Reinfeldt rejects congressmen's plea to scold Aftonbladet

No Comment.

I think it is fun that the Swedes were/are so much more advanced than the Americans when it came to free speech!

America prides itself on the ideal of free speech being that the government cannot INTERFERE with the right of free speech. What Americans have NOT run into is the IDEA that that the government is forbidden to INTERFERE and ALSO forbidden to EVEN PASS JUDGMENT on free speech - "The fact that the political authorities may not pass judgment on freedom of the press and freedom of expression, is a linchpin of our country,"

It is funny that the Americans have to be taught what REALLY free speech means - "Reinfeldt defended his non-action by referring to Sweden's constitution and its free-speech traditions, admitting that they may be hard for others to appreciate."

I understand now that the government minister who denounced the mohamed pictures was actually fired for breaking this law by denouncing these pictures.

I will be real interested to see what the government does in the future when another mohamed type controversy occurs and the mosloms are rioting and killing because of some perceived injustice. The government can do nothing but bite its tongue.

Im sure the US would love to impose visa restrictions and trade embargos on sweden. What next ???

I know leave the swede in outer space until Reinfeldt denounce the article.

Wow.. omg.. The US has screwed up again! HA! Since I'm Swedish I couldn't be happier about this; they are morons! :D

Wo! Go Reinfeldt!

I still at a loss as to what "Yellow Journalism" has to do with free speech.

I think this refusal to censure is more of an Aryan Brotherhood thing more than anything else.

I guess Reinfeldt needs to kiss some M******m arse as well.

I always thought that freedom of speach comes with responsibilty not to use it to flame hate. The Swedes havs so much to learn from the Americans about what freedom of speach really is.

Doesn't Sweden have libel laws?

This has NOTHING to do with free speech, censorship or hate speech.

This is about condemning an obvious blood libel against the Jews. Thats it!

boby, you're the one who needs to learn what FREEDOM of speech is. Freedom you see, is freedom. Freedom is the opposite of restriction. "Freedom of speech" with restrictions is NOT freedom of speech, it is limitation of speech.

Reinfeldt sure as hell isn't kissing a§§, he is doing the only thing he legally can do.

@ bettan1

You're insane; I've had it with your crazy talk. I think I've read three or four of your comments and you scare me; if you were let into Sweden, give me a gun so I can shoot myself. I can't live with the embarrassment of knowing that things like you can get in with the other famine like the bugs on the picture somewhere to the right of my comment.

How can you possibly seriously actually bring up "Aryan"; do you think Obama is a Kenyan Nazi? That there is a god (HAHA)? Area 51? Ghosts? Get a grip, you're insulting and ridiculous and I won't stand for your BS anymore, it's time to fight back.

Please don't blame America for these two irresponsible congressmen. Congressmen Robert Wexler D-Florida and Elton Gallegy R-Simi Valley Calif. are from districts that are perceived to be heavily populated with retired jews. Israel is lobbying hard in these areas. There are 433 other members of Congress that didn't sign this ridiculous letter.

Wow! Sure hope these US congressmen ask that Nazi rendered images and racist comments on FOX NEWS be fined by the FCC for "fueling racists" views. Oh wait, only racism against Jews is worth their attention. Or is it that APAC has a bigger wallet to help in their re-elections.

I don't like the Swedish PM and I didn't like the way this story made Swedes look like racists either. However, it is absurd for them to pressure FREEDOM of speech on other counties when the Corporate Media of the USA has more rights than individuals. They should be more concerned with all the racist propaganda in the USA instead of what the hell other press agencies are printing.

Freedom of speech is a sacred concept.

However, 'innocent until proven guilty' is an even more sacred concept.

The media has the right, actually the obligation - to exercise its freedom of speech, in order to research, to ask difficult questions, to expose the real facts, and when enough facts are gathered - to accuse. The media is therefore rightfully considered the watchdog of democracy and freedom.

However, people must remember that freedom of speech can be abused, and therefore CANNOT be completely, absolutely, unconditionally boundless, without any responsibility whatsoever (as Leprechaun suggests).

Freedom of speech, is therefore not the freedom to promote heinous blood-libels, based on zero evidence and no proof whatsoever, with the sole intention of promoting hatred towards a certain group of people. This is NOT freedom of speech, this is freedom of blind hate and incitement.

As the most important concept in justice, is that everyone is innocent until proven guilty - freedom of speech should accommodate this sacred concept. When accusing someone of wrongdoing, the burden of proof is always upon the accuser, NOT the accused. Hence, when the media accuses, it must prove its accusations. It must provide concrete evidence. It must prove to the world that it did a thorough, serious research and found solid facts to support its accusation. This is all the more true, when the accusation is for something so vile and horrific as harvesting organs. Yet Aftonbladet did none of that. It just plainly accused, using hearsay, foggy speculations, only hearing one side, and making a completely unrelated connection with an American Jew who was arrested for trafficking organs (this man's only connection to the IDF was that he was Jewish...)

Aftonbladet did not follow the most basic rule in fair journalism: if you have no evidence, you cannot accuse!

Oddly though, the Swedish government, who is so keen on the preservation of freedom of speech, could not find its OWN freedom of speech to express its own opinion about Aftonbladet's libel. Note, that nobody asked the Swedish government to apologize for this article, remove it from the press, or shut down this tabloid. Only to DISTANCE itself from this story. This distancing, by no means would have compromised Sweden's freedom of speech. On the contrary - it would have added another view, further promoting freedom of speech.

On a final note - using the Swedish government's logic, the stories about Jews murdering Christian children to use their blood for making Passover bread - would undoubtedly, had been likewise qualified as "freedom of speech".

Nice rant Hagrid, but the story is based on facts. And it doesn't help your rant when a NY rabbi got arrested for organ trafficking between Israel and the U.S. this July.

http://www.theweek.com/article/index/98972/Rabbis_and_organ_trafficking

"rant", heh?

I must say, it's really amusing when someone who clearly does not have the capacity to counter my thorough, lucid arguments with valid arguments of his own, resorts to the easy way of reducing my points into a "rant"... But I really can't blame you, "crunchy2k" for responding the way you did. After all, giving me a serious response requires an intellectual merit which apparently you and your hateful ilk here lack, and more importantly - the facts are against you anyway, and deep down you know it. Or maybe you're too thick to realize that...

"The story is based on facts"? What facts? For a whole month, I've been eager to hear these "facts"! Then how come they've never been published? Hmmm... Maybe it was because Jan Helin himself, the editor of Aftonbladet, admitted he had no facts to support this story?... So if I were you, I'd get my facts together before writing rubbish, it only makes you look sillier.

As for the story about the NY Rabbi, if you so insist on developing it - I have no problem with that at all, as it actually only serves to strengthen my point. You see, this Rabbi had absolutely no connection to Israel, and most certainly not to the Israel Defense Forces. The only 'connection' is that he was Jewish. This fine distinction, of course, is lost by all those Jewhating readers of Aftonbladet, for whom, "all Jews are the same". So, by making this bizarre connection, Daniel Bostrom knew that he would strengthen his libelous story. After all, if the readers read about a Jewish criminal in one place of the world, then that serves as 'proof' that Jews in another part of the world are also criminals... After all, all Jews are the same, right?

So as I was saying, this connection only proves the extent to which Aftonbladet was willing to go, to spew out its hatred. Q.E.D.

You should have read the story I posted. It was two Rabbis and 40 other individuals involved in the international trafficking of organs. These guys paying off some American politicians is one reason they got caught. How many Israeli politicians were on their payroll? Right now we know Israeli doctors are involved, some of donors were flown into Israel to have their organs removed, and the donors received a pittance of what these guys were paid for the organs.

Aftonbladet just touched on the tip of the iceberg. Read more here: http://tinyurl.com/lu34fm In the coming year, I hope Israel cooperates in the "Jewish Kidney Mafia" trials.

oh. Im sick of all these Jewish defence mechanisms as soon as anyone feels they are going back to the holocaust. I mean really, sort out the situation with Palestine, go back to agreed borders, stop being paranoid about everyone else being out to get you and start having a life. ie. enjoy yourselves for once. ok?

You want other people to respect your culture? Start respecting theirs too.

@ Hagrid

My first expression: ARGH!

I don't where to start; so I'll make a list like usual and take them from top to bottom. Btw, yes, that is rant.

1. I have never suggested such a thing; I said that it is illegal for the government to in any way criticize the media.

2. Freedom of speech is saying whatever the hell you want (and that's not how it works in any country) and not in any way what you're describing. What you're talking about is limitation of speech no matter how much you try to make the limitations sound pathetically small. What i mean is that you can't say that "freedom of speech is not to" - say certain things, good or bad, because that would be limitation, not freedom.

3. Have you actually read the article?! Wow.. ehm.. 3.1. You're talking about newspapers, not courts .

3.2. No Aftonbladet didn't prove that, and they didn't accuse either, they quoted what the family believed had happened.

3.3. "It just plainly" never did: accuse, use hearsay, foggy speculations, only listen to one side or make a completely unrelated connection with an American Jew.

I have already gone over the accusation bit; "hearsay"? They quoted the family..

"Foggy speculations".. oh yeah right.. foggy! HA! Let's see:

An unarmed teenager who wasn't a threat was murdered/executed (the IDF has confessed) and then comepletely unnecessarily an autopsy was performed on him (don't tell me that the IDF did that because it cares about Palestinians) and later he was buried during night by military escort. Do you know what ONE kidney is worth? 160 000 USD. You're ultra nationalistic racist party is your third biggest; meaning many supporters, probably especially in the army. Meaning many racists who hates Palestinians and he was executed even though he was unarmed. Just what the hell is foggy about that?!

4. Well they didn't accuse. The family did but that's something else.

5. The government has no freedom of speech.

6. It wasn't a libel.

7. By distancing themselves (which is illegal) you really mean.. eh.. I've forgotten the word.. but to basically saying that the article was wrong and hideous. And now comes the scary part; "This distancing, by no means would have compromised Sweden's freedom of speech. On the contrary - it would have added another view, further promoting freedom of speech."

No. Are you drunk? High? If the government denounces an article it has taken a stance about it, that is illegal, and if the government says what it thinks the papers should and shouldn't do that's an attempt at(it doesn't matter if the intention is good or bad, it still is:) limiting speech.

8. Yes and no and no. When you talk about Jews then you're talking about a minority and that's not something the press would write anyway (the things you said). If you talk like that about a minority it's illegal. The government would talk about it anyway, it is none of their business, the police would handle it.

I don't like it when these things blow up into "USA vs Sweden" mentalities. Sweden and USA both have strong free speech traditions. In this case, it would seem that the free speech of politicans is censured in Sweden, whereas in the U.S. these Congressmen are exercising their own right to free speech, and they are also representing their own constituents' wishes. Their just doing their job in a democracy with free speech. They do not represent the entire American people. I'm sick of people using this to hate on the USA, when in reality, there isn't all that much difference between the USA and Sweden really. In another section of this site Kaethar mistakenly included the USA in a list of countries with "patriotic laws", where you can be prosecuted for insulting the nation... that is false, there is no such US equivalent to the Turkish law criminalizing "insulting Turkishness". Some of the comments in this article make blanket statements about the US that just aren't true, just because of two Congressmen who have the right to say whatever they want. I just don't want everyone outside the U.S. to think that they represent me, or even the American government. They represent their own small jurisdictions. There are a lot of misunderstandings about the American government from people in centrally-governed nations like Sweden. I love both countries, so it's disheartening to see how quickly people start bashing the U.S. and praising Sweden... both are Western Democracies speaking related languages with a relatively similar culture (from a global perspective) with strong free speech traditions.

Freedom of speech exists for a very select few in Sweden. This article from 2006 still holds true.

"While Sweden Slept"

http://www.nysun.com/opinion/while-sweden-slept/44831/

Wow Unkle Strunkie

I think that link hit the nail on the head. Interestingly one can comb through the archives of "TheLocal" and verify much of what was said in that article. I've pointed out articles in this online news venue many times and die-hard with a vengeance Swedes call "TheLocal" nothing but a tabloid rag. It's one of the first things I noticed when I got here. That constant indoctrination of government thinking for your own good and millions of poor saps licking it up.

Man's inhumanity to man is not restricted to any one or group of particular countries. It's every country in it's own way even if it's citizens consider it's own frangance to be roses when it's nation takes a dump.

Crunchy2k, what tip of what iceberg? The Aftonbladet story is completely fabricated. Jan Helin himself admitted he had no evidence. By the way, I have read your link, even though I was familiar with this story already. And you know what? It proves nothing relevant to the Aftonbladet story, only that a few Jews in America practiced illegal organ trade. The connection Boström made between that, and the IDF supposedly harvesting organs, was completely artificial and unmerited; the connection was only because of the Jewish factor, and nothing else - as I said earlier, Jewhating readers would naturally view this story about American rabbis, as 'strengthening' the accusations about the IDF. After all, Jewhaters would reason - if a few Jews in one part of the world are criminals, then other Jews in other parts must be too... They must have this worldwide Jewish conspiracy of theft and deception... This is a classic, age-old libel which sadly, many Swedes including yourself believe in. Daniel Boström certainly knew what he was doing!

gofojo - I can only assume you are referring to me. Well first, I'm not a part of any 'Jewish defence mechanism', I'm not even Jewish - I am a Swede currently living in Israel, and quite disgusted by what I see from my former country (though not surprised). Second, your post makes absolutely no sense. Where exactly have I touched upon the holocaust? You must have imagined it. Third, there is nothing 'paranoid' about responding to horrid accusations, it is only fair. Freedom of speech goes both ways you know. And you would want to clear your name too, when unjustly accused of something horrible. Fourth, that part of wanting to respect my culture - where have I said anything like that? And where have I not respected other cultures? Again you must be imagining.

Leprechaun - looks like you and I have some very serious differnce of opinions. I have strong disagreement with most of what you said, though I'll give you the credit of answering me thoroughly, unlike others here. I will try to answer your points later when I have the time.

@hagrid

It seems that you have fallen prey to the Israeli Govt. controlled press. Any slight suggestion that the IDF or any Israeli politician is involved in something that is wrong brings out the 'anti-Semitic' card. Any perceived slight brings out a verbal torrent of attack rather than analysis. Recently the Israeli government attacked a UN report that criticized the actions of the IDF during the Gaza conflict as 'one sided' when they had refused to take part in the investigation. The only freedom of speech in Israel under the present regime is the freedom to blast any perceived criticism of Israel

i believe in freedom of speech but i do think the paper can be held libel for bad reporting if they did that, i don't know if they are wrong or right but i do know that there is a big organ trafficing coming out of Isreal, who doing it good guess. But freedom of speech in sweden is a joke, just remember the kid in solna that call the police a pig and got a fine while its ok for the police in malmo to make racist remarks, freedom of speech is very selective here in sweden

This is bigotry masquerading as political correctness.

Prime Minister Fredrik Reinfeldt can not have his cake and eat it on this one.

If it is acceptable to attack Jews, it is acceptable to attack muslims and other groups. If it is not acceptable to attack muslims and other groups, then it should not be acceptable to attack jews.

If Sweden has free speech, then why are there no Mohammed Cartoons in every newspaper and posted as posters on every street corner?

Because the Muslims issue death threats. Anybody remember the Lars Vilks cartoons?

Great link unkle strunkle. Just like to add that good old Reinny and DamnImmigrant are hiding behind the constitution. If they truly believed in it, they'd be consistent across the board. Here would be some good test cases:

-Have every Svenska Kyrka preach next Sunday on the "evils of homosexuality"

-Something tamer, simply publish an article stating being gay is a choice and therefore should not be given the same rights as heterosexuals.

-As Nemisis states, publish some Mohammad cartoons on the front page of Aftonbladet.

-Run an article making the claim that physical and emotional differences between men and women make women incapable of performing well in the military

-Deny the holocaust (wait, that one might fly)

-Print findings and claim them as fact that Climate Change is solely based on Sun Spot activity that we cannot control.

Not agreeing to any of these (seriously, no hate-mail), just stating that the backlash from the current leadership would be enormous and the hypocrites posting here would see how much Sweden really believes in "freedom of speech". The US, Sweden, and most western countries that tout freedom of speech are fallible on this issue. Don't for a second think that this place has got it all right.

The Iranian President (Ahamdy Nejad) is right about Jews. In every matter of the world these Jews would bring holocaust and anti semitic shits in order to justify their crime against humanity.

I guess these US congressmen needs to mind their own business.

Gwrhyr

I agree with you 100%.

Especially here

"There are a lot of misunderstandings about the American government from people in centrally-governed nations like Sweden. I love both countries, so it's disheartening to see how quickly people start bashing the U.S. and praising Sweden... both are Western Democracies speaking related languages with a relatively similar culture (from a global perspective) with strong free speech traditions."

Addressing Leprechaun's points.

"it is illegal for the government to in any way criticize the media"

"If the government denounces an article it has taken a stance about it, that is illegal ... it still is limiting speech"

"The government has no freedom of speech"

- Of course it does. No one asked the government to control, restrict or silence the media. Only offer its own perspective, on critical issues. You must have balance: when the government controls the media completely, this is totalitarianism. However, when the media has unlimited power to publish any wild lie that it wants, and the government has no power to do anything about it, not even voice reservation - this is anarchy. I'm proud of Sweden being a very liberal country, however this does not mean throwing responsibility out the window.

To quote prominent Swedish experts:

Thorbjörn Larsson, Dagens Nyheter editor: Ministers do have freedom of speech to react to the media - Olof Palme's reaction to Raineraffären is a good example.

Mårten Schultz, jurisprudence lecturer: appeals to freedom of speech are "attempts to use the rhetorically convincing status of the freedom of expression and press legislation in order to pursue a political agenda"

Councellor of Justice, Göran Lambertz: "It is not completely clear where the limits are. There is rather a lot one may do, according to the constitution, even if it were to be regarded as politically and legally inappropriate."

Peter Luthersson, editor of culture in Svenska Dagbladet: "this is a total misinterpretation of freedom of expression"

"Freedom of speech is saying whatever the hell you want ... you cant say that freedom of speech is not to say certain things, good or bad, because that would be limitation, not freedom"

- You're mistaken my friend. I've addressed this point perfectly in my first post, and would not repeat myself.

"You're talking about newspapers, not courts"

- Media has responsibility too. Words of incitement create a negative atmosphere, and provide legitimacy to hatred and violence.

"Aftonbladet didnt accuse, they quoted what the family believed had happened"

- While running a huge headline: "Våra söner plundras på sina organ!" That's very much accusing and inciting.

"comepletely unnecessarily an autopsy was performed"

- Really? Are you a doctor to determine what happened? Were you there?

"Do you know what ONE kidney is worth? 160 000 USD"

- Do you know what a kidney from a DEAD person is worth? 0 USD!

"You're ultra nationalistic racist party is your third biggest; meaning many supporters, probably especially in the army. Meaning many racists who hates Palestinians…"

- WOW. Talk about wild and baseless conspiracy accusations, based on blind prejudice. You've even outdone Daniel Boström here...

Hagrid, the more you rant, the more evidence I find that supports the original story. This Israeli organ trade goes back thirty years. The two NY rabbis had been doing it for at ten years according the evidence collected so far.

Israel ex-IDF officer arrested in organ trafficking. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0YU...4/ai_n17208591/

A retired Israeli 29 year old army officer under arrest on suspicion of participating in an international organ trafficking scheme testified before a Brazilian court that the Israeli government financed organ transplants, the daily O Globo reported.

n South Africa, where the transplants were performed, police arrested an elderly physician and a regional transplant coordinator for a private hospital group for their involvement in the Israeli-led organ trafficking ring that was uncovered last December. The scheme involved donors from Brazil, and transplants performed in South Africa for patients from a variety of countries. (Transplant News, December 15, 2003) http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0YU...4/ai_n17208591/

An Israeli doctor was arrested in the Ukranine for organ trafficking. http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3769748,00.html.

The Zis case dates back to 2007, when Israeli authorities tried and convicted two residents of Haifa, Muhammad Taha Jat, also knows as John Allen, and Hassan Zahalka, for soliciting four people to illegally donate their kidneys for a NIS 7,000 payment (about $1,800).

The two targeted people from a low socioeconomic background, manipulated them into the procedure and arranged for them to fly to Ukraine, where Zis operated on them for a fee of about $125,000. Upon returning to Israel, the four discovered that they were swindled.

Organ Trafficking in Eastern Europe http://samvak.tripod.com/brief-organ01.html

National health insurance schemes turn a blind eye. Israel's participates in the costs of purchasing organs abroad, though only subject to rigorous vetting of the sources of the donation. Still, a May 2001 article in a the New York Times Magazine, quotes "the coordinator of kidney transplantation at Hadassah University Hospital in Jerusalem (as saying that) 60 of the 244 patients currently receiving post-transplant care purchased their new kidney from a stranger - just short of 25 percent of the patients at one of Israel's largest medical centers participating in the organ business".

Many Israelis - attempting to avoid scrutiny - travel to east Europe, accompanied by Israeli doctors, to perform the transplantation surgery. These junkets are euphemistically known as "transplant tourism". Clinics have sprouted all over the benighted region. Israeli doctors have recently visited impoverished Macedonia, Bulgaria, Kosovo and Yugoslavia to discuss with local businessmen and doctors the setting up of kidney transplant clinics.

Hagrid.

You write: "Do you know what a kidney from a DEAD person is worth? 0 USD!"

Fact 1.

Bilal Almad Ghanem was NOT dead when he was taken by helicopter.

Secondly this whole discussion I think concerning live or dead organ theft is a red herring.

Fact 2: A Prof. Yehuda Hiss has confessed to harvesting organs from dead persons for research purposes in 2002.

I suggest the following article for a fair and informed discussion of this situation.

http://www.redress.cc/palestine/jcook20090905

We all know that the zionists control a great part of the congress. Everyone knows it.

I am happy to see that the zionists are not controlling Sweden.

Crunchy2k,

The more you flood me with unrelated stories you googled from all over the net, the weaker your argument becomes. Fact is, none of what you listed here, "supports the original story" from Aftonbladet, being that IDF deliberately kills Palestinians to harvest their organs. When Aftonbladet makes such grave and horrid accusation, it must present clear and solid evidence for it, otherwise it's libel. Unrelated stories whose only connection is the 'Jewish factor', are hardly such evidence. So, you found a few cases involving Jews and organ theft (as if that doesn't happen with non-Jews). How does that prove Aftonbladet's story? By mathematical induction perhaps? ;) Heck, even Jan Helin himself, admitted he had no evidence to support his story!

Sorry about the 'rant' btw. I know that reading well-reasoned and well-supported arguments which conflict with your baseless, biased theories is not pleasant. So, I'll be nice and accomodating with you, and will not comment anymore to show the absurdity of your claims.

mysticbumwipe,

Your fact 1 was never established. He was dead, and if you don't believe me you can read in great detail, in the link provided above, "Israel organ harvesting scandal 'medically impossible'".

As for fact 2, I've just addressed this issue to crunchy2k.

Thank you for the url mysticbumwipe. It just puts what I've been finding in the popular press together. Israel has a serious problem that dates back decades and is still ongoing.

The problem I find when writing comments on this subject is that the Israeli/Zionist Lobby immediately cry's anti-Semite, Arab Lover, Terrorist. They are never ever accept that there could be any truth in any allegation against Israel. The questioner is attacked and vilified

You hear the same thing over and over again - "The IDF are saints. Believe me. We do not need an investigation. We have had an internal investigation. All our politicians are honest men. ( well maybe not Olmert)"

This form of protest of innocence, leads people with a more open mindset to think of the Shakespearian quote " Me thinkest that the gentleman protesteth to much"

Normally I'd be all for Reinfeldt's response under the auspices of Free Speech.

Buuuuuuuttt.. It's all to clear that in light of the recent Mohammed cartoons, the goverment is playing the "selective high roader" when it comes to defending such rights.

Traditional Sweden has been lost to a dangerous brew of anti-semetism, nazism, and unchecked immigration policy. Add a dash of the stoic, normally reserved, but progressively liberal swede only hypocrisy could possibly ensure hereforth.

Oh for crying out loud! Just when I thought the cartoon story was gonna be left out.. sigh.

It was illegal for the government to do what they did with the cartoons and the minister who was responsible for that lost her job quite fast.

Anti-semitism? Most Swedes don't even know.. or at least didn't know what that meant until this BS started. NO ONE CARES ABOUT ISRAEL. It's impossible for us to be anti-semitic; Israel is as interesting to talk about (good or bad) as talking about.. wow it really isn't interesting, is it? Moldavia? It's not worth talking about unless you're in primary school (part of the WW2 education).

If anyone cares about how Swedes sees Israel then here it comes:

It is one of "those" countries, a bad one, who's religious, nationalistic, fantical and corrupt government and army kills a lot of innocent people, including children, using illegal weapons like cluster bombs and white phosphorus; bombing UN buildings and crap like that. It's a religious country (that's a bad thing, the worst religions in the world, starting with the worst according to any Swede you'll ever meet: Islam, Christianity (catholic) (though most Swedes would just say Christianity), Judaism, Christianity (protestant/lutheran) (most Swedes would just have included this with catholic Christianity if that was obvious before), Hinduism and on last place Buddhism (not a bad one, but it is still fictional (according to atheist Swedes)).

Think what you will of that but those are very very common beliefs here and in our neighboring countries.

@ Hagrid

I have no idea where I stand anymore.. why can't anything be simple? Does anyone know how famous this story is in Israel and/or what the public opinion (meaning not the opinion of the far right)?

The newspaper Aftonbladet reported today that IDF has murdered Karlson (who lives on the roof) and sold his organs to helicopter manufacturers.

Cluster bombs work great, why wouldn't you use them?

@ Leprechaun

Of course we all wish things to be simple. But the world has other plans. You asked about public opinion in Israel, since I'm living there now I can tell this story was perceived very badly. At first for the actual story but then even more so for the government's silence. The feeling is that Swedes are antisemites and hypocrites (for believing only the Arabs and always only singling Israel out as the 'bad guys'). They tend to be dramatic but even they know they're exagerating sometimes, and laugh about themselves for that... My Israeli girlfriend thought similarly about Sweden but I convinced her we are not all like that. Things here are not as bad as you paint them, well maybe it's as bad as you say, but I wouldn't know. For me at least everything is normal and cool. People here may dislike 'Sweden' as some distant country but they actually are very friendly and open with me and other Swedes and love to talk with us a lot.

Sebseb stated: "We all know that the zionists control a great part of the congress. Everyone knows it.

Wow, Sebseb, I see you are still speaking for "all" again. Who are you talking about when you said "we"? Are you talking about yor boyfriend? Oh, yes, I forgot about your "Everyone" knows it.

You are right (I hate to admit it) when you stated "I am happy to see that the zionists are not controlling Sweden." Sweden's problem is Islam and Islam controls Sweden.

My friend, I like you. Why? Because you are funny!

Are "all" Swedish people of your caliber? Your mental capacities and moral qualities are the "benchmarks" for the other Swedish people. When I make this statement about you, I say it with authority because "we" all know about you.

I don't need proof to say such things because my right to freedom of speech is far more important than your rights.

Mate, be a nice guy and tell your boyfriend hi, for me. You two make a great, same-sex couple.

Adios, boy!

The point is that the Swedes don't publish the truth. They publish want potentially racist people want to read instead. Directed lies, if left to the Swedish press and government, goes unchallenged and poisons the pot. But it is the Swedish press that suffers the most. They cannot be believed unless a real press confirms. In an article last week, the press had an article about a 'green dildo.' If the Swedish press covered it, how do we know they didn't misrepresent it. It could be a red dildo, a pink dildo, a yellow dildo, or it may be the dildo the Swedish "journalists' shove up their environmentally unfriendly asses while contemplating new lies to write.

@oldesign@Moshe

I sauppose that directed lies and racism is only in relation to Israelis/Jews. Anything detrimental said against Arabs/Muslims comes under freedom of speach

Moshe,

you make my point. You have no argument against me. You turn into personal attacks calling me gay. You wish Sweden was rules by Muslims. The reality is that I live in Sweden and I see it is not ruled by Muslim. Sweden is secularized.

Yes, I am gay. Do you have a problem with it? Do you mind if I cuddle myself looking at photo of rabbis?

sebseb

Moshe is most probably a member of the same ultra-orthodox sect as the guy who shot and killed people in a gay bar in Telaviv

Sebseb, you stated:

"You turn into personal attacks calling me gay."

Unlike Aftonbladet, I apolize for my statements towards you. I used my "rights to fre speech" to make statements that I couldn't prove and you didn't like it. You in turn, just like a lot of people, responded.

Freedom of Speech doesn't let you, me, or anyone to tell falsehoods about others. I going to use a word that you like to use and it is "we". No, "we" Jewish, just like Swedish people, don't like to be offended by lies.

As to rabbis, I think you would probally prefer Catholic priests. I hear they like boys but I can't prove it and don't want to prove it because I don't know that "all" priests like to cuddle with boys. Don't get homophobic, I am not your judge nor am I going to judge you.

If a Swedish Christian pastor cannot express himself by proclaiming that the homosexual lifestyle is wrong without being prosecuted, then none of you Swedes have freedom of speech or expression.

After that UN speech of our Prime Minister of Sweden cum presidency of the European Union our country's image abroad (outside of Israel) is at the very top and this is how we view the world:

http://www.un.org/ga/64/generaldebate/SE.shtml

The Constitution, the holy and inviolable Swedish Constitution which cannot be tampered with but I suppose that under certain circumstances it be drastically amended, perhaps, just in order to accommodate - and legalise government intervention and thus set a precedent for future blood libel law violators? That seems the only way to go beyond the present impasse.

Otherwise, it seems that even after the Prime Minister and the Foreign Minister have said their last word, this matter will never be finally laid to rest. So where do we go from here except to remonstrate some more and to continue to reiterate that when something isn't right, it's wrong. To date, this is perhaps the most potent / outraged opinion yet, recording some more fallout from no less than the Wall Street Journal:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204731804574388592530138718.html

It's uncertain as to what extent this observation holds true for Sweden and whether we should thank our lucky stars that it's the Conservative Alliance and not a coalition of the Left that's in power - as has been observed in an Israpundit article entitled "European Left More Dangerous for Jews than European Right":

Free speach my furry front bottom! You can say and do what you want as long as you dont talk out against the system, which as everyone knows is perfection incarnate.

Hej, Moshe, I know you are still here. I've got work for you:

78% of Canadians believe that Israel is in real danger of being dominated by fundamentalists

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/globe-online-poll/article1302486/

Go on the Globe and Mail and call Canadians antisemite. Don't forget to bring all your zionist friends from the Local

To sebseb:

That poll only means that there at least 7000 muslims in Canada, which is true, of course.

Sebseb,

Does it matter awfully what - according to South Africa's Mail & Guardian, 78% of Canadians think about the fun-da-mental-isms in Israel?

We ought to be a little extra careful - and sensitive - about bandying about terms like racist, anti-Semite, fundamentalist, Orthodox, etc as if there is no substance to the definition of those prejudicial terms. The post-apartheid Mail & Guardian has its own standards to maintain and some of the white folk are now complaining about being on the receiving end of the humpa policeman's bleeding batons (whilst some black folks are derisive and smiling about pay-back time. This fear of payback time was a main reason for many guilty and not guilty white folks emigrating to Europe, Canada and Australia before black power took over. But thanks to Madiba Nelson Mandela - that sort of bloodshed never took place.

Still on the diplomatic front - and as you know diplomats - with not only Carl Bildt as doyen and role model in the Swedish club, tend to measure their words carefully. As the saying goes, "He who feels it knows" and luckily for you and Moshe, we don't have to go to Canada or to South Africa to get it from the horse's mouth.

Here is Israel's former ambassador to Sweden blowing his mind about the matter:

http://www.jcpa.org/JCPA/Templates/ShowPage.asp?DBID=1&LNGID=1&TMID=111&FID=382&PID=471&IID=1609

I should like to point out that it is in no way my intention to open up a new front in the diplomatic storm which we somehow insist we must prolong by still talking about the blood libel scandal. My only purpose in posting this link is so that we can take a critical look at ourselves - when we stand accused - substantively accused - and if what Mr. Zvi Mazel says is all true, then, in my opinion we simply have to make amends and try to improve relations with each other. The question is, who is it amongst us that would like to object to the idea of improving relations, apart from the confirmed and unrepentant anti-Semites?

The horrendous crime of Israeli soldiers who brutally killed Karlsson-on-the-roof and sold his organs to helicopter manufacturers for 30 silver shekels (see a recent article in Aftonbladet) has not been appropriately condemned by the Swedish public yet. Why?

"Well the pressure's down, the boss ain't here

He gone North, for a while

They say that vanity got the best of him

But he sure left here in style"

Some more blah blah from me:

Freedom of expression can sometimes be a little obtuse; perhaps, you mean that the horrendous crime of the Roman soldiers has not yet been appropriately condemned by the Swedish public? Well the Romans were not Jews you know and that's why.

Their Silence apparently means consent, what else? However, it cannot mean that, cannot mean approval, since no crucifixion = no blood= no Salvation.

Anti-Semitic wishful thinking, morbid & bloody hypothetical fantasies and human sacrifice aside, exactly what's being talked about here as daylight fact?

Karlsson taking his pocket toy helicopter to speak to Titityo's man on the moon and back?

What's that? And which human organs are you playing lots with here?

Any way you look at it, isn't the 30 shekels or pieces of silver story the mother of all blood libels - all else being but variations of the same ancient blood theme, although this is the big one, about Jesus (after Joseph) being sold - this time by his most beloved disciple, according to Robert Graves's "King Jesus" or was Judas only the weakest link in that famous twelve

( 12 representing organization) and the twelve disciples - including Peter the Rock - a spiritual ancestor of our present Pope also equally deserted him and denied him after he was arrested - and as both you and he know so well it was the cockcrow that confirmed this knowledge which dawned on him, there and then.

Balance:

http://www.shaykhabdalqadir.com/content/articles/Art093_11052009.html

The Twelve like Jesus were all Jews… unlike Cornelius, who was the first goy to be admitted into the company of the little Jewish breakaway sect - according to the Gospels……..and didn't Jesus say "Thy will be done?"

What did he mean and what could he have meant by that?

Isaiah 53 refers to a people, a nation (Israel)…..

Ahmed Deedat was taunted by a priest, " And where was Allah when Prophet Muhammad's grandson Hussein - alaihi salaam - was being slaughtered in Karbala? What did Allah have to say about that? "

Deedat replied, " Allah cried. He said, "I was not able to save My own Son from the cross and you have the audacity to be asking me about Prophet Muhammad Salallahhu alaihi wa salaam's grandson?"

Well. Islam says that Jesus was not crucified.

It makes a man, any man think about this:

http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=A0geutl8BsVK2AoBwF9XNyoA?p=The+Holocaust

Cornelius Hamelberg: I do not have time to read your whole text - too many letters, but I must assure you that Karlsson's propeller is (was) not a toy. Imagine that the helicopter made of Karlsson's parts is used to kill innocent people (women and children, yes - imagine crying babies!) in Gaza, Iraq or Afghanistan. I think all honest Swedes must unite in expressing their outrage and disgust.

Markvs,

Please read all the letters here, care-fully:

http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/Terrorism-+Obstacle+to+Peace/Hamas+war+against+Israel/Israel_analysis_comments_Goldstone_Mission_15-Sep-2009.htm

Yes, all sentient being s are very concerned about the on-going carnage in Afghanistan (about to be increased after the Afghan winter) and what was in Iraq and Gaza is still under scrutiny (yes also I read the Palestine Chronicle regularly and recall images of the Apache helicopter from which Sheikh Yassin was gunned down on his way to do his morning prayers)

And Yes I'm familiar with Karlsson in Vasastan etc but you are still being a little too obtuse with your chosen fancy metaphor with which you only further obfuscate matters and so I have to ask you, who is Karlsson, Dr. Watson?

Cornelius Hamelberg: Karlsson was (alas!) the most famous citizen of Sweden, possibly after ABBA (look for Karlsson-on-the-roof in Google). He has been brutally murdered by Israeli soldiers, according to Aftonbladet, and his organs were sold to helicopter manufactures. Now the global imperialistic/Zionist war machine uses the helicopters, to kill innocents worldwide. I just cannot comprehend how can honest Swedes sit silently in their homes. Where are the demonstrations of angry Swedes?

markvs,

SWEDEN is a GREAT COUNTRY and I'm done with the scold- Aftonbaldet-for-it's-freedom-of-speech-discussion. Aftonbladet is not Amalek not are the Swedish people.

All said and done, you may like it or you may like it not, but

European Union president Frederick Rheinfeldt must be very happy this Sabbath because as the Irish Prime Minister remarked,

" It's a good day for Ireland and for Europe"

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8288181.stm

Cornelius Hamelberg: Of course, Sweden is a great country. And I am happy to say that "Aftonbladet" just pubished a report that tomorrow there will be a demonstration against the horrendous crime committed by the IDF. The demonstration will start at the Stockholm headquarters of Aftonbladet. Come at 10 a.m., you will see many people with pictures of late Karlsson-on-the-roof. Join them. Bring slogans like "We are all Karlssons-on-the-roof now", and "Jews: why did you crucify our Karlsson?". Also bring slogans from the previous demonstrations, such as "Hisbollah - blah,blah,blah!", and "Hamas! Was ist das?".

You may chew on this as food for thought , today, tomrrow or whenever you're hungry:

http://www.freedomhouse.org/uploads/fop/2009/FreedomofthePress2009_tables.pdf

The food is a little rotten. For example, Island is no 1. But everybody knows that there is simply no press in Island! It is too cold there. Also Denmark is very high on the list. But remember what they did with Hamlet and with poor Yorick! I think you have to protest this rotten report by the so called "Freedom House".

Mark V.S Karlsson of "WE are all Karlssons" (just when I thought that you were all-Svensson)

Iceland was also at the top of the ladder just before the big crisis and financial meltdown. Great Sweden did some bailing out of the Scandinavian sister-dotter:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index

What yer saying now? Yer mean to impute that there is something rotten or rotting in the state of Denmark, just because it's not as cold as Iceland? That they don't have refrigerators to keep things frozen fresh and safe from rotting & getting rotten, even in Greenland?

Yer must be kidding!

If you're still not satisfied with the rankings, then chew on this:

http://www.rsf.org/-Anglais-.html

And if your still not satisfied you may suggest your own rankings and hopefully keep us all mesmerised in agreement with you if not wholly hypnotised

by YOU - I mean your disgruntled self.

This is a popular curse which I wish you not: May you never be satisfied