crazy China or study the history of paraniod Communist Soviet Union . Then come back and tell me what you have found .

There is no proof that religion corrupts people minds, just as there is no proof that absence of religion is the same presence of good conscience .

Blaming is the lazies excuse for ignorant chaps like you .

Taught is the right way , by the right people , and right dozes , religion can help shape good morals among humans . The opposite is also true .

Remember that even a nice dinner table folk can be turned into a weapon if it is in the hands of someone with a wrong head .
11:29 August 6, 2010 by wifey
@Marko2010S

If I had the most beautiful and most precious diamond I wouldn't be walking around the streets with it. I'd put it in a safety deposit box buried deep under a well guarded bank. And I think a lot of people would do so as well, so... get the message.
23:54 August 6, 2010 by waffen
Either come to Sweden to live and become citizens, and thereby assimilate by learning the language. and giving up the the body coverings, and any idea of Muslim Laws, and finding a job so that you are self-reliant and self-sufficient. or do not come to Sweden. That is as simple as that.

Those who are in Sweden and who cannot live with that simple idea, should leave and go back to their origins, but leave the monies, that Sweden has given to you to live, in Sweden.

France, Denmark, and others, are already enforcing or considering laws like Sweden is considering, so your options are running out every day.

Try the United States, or Germany, they still have, in the main, more permissive attitudes toward Muslims, for the time being.
11:30 August 7, 2010 by americanska
@ waffen - you are about what sweden should do. but sweden doesn't ask anyone to be self reliant - that is the problem.

Denmark has the right idea. I'm sure if some Muslim extremists killed thousands of there citizens in a destructive attack. they wouldn't allow a mosque to be built in that spot!
01:40 August 8, 2010 by rumcajs
@americanska,

"sweden doesn't ask anyone to be self reliant - that is the problem"...... That's not a problem. Maybe if all those not self reliant people around there were self reliant, we wouldn't have a job.......... so we couln't say that we are self reliant any more, cos ......, we'd be like them and we'd be very happy to live in a country that doesn't ask anyone to be self reliant. And we would hate those bad people with huge egos that think it can't happen to them, and say that everybody (but not them) has too big salaries and everybody (but not them) pays too little for housing and everybody (but not them) should live like crap and blame us for everything all the time.
00:08 August 22, 2010 by subfuzion
@Marko2010S ... the difference between a woman and a diamond is that you can own the diamond. Do please keep your own personal rocks covered, moron, but leave the women alone.
Today's headlines
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Ica pulls contested Easter commercial off TV

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Dismemberment killer gets sentence cut
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Dismemberment killer gets sentence cut

The 22-year-old man convicted of murdering his ex-girlfriend in northern Sweden had his sentence reduced on Wednesday, in part due to his "peculiar personality". READ () »

School gas leak sends 25 to hospital

School gas leak sends 25 to hospital

An elementary school in southern Sweden was evacuated on Wednesday and dozens of pupils were taken to hospital after the smell of gas spread through the rooms. READ () »

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Swedes vote for country's nicest cock

A Swedish churchwarden has reacted with joy upon finding out the parish has Sweden's nicest weathercock. READ () »

Greens push rich tax to finance schools
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Greens push rich tax to finance schools

Sweden's third largest party The Greens revealed its shadow budget on Wednesday, targeting schools and youth employment. High earners would have to pitch in more. READ () »

Holiday status updates 'not a burglary risk'
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Holiday status updates 'not a burglary risk'

Mythbusting Swedish researchers have found no link between gushing about your upcoming holiday online and returning to an emptied house. They told The Local that a trip to Ikea could be much more dangerous. READ () »

Woman charged after accusing beggar of theft
The people in this picture are not those from the story. Photo: TT

Woman charged after accusing beggar of theft

A woman in Gothenburg who accused a beggar of robbing her has been charged with fraud and false accusations. READ () »

Swedish royals set baptism date for princess
Photo: Kungahuset

Swedish royals set baptism date for princess

Sweden's royal family has set the date for the baptism of Princess Leonore. READ () »

The Local List
Evidence Game of Thrones is set in Sweden

Evidence Game of Thrones is set in Sweden

With Swedish Game of Thrones fans frothing at the mouth at the season four premiere, The Local revisits its list of ten reasons why the hit books and show are (probably) based in Sweden. READ () »

'Baffling' Swedish raid on German sub makers
The Kockums Malmö shipyard and FMV headquarters. Files: TT

'Baffling' Swedish raid on German sub makers

After the Swedish military raided the Malmö premises of German defence giant Thyssen Krupp, a military expert tells The Local why recent Russian aggression means Sweden's Saab needs to take control of national submarine production. READ () »

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The Green Growth Group Summit »

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