Teens convicted for Stureby murder

4 years? Isn't that harsh, won't 4 years affect their lives detrimentally? I mean putting them in jail will not bring her back to life. Why ruin 2 more lives, they should get probation and counseling and perhaps a vacation somewhere to help them forget the horrible events of that time. The Swedish justice system is horrible and cruel!

I admit they are not adults but nor are they children,what type of deterent is 4yrs juvenile care,if they even get that!what if someone was contemplating such a crime,all the time thinking,worst comes to worst,i'll be out by the time i'm 19.CHRIST! I like this country a lot but the justice system needs a good kick up the arse,thinking about the perpetrator and not the victim,victim's family or the broken lives left behind.

Ironman294:

If you are allowed to vote in the next election, please put your vote on a party that wants to change this. Or talk to your local politicians and tell them how you feel about this.

But I have to agree with you 100%. 4 years is pathetic!!

40 years hard labor(no parole), nothing less imo.

If this country had the death penalty, then the same death as they inflicted on this girl would be suitable. Strangelation till death for both of them. That way we wouldn't polute our DNA pool with murder genes.

ironman294...are you freakin serious? Let the murderers have VACATION just because they are kids! The killed someone!!! I do agree the Swedish justice system is weak but come on man. . .probation....vacation! "Ok kids.....here is the message, kill someone. Don't worry, you're a kid....you will get probation and vacation. All paid for by the Swedish people!"

This country is a paradise for rapist & murderers. If you bump off someone you get four years while a rapist get 19 months. Sweet....

I think ironman294 was being ironic,tongue in cheek so to speak.

I really hope ironman294 was being ironic/sarcastic. And we all know they won't get four years. They should get life in prison. It wasn't even a spur of the moment murder either. It was PREMEDITATED, 1st degree murder!!! If they have the ability to think through a murder, plan it (even if the planning phase was short) and then commit the murder, they should never be allowed into society again. How can we trust someone ever again who thinks, plans, and then commits (or in my opinion even attempts) a murder? We can't! We must protect society from people like that.

Wait a minute! It was not their fault that they murdered someone. It was sociiiiiiiety's fault. We have to feel sooooooorry for the murderers. They had difficult chiiiiiildhoods and could not control their aaaaaaactions. They are both very depreeeeeeessed. They need heeeeeelp and psychiaaaaaatric guuuuuiiiiidance, not puuuuuuunishment. They are almost chiiiiildren and should thus go free so they can be readjuuuuuusted to sociiiiiiety. Borgström himself said that it was psycoloooooogical phenooooomenon.

Hi Guys,

or course I was being tongue-in-cheek, I'm American, but if I were Swedish that would be a true post.

And I am saying that by reading Swedish reactions to storie slike this in the past and with some of my swedish friends. But slowly and surely by living here in the US they are startng to become a little more conservative! Tack Gud!

Harsh punishments don't reduce crime, the only purpose they serve is revenge. I like Swedish justice system, it tries to reform people instead of punishing them.

I agree with part of your statement someoneonthenet. But if you know anything about the recidivism rates of certain types of criminals, pedophiles, for instance, then I think you would disagree with what you said. And I think that people can be rehabilitated from non-violent crimes. But I think that if you commit a violent crime, especially a premeditated violent crime, you have no right to be rehabilitated, you deserve to rot in prison, in isolation, until you die.

They should hang until dead! Or shot!

The same punishment for rapists too!

[Memo to would-be criminals World-wide]: Your felonious ways are tolerated in Sweden. Visit/Vacation/Relocate.

.sigh.

ironman294, case in point. You said if you were Swedish your post would be true. In more or less words someoneonthenet said exactly what you said in your first post minus the sarcasm. It is sad when two people plan a violent murder and then carry it out and the prosecutor recommends 4 YEARS! Then to have many in the general public agree is a slap in the face to the victim and her family. They would probably think differently if their wife/mother/daughter/sister was brutally murdered by strangulation.

What is our world turning to?How dsre you iron man to open those mouth of yours saying let them free?

If you were the parents of the deceased girl,u will probably be singing another song....We now live in a world where ppl dont csre much as long as one of thier own is not touched

Whoever kills,let him be killed or have the jail term sentetnce ..No parole!!!What are we giving chance to breed...child killers that will always have tendency to commit again when the laws are too soft

A word will be enough for the wise

Sorry about that ironman294.

I agree that punishments should be much more harsh for repeat offenders because some people can never be reformed. In my opinion the reasons why a person committed a crime should be a major factor when handing out punishments. If criminals in this case were around 30 or something (and everything else is exactly same) then i am fine with 10 or even 20+ years. As far as victims relatives are concerned, it is sad but nothing will bring their family member back.

Yeah, nothing will bring the girl back but the point of harsh sentencing is to deter others from doing the same thing!! Sweden's judicial system is such a JOKE that even if these kids were 25 they would only have been sentenced to maybe 5-10 years. This kind of s**t really pisses me off about Sweden. Great country, but really messed up judicial and immigration systems.

"In making his final statement before the court, prosecutor Jakob Holmberg argued that both young people should be sentenced to four years of institutional juvenile care."

Jakob Holmberg, if your child was murdered, would four years still be a sufficent sentence?

Harsh sentences are not to deter others but to deter murderers from murdering again and again. In four years, these two murderers will be free to enjoy their lieves but the victim will be nothing but a slight memory.

People who murder others during the commission of a crime need to be executed. The execution will serve as a deterent to the murderer, only.

I really don't think americans should come here and complain about our judicial system. Go back home and fix yours first!

Ok, so you have the death penalty. And that seems to work like a charm doesn't it? How come Sweden's rates in violent crimes are so much lower then without it??

I hate people who are just able to see the world in withe and black, good and evil.

If you are willing and able to kill, and worse if you premeditate and carry it out, something is wrong with you and your values, you need more than just rehabilitation; punishment and protecting society from you are in order. This no self defense, it's murder. The murdered (and accomplices) makes the choice of ending someone's life, it's their decision. These are not just mild psychological problems, it's murder, someone does not get to live out their life because of it. So to those that say, let's not penalize, lets just rehab shortly and let loose, lets not ruin the murderer's life, the murdered person won't be coming back anyway, I say, what if it was your life that's gone, lets forget you and be kind to your murderer and give him all the opportunities we can. Somebody beat you to death, I'm sure he had a reason. Or if you really want to kill somebody, just do it, don't worry, well take it easy on you, come up with some good reason and I'll be even better.

That girl's life way taken, she doesn't have another chance. Someone stole her life, so why in hell should they get to have another chance??? why should they get to live there lives, and have what she will never have the chance to have? All because of cause of a stupid teenage relationship. That boy knew exactly what he was doing. I think he should defiantly get help... In prison for a long time. I think the laws in Sweden are way to soft, I'm American and while there is more crime in the US, there is also as many people in the whole entire country of Sweden as there are in los angeles alone, so if doesn't really compare. As a young woman I feel safer in the US knowing that if I were raped or assaulted at least something would be done about it. But here they would get a slap on the wrist, if that. Now their is a lot of problems in the US too, don't get me wrong, But on this matter I think Sweden need to make stricter laws and protect people better. Or at least give us the right to protect ourselves. We can even carry pepper spray here. Not cool at all.

ok im a swedish-american,,born and raised in sweden but joined the american military....i love sweden with all my heart but its about time we grew some balls.

in order to stand up for our people we have to be able to protect them, even if its from our own people.

a slap on the hand isnt gonna change the mindest of these teens,the boy even said that his girlfriend pressured him to doo this in proof of love,,you think a shrink can fix her mental instabilities?im sorry but id prefer not to walk around on the streets with murderers.

There,s nothing more to add to the comments written here, I seen it so many times the leniency Swedish courts dish out to criminals.

I feel so sorry for the dead girls family and the waste of life.

Wake up Sweden ....

Most swedes accept this kind of low sentence as they themselves are prone to commit the same crime; particularly when they go out on their drinking binge. Hence when this day comes, they would expect the same leniency from the court. So it would be counterproductive to demand changes in the system as they would be shooting themselve in the foot.

:-D

WELL DONE!!!! When I first read it, I TOO was thinking that it was real because I have ALSO seen people, even in the US, that feel exactly that way. I had to read it 3 times before I realized that the precise ACCURACY of the ABSURDNESS of such thinking made it a great parody, extremely funny! GOOD JOB!!! (Scary that some people actually think that way!)

You did manage to suck some people in, but interesting that others (maybe they know you by now, or they don’t know Swedish society) did not fall for it!

TRUE! ALL SO TRUE! So sad that the Swedish justice system is behind the times! Sweden needs to adapt the idea that when young people commit crimes, they are evaluated as to whether they should be tried as a JUVENILE or as an ADULT! Some crimes are just stupid, juvenile crimes and should be treated as such! Other crimes cross over into being so horrendous that they need to be treated through the ADULT court system! Send these kids to Juvy until they are 18 and then let them finish their 10+ years in adult prison!

NOT EVEN THINKING OF THE VICTIM!!! Oh those poor children who committed that murder, we have to protect THEIR rights! Why worry about the victim's rights, they're dead so they have no more rights! We have to help the living!

You help the LIVING by PUNISHING the GUILTY!!!!!

As a LONG TIME career criminal and gang member, I get the kids to carry the weapons because if THEY are caught - nothing happens! I will even have the kids do the killing, as proof of loyalty, because if THEY get caught, nothing happens! IF these KIDS do go to jail, it will be such a short time that they are told, "they are doing it for THE FAMILY (gang), they will be taken care of and their family will be taken care of while they are in jail and as the icing on the cake, when you get out, you will be a hero and have high status in THE FAMILY!" You know how many people I have been able to kill and how many crimes I have been able to commit because I let these kids do all the work!?

I disagree that "the only purpose they serve is revenge" It is NOT about revenge! It is about keeping society SAFE by REMOVING the criminal element from the PUBLIC!

If it was about REVENGE the prisons in Sweden would not be some of the MOST ACCOMMODATING in the WORLD! They would be a HELLHOLE what criminals would not want to go to!

Harsh punishments DO deter crime! Weak punishments ENCOURAGE crime! American courts treat drunk driving as a joke and so the joke is on the American people because there are SO many people who drive drunk because they have NO FEAR of the consequences! The Swedes treat drunk driving rather severely and so “most” Swedes would not even think twice about doing it!

The Swedes in this society are for the most part, peaceful law abiding! The real problem is that there are psychopaths AND there are also people that are coming to Sweden who do NOT share the values of the Swedish society.

Yes! One of the great things about Sweden is the idea that Swedish people become criminal because of some outside influence. That criminals just need to be reformed to become productive members of society! The great thing about Sweden is that the social system protects those that have too little! So in Sweden people do not have to steal to provide for their families. This idea of LAGOM creates a society that is satisfied with having just a little more than they need! People do not need to steal to get more and more things!

Then comes the criminal element that does NOT share these same Swedish values (or are driven to crime by their addictions). The addicts we catch and cleanup and try to deal with fixing the reason they are addicts. The "other" criminal elements, we catch AND LOCK UP FOR A VERY LONG TIME! Make them pay room and board while they are in prison. If they are not Swedish Citizens BY BIRTH then they should be DEPORTED!

You cannot rehabilitate a psychopath! You can only protect society from them by locking them up!

Not knocking you DeepFried BUT

Just a side note to everyone NOT in the know - DeepFriedTwinky is one of those TASTY American treats like Deep Fried Ice Cream. Well the Americans have managed to top even these HEART STOPPING delectables by creating - Deep Fried BUTTER! (google it)

(Some crimes against humanity are totally invisible!)

No wonder 1/3 of Americans are OBESE, 1/3 are OVER WEIGHT and the other third could be mistaken for Swedes ;-)

@pinkjess: Of course I wasn't saying that crime rates here in Sweden are lower in absolute numbers, that wouldn't make any sense whatsoever, of course I know that the whole of Sweden's population wouldn't sum up to even one of the bigger cities in the US... It's lower in relative numbers, but I thought that would go withouth saying... most people would actually get that when comparing Sweden with the US...

As to this case I'd like to read the full verdict before I say anything about it, I've read a lot about it, more than I think most of you have (and lot of the details in this short article is wrong, the victim never claimed to be in a relationship with the accused boy etc.) It's all very tragic, not that I'm saying that the accused shouldn't get punished - I do think they should. But it's very easy to call out for punishment and revenge. To go by some sort of "an eye for an eye" idea of punishment, to me that's just barbaric. How the US along with other nice and well renowned states such as China and Iran can still to this day and age practice death penalty, well frankly it sickens me. It's nothing but institutionalized murder.

And really, I do feel safer here in Sweden than in most places in the world, robbery, assault andr rapes are very rare, compared to most other places, so obviously something is working in this society. Don't fall to to the false lapse of thinking that severe punishment makes people refrain from comitting crimes, of course a crime is always comitted under the impression that the criminal won't get caught!! In this particular case it was logic that defied all normal sense of reasoning, some sort of follie-de-deaux that led to this very tragic ending. And that would have happened with or without capital punishment.

Blondie, the death penalty is not barbaric if there is DNA evidence to support the finding. Most states where the death penalty is legal it is seldom used. It is saved for extremely barbaric crimes and must go through mandatory multiple appeals before it is carried out. What would you say is appropriate punishment for a terrorist who killed 100+ people? Not life in prison because that would deprive him of his chance to be rehabilitated. Sweden actually has a fairly high incidence of rape (and notoriously does not punish it). Not everywhere, but in many US states if you try to rape a woman you will be shot to death by the gun in her purse. No court system or prison (Swedish translation: Rehabilitation Center) necessary.

Blondie,

I'm sorry but I totally disagree with you that its rare that rape and assaults happen in Sweden. Just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it doesn't happen. OK so you feel safe, but lets say you are out for a run and you are attacked and raped. Would you be ok that the person that did that to you would get basically no punishment??? you would have to life the rest of your life in fear. For example my husband was robbed 3 times on his way to the bus stop, First time he had a gun held to his head, second time a saw to his throat, third his laptop was stolen. That's just one person. And we live in Stockholm in a good area.

There DOES need to be harsher punishments. We aren't even talking about the death penalty, we are talking about protecting the good law abiding people of this country. If it was you or your friend or sister that was raped or murdered and the attacker got 90 days to 3 years in Swedish jail, witch is a nice little apartment with a tv and the right to go out and visit family for the holidays, I think you would be singing a different song. This isn't lala land, there are some sick people in the world that need to be put away, No therapy is change hard wired psychos.

I think people need to stick to the subject, this is not the blame game or my country is better than yours. We live in Sweden because its a great county and there are many wonderful things about it. But like another place in the world there are flaws and some of the laws could be better at protecting the good people of society. YES...All of this this stuff can happen anywhere, but I sure as hell would feel better knowing that if it happened to me, there would be some justice served.

If there is no harsh reaction when a human being takes another human being's life away, then life means nothing.

At 16, there are old enough to understand that there are consequences to their actions. However, if they don't understand that there are consequences to killing, then they still deserve to put kept away from the public.

I understand permissive societies, but there has got to be boundaries somewhere or all you get is anarchy.

How do you reform someone who kills a human being simply because it suits them to do so?

Who's to stay they won't do it again?

Who's responsible if and when they kill again?

I think there should be death sentence for murders (that are not accidental or on self defence) and for rapists, this way we would clean our societies from this genes. The boy is mentally weak and the girl is narcisistic. How could they not think about another solution than killing somebody? this genes shall not be passed!

I am the first to admit that in some cases punishment could be more harsh in this country, I've never said that I think 4 yrs of juvenile is just for murder (even though I think it's a good thing that the court takes into concideration the low ages of the accused) and when it comes to rape at the moment we have a big problem in getting the courts to use the whole scale instead of tilting to the milder end of it, but if you know anything about Swedish law you should know that the legislation recently was changed for rape and it may take a couple of rounds in the supreme court before it falls in to place. I do have confidence in the judicial system.

I stand by what I said before, capital punishment is below a society that has any claims to be civilized, even when it comes to "terrorists" or someone who murdered my own family. Human lifes has no prize and it can defenitely not be paid in more blood spilled.

Blondie you have the right to believe what you believe, but teh death penalty is a deterrent.

Hell watching the program scared straight was enough for me and hearing that 50% of all people in jail get raped?

My worst offense is crossing the street with a red light.

Punishment deters people.

Murder should get the minimum 25 yrs no early release or life imprisonment if you wll not go for the death penalty.

Even if the accused is young they should be in a juvnile center until 18 then serve the rest of the term in an adult center.

If at such an early age yuo are willing to kill someone for something trivial like a girlfriend or boyfriend? Nothing will really help.

Not everything is like the film "American History X"

If then death penalty deters ppl from comitting serious crimes; how come the US has so high crime rates? So many violent murders? According to your logic there should be hardly any...

If you give me an explanation to that I might start to think about it.

as someone said, a small percentage of prisoners in the US get assigned the death penalty, but they can exhaust the system for yrs and yrs often 10 to 20 yrs and then their sentence gets overturned to life in prison.

People see this and then decide who cares, I won't die.

I suspect that regardless of whether there is a death penalty or not there are some peole that are too far gone to care.

I believe percentage wise the US is pretty low for a country this size.

But if we are to believe this website thelocal. rapes and violent crimes are happening more and more often now in sweden.

And look at the joke terms rapists get a slap on the wrist to maybe 1 yr.

People look at the sentences in sweden and decide, that they only get 3 or 4 yrs for murder After good behavior they can leave in 1. WHy not commit violent crime?

I think most violent crimes that end up being carried out occur either: 1) in the heat of the moment, in which case there is no rational thought or concern about punishment, or 2) premeditated and planned, in which case the perpetrator understands the punishment implications but doesn't really believe they will be caught.

So harsh sentencing isn't always a deterrent in these situations, but I think it deters many who are 'considering' such crimes. And as someone pointed out earlier, recidivism rates (repeat offenders) alone can justify harsher sentences. Numerous studies in the US and Europe have shown violent criminals tend to repeat similar crimes 50%-65% of the time upon release from prison. So the longer they are incarcerated, the longer they are off our streets and can't repeat their crimes… makes sense to me.

I wonder how many of the people who support light sentencing and are concerned about the 'rights and rehabilitation' of these violent criminals have been themselves (or their families) a victim of violent crime? I'm guessing close to 0%.

Current Swedish sentencing guidelines are a disgrace and a joke. It's like this is the message being sent: To all you kids under 18 that need to exercise your urge to murder, get your murders in now so you only get 4 years… because after that you will get 6!!! (well, technically 10, but when is 10 really 10???)

I agree with one of the commenters that two kids are the product of society and their behavior reflects its ills. Violent films and violent wars make death look as a reflector of power and breavey.

Regardless, the two kids are bad products. If they are old enough to kill, they are old enough to receive a stiff sentence. They are lucky to go away with just four years of prison term after causing an imaginable grief to parents, relatives and friends.

The worst part of the crime was that it was premeditated!

Pussy ass sentence. Little unchallenged teens who probably became fascinated with the Twilight movie and in fact probably thought vampires were real. In America these two little devils wouldve gotten much harsher sentences but since this is pussy ass Sweden they will get a psych eval and placed in remedial math and writing class in nothing more than a schoolhouse

Before u say anything it is only recommended 4 yrs, but the judge could just send to to a SEMESTER!

I find it crazy that i Sverige och Norge du kan gör hemma for weekend furloughs if you are a murderer like the guy from Emperor, while if you are caught drunk driving you are never allowed to do this, and get stiffer sentences than murderers or rapists!

You cannot tell what the sentence is going to be - not yet

The 2 have been sent for pyschiatric evaluation - the girl was found to be suffering from a mental disorder at the initial paragraph 7 assesment

Psychiatric sentences are not time limited

PLEASEEEEEEE.... Sounds like an excuse for murder. Sounds like Sweden will let people get away with anything. Child molesters have mental disorders too should we let then run free in the streets. Of course something is wrong with these two teens, that doesn't mean they should not be punished, or get away with murder. I'm pretty sure they both have mental disorders, what teens doesn't frankly.

People in sweden know they can do whatever the hell they want because they wont have to pay any price, that is whats mental.

Sometime I cant believe its the year 2009 and people are still trying to justify indecent and in humane behavior its ridicules. BOTTOM line... If you murder someone in cold blood you deserve to face saver consequences . I'm sorry but 16 year olds know right from wrong, they know you don't kill people that's for sure. Not to mention if you are facing jail for a crime and your 16 I'm sure your feeling scared and will do anything to get out of it... and or can fake a disorder , I know people that have done it. They aren't stupid.

You can bet that they were high on drugs such as crystal meth or crack.

4 years? You Swedish people are such wimps! You don't know how to punish crime. Y'all are gonna have to get tough! In many places these "kids" would have been tried as adults and gotten the death penalty.