Sweden fares badly in global economic report

Import stuff from UK. Their currency went down more than the Krona did.

That's how you counter the loss of purchasing power of the Krona.

Sorry to disappoint TL readers, but this economy is headed for a collapse. Not a question of "if," rather it is one of "when." Socialism didn't work very well in the former Soviet Union - despite the fact that they had a massive labor force, plentiful natural resources, and a reason to innovate (at least militarily - from which we all know many other technologies emanate). What accelerated the Soviet collapse was the notion of central planning and a foe who was willing to spend them into the dirt.

The case of Sweden is different, of course, but the Churchill quote holds true - the promise of socialism is one of everyone sharing equally in misery. Lets look at Sweden in a snapshot (tough to do, but I'll do it anyway)- relatively tiny labor force, scant natural resources, a broken healthcare system where it takes months to get an MRI (unless you "pay-to-play" - a third-world system in disguise), staggering taxation feeding an appallingly inefficient bureaucracy, a minusule commercial market (made smaller by the depleted disposable income of its citizenry), stagnant motivation (why work hard if everyone ends up at the same place anyway?!), and eventually death to creative thought and technological advance.

Think about these words. How do you say "e-mail" in Svenska? E-mail. How do you say "internet" in Swenska? Internet. Ho do you say FaceBook, Google, iPod Twitter, CNN, modular reactor in Swedish? These things may be no big deal, but it is hard to ignore the fact that the Swedish technology diaspora is dead. Certainly the country has more to offer than "Ombudsman", "Smorgasbord," Saab, Volvo, and Ikea. Sure it's a small population, but we're highly educated, healthy, and Earth-conscious. We should expect more from ourselves. ABBA, minimalist design, and Absolut vodka are all wonderful things for which to be known - especially when combined!

And now I just read that Apple Computers (those California dreamers who brought you the MacBook, iPod, IIGS, and now the iPad (hmmmm..question the name on that one) have now skated past Ericsson in the mobile phone market. After the Saab and Volvo fiascos have we nothing left?! We used to be able to claim lifestyle as our real treasure, but as I started this email, that is now on a slow (hopefully) skid to mediocrity.

Signed,

Gravely Concerned

maybe Sweden's gonna be one of the first country to be kicked out of the OECD

@ CardinalRuler

With an attitude like yours mediocrity will be the only thing you have to look forward to.

A lot of life is what you make it.

if you want something better for Sverige, get of your lazy ass and do something positive, instead of looking for things to moan about.

Get away from your computer which you use to moan and whinge. Looks for ways to make things better, not moan about things that might have been years ago.

Invent something, create something, think outside the box.

Oh, but this is good news for all those who so enjoy "bad news", isn't it CardinalRuler?

Of course, if you want to create a report based on ONE specific measurement it is always possible to create a discouraging conclusion and .personalised 'snapshots' are usually focused on the political point of the camera operator.

Looking at other reports gives a rather different overview: Motormannen's table of bensin price (Jan 2010),for example, shows Sweden as one of the cheapest in Europe: EPI (environmental performance index from Yale/Columbia Universities) shows Sweden 4th from the top of 163 countries. Independent European electricity price comparisons (including all taxes) show Sweden 4th from the top in low price!

The correlation of language, particularly when applied to 'product' is always easy to target: how do you say Volvo,Saab,etc. in english? So talking of ipod,Facebook,etc. is a meaningless point? That Sweden is multi-lingual is not something to bemoan but something to praise. English does,mainly by accident, happen to be a strong communicative tool in the whole world.

But, hey, don't let me destroy your obvious delight in the 'misery' of one statistic that is based on only one means of measurement. Enjoy it while you can, it won't last long. The 'Swedish model', followed by the UK and USA as a template for dealing with the financial crisis, and the Swedish 'social model', are the envy of many countries.

I would respectfully suggest that 'mediocrity' is more a perception relative to your standpoint.

The OECD report did,however,observe that "Sweden remains a well-off nation". Perhaps it's good to keep perspective as well as focus.

If it's a question of trying to save Sweden then let's just make sure The Alliance wins the next general election. Sweden is bound to have come off worse than other nations in OECD comparison as all countries with large export markets have been hit the worse from economic downturn. If the red-greens win then it will mean a massive backward step for Sweden and then we'll really see some major problems come up. The Alliance needs another 4 years to complete the reform program Sweden needs to bring it up to the wealth levels seen in the 1960's. The country needs to attract people with money and education to move here to live, it needs to attract global businesses to invest in Sweden and open up plants/offices here and it needs to offer quality of life to it's citizens. If all this starts to happen then the rest will take care of itself.

cardinal ruler… don't be silly.

We are a small cold country on the edge of Europe and very sensitive to price fluctuations. The truth be known this slight fall can be placed squarely on the adoption of Neo-Con economic principles of the American fifth columnist government now in power. The US is about to tank big time…their recent rise if you can call it that is just a minor blip and the results of dumping a couple of trillion borrowed dollars into the economy.

Capitalism has never worked… particularly for the citizenry and comparing it Swedish socialism to Russian communism is a propaganda red herring and shows a true lack of insight or understanding. Sweden as a Socialist democracy and in fact all the socialist democracies of Europe have been far more successful than any capitalist country particularly the US in serving their citizens needs and providing a high standard of living for all with excellent business environments with far less resources and six week vacations.

The US under capitalism consumes more the 40% of the world's resources and still can't produce a proper educational system for its children…. Drop out rates of 30% percent in inner city schools… a literacy rate lower than Cuba's… and top rated show titled "Are Smarter a than a Fifth Grader" and an adult population… of which 26% have no idea of where the Pacific ocean is. This pattern is true across the board in every category that contributes to citizen satisfaction and well being for all of its citizens. The list could go on for pages.

Given it's all its advantages and opportunity and wealth America under capitalism even in it's heyday is the biggest failure on the planet and now the most dangerous, a failed capitalist state a failing lifestyle, with a military, who's murderous brutality rivals any dictatorship past or present, that spans the globe.

My hat goes off to JDV, I think Cardinal Ruler is just like someone who couldn't hack it in Sweden and is now forced to put it down.

Pro-capitalists tend to lump anything non-capitalist into the "Communist" category, and comparing Sweden to the former Soviet Union is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard on TL.

Cardinal Ruler must still have his vinyl copy of "Ronald Regan on Socialism & Liberalism" ....a copy was sent to every US home in 1961 - dictating to the people huh.

Don't complain about Sweden when capitalism is BROKE..... it has borrowed over $750 billion dollars from CHINA....

You believe in a system that is fatally flawed....a system built on consumption when resources are dwindling

JDV, you may want to consider the fact that Sweden IS a capitalist system before you go decrying the merits of such a system. Even while I was growing up there, 90% + of businesses where privately owned and market driven, a number that has only increased since then. Sweden's political tendencies may be socialist, but don't fool yourself to a belief that economically your anywhere near socialism.

As much as Cardinal ruler is wrong about Sweden JDV paints a little bit too rosy a picture of the Promised Land of European socialism. Every system has it's strengths and it's faults. Completely decrying one in favor of another is absurd, especially when one is comparing western nations.

@cardinalruler

Well said. A lot of people in Sweden who are well traveled and have experiences in other countries are not afraid to say the same kind of things. They are patriotic and love their country but are not afraid to talk about these differences and some of these downfalls that Sweden is currently experiencing. The ones that really criticize capitalism are ones that have never lived anywhere else.

With that being said, I do believe though that there are creative geniuses in Sweden that will take this country to the next level with the next "Skype", "Linex" or medical breakthrough.

Sorry Bria

But socialism does not mean that there can be no priviately owned businesses or that there is no market. I does mean that businesses, companies and investing is an obligation to serve the greater good and that the purpose government is to ensure that principle and that the results of production or profits are re-distributed to all levels of society for that purpose. No company or peson is an island unto itself or can claim some sort independent success from the society and social structure that created it and that is the founding principle that underlies socialist economics and politics.

Socailism recognizes and has proven that this method of providing for the positive stability of the society is far more important to good business than simple profit for investors only driven captilalism. Large government is not a drag on the economy but acts to stablized, by the redistribution of wealth through salaries and services, the very negative social and business effects of the boom/bust uncertainties of free market captialism.

Sweden should be proud of its socilaist philosophy and its application of those principles because they worked very well. They stopped working because of our ridiculous swallowing of American Reagan/Freidman/ Straus Neo-Con supply side hype "What george bush senior once described as "vodoo economics, and allowing ourselves to briibed with the illusion that low taxes and a reduction of government in a country of 9 million are the answer to economic success and job creation we get start to see the American results…increased homelessness… lack of social services…. increased crime… a lack of social mobility, a greater increrse in inequality… a poorer education system…uncertainty and fear for the future.

By experience, I can say when Sweden gets this kind of problems; they who will be affected worst are immigrant and refugees. In early 90s, Sweden and Finland got the worst economical problem and immigrant harmed the most.

The early 90s economical problem was not global but local. I don't know how many times Sweden has received deep economical problem since depression 1930, but it always says that it's the first time since depression we get economical problem!! It's like their weather report and cold weather; it is first time, every year and never happened before!

yes i agree, sweden is getting worst n the most "drabbast" i hela europa..sadly to say

@JDV

"The US is about to tank big time…their recent rise if you can call it that is just a minor blip and the results of dumping a couple of trillion borrowed dollars into the economy". Hope you were not comparing the US with Sweden? Cos with the failed health care system, failing education system and the nut cases in the US any sane person will put America first before thinking about sweden. One reason would be that everyone has an equal opportunity, unlike sweden were it is just a click of ethnic boys and gals.

@Keith #5083

"how do you say Volvo,Saab,etc. in english? So talking of ipod,Facebook,etc. is a meaningless point? English does,mainly by accident, happen to be a strong communicative tool in the whole world".

lol. Keep telling yourself that Keith and someday you may actually believe it. Why mention failed brands like Saab and Volvo? Sweden has to wake up and stop playing ethnic politics in innovation and the job market.

@Cardinal Ruler

You made some good points.

Sweden will reinvent itself however. It's in their nature...at least I hope.

Cardinrule

The ones that really criticize capitalism are ones that have never lived anywhere else.

I was born and lived in New York for 48 years… during that time I worked 20 years in Marfeting and advertising rose top top mangement levels and even owned my ad agency before devoting my last 10 years there to working as a volunteer and professional with the hiomeless. I left of my own awakening that America itself had become a failed experiment socially, economically and politically. I will raise the question again how does a nation that consumes 40% of the world's resources for 5% of the world's population, have a homeless problem, or health care problem, an education problem, or a poverty problem, have literally more people in jail than China country more than three time its size, a literacy rate less than Cuba, exports less than Germany a country one third it's size, and produces a results economically that is the "shame" of the world… and is the world's largest deadbeat debtor nation?… the answer is Captialism and investor greed.

Buccaneer

Hope you were not comparing the US with Sweden? Cos with the failed health care system, failing education system and the nut cases in the US any sane person will put America first before thinking about sweden. One reason would be that everyone has an equal opportunity, unlike sweden were it is just a click of ethnic boys and gals.

There is a part of me that wants to says I wouldn't be that cruel. But I am…In almost every poll and analysis of customer/citizen satisfaction including social mobility and equal opportunity Sweden and the Nordic coutries with their social democracies are always in the top five nations of the world and well above the US and in taking into account the above statement. Do we have an inbuilt structual problem in terms of immigrants vs Swedes that is different than US where all my grandparents were immigrants in a country of immigrants, yes. Yet all my grandparents immigrants in a nation of immigrants faced dicrimination predjudice and the inequaltiy it brings. There is no equal opportunity in america except for expressing hot air about it… when in fact as one the developed industrialized countries it has produced one the least social and economic mobile societies.

This seemed like a timely moment to join up and stick in my ore's worth.

I am a 'Foreign Direct Investor' or at least a future one. My girlfriend and I will be relocating to Sweden from Britain later this year to start a Self Sufficiency experiment in Lapland! We will be employing people and paying lots of tax. We do not mind. Economic factors are not the main reason we decided to move to Sweden, the main reasons were that it is a lovely and beautiful place with very nice people and an excellent standard of living. Some things cannot be measured solely through economic indicators, though of course the very low house prices do already make Sweden an attractive proposition for people wishing to start afresh.

As already stated Sweden is a well educated place with some very dynamic people so for what it is worth, I am sure she will get by fine, and with people like me about, who are happy to pay taxes and bring their ideas to Sweden, she can but prosper!!

We want to move to Sweden because it has such a high standard of living and if high taxes are what it takes then so be it!

OK , Sweden failed badly in global economic report. It's still fairly well off. But times may be changing. Can it reinvent itself-Why YES? Butit is part of a global economy and when the others get sick, it may get sick too. The debate between socialism and capitalism is bogus, as most countries have both in their system.

It's common here to bash the US, and surely it has a lot of problems, but it is also

prob. 50 times bigger than Sweden in manpower and resources.

As a person living in US now, I actually think it is good for US to stop relying on foreign imports and start making it again in our country. Gosh ,we have a lot of food here.

Also, we get our fruits and veggies from some of our Latin American neighbors which is cheaper. We have natural resources, galore.

US can also reinvent itself very fast. Don't underestimate the US yet.

I don't want to sound mean, but we should slow down European imports and start making it right here in the good old USA.

@rumple123k

"As already stated Sweden is a well educated place with some very dynamic people so for what it is worth, I am sure she will get by fine, and with people like me about, who are happy to pay taxes and bring their ideas to Sweden".

All I could say to you is welcome to the jungle. If you are not an ethnic Swede then you should be ready for a big surprise.

I have always liked the power of positive thinking. However, I have to say you sound like I did some years ago. I have my own business here in Sweden and before that I attended one of the best business school in Sweden. All that achievement did not help much with the way the Swedes operate. If your business is in any way dependent on another ethnic Swedish firm then you are going to have problems. In someway, Swedes like to see immigrants as people who should be doing menial jobs, so when they see you are not falling into that defined frame they tend not to like it.

You are sure to do well in Sweden when your business has more to do with the international market. If that is not the case then you better go somewhere else.

@Keith #5083

With respect to your first post: Thank you for identifying your sources. There is an old saying: In God we trust, all others bring data. Bravo.

@rumple123k

Buccaneer has some good points. You sound like I did before moving to Sweden (over optimistic). I'm glad I moved to Trollhattan, but living there is hard for an immigrant. Most of the Brits I knew were either planning on returning home or wishing they could. You should still go. Give it 3 or 4 years, but keep your options open to returning home. Most importantly, be realistic of what its going to be like. And don't forget, learn Swedish! The locals will speak English, but will respect you more if you speak Svenska.

@JDV, "26% have no idea of where the Pacific ocean is" please cite your sources. Dont get out of your mom's basement too much huh?

"The National Geographic-Roper 2002 Global Geographic Literacy Survey polled more than 3,000 18- to 24-year-olds in Canada, France, Germany, Great Britain, Italy, Japan, Mexico, Sweden and the United States.

Sweden scored highest;

Mexico, lowest.

The U.S. was next to last."

"About 11 percent of young citizens of the U.S. couldn't even locate the U.S. on a map. The Pacific Ocean's location was a mystery to 29 percent; Japan, to 58 percent; France, to 65 percent; and the United Kingdom, to 69 percent."

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2002/11/1120_021120_GeoRoperSurvey.html

The OECD states that the US has the 4th most educated population (behind Canada, Japan, and New Zealand). Statistics say a lot of things. I would trust an in depth investigation into a country's education system over a survey by National Geographic.

http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/41/25/43636332.pdf

i just moved to sweden from D.C. and dont have much love for the US based on the direction i see it going..... but i do have to stick up for the people that compare our crimes and education to the rest of the world........ I call the U.S. ''The United States of the World''......... because as we all know the US in an immigrant infested country.... some good, majority bad. The family i rented a room with before coming to sweden were school teachers, 5th and 6th grade. the 5th grade teacher had 26 students in her class. 4 of them were ''American''. Rest immigrants, 6 of which were not able to speak English yet (from Mexico)...... MSNBC did a report of this a few years ago about how our country is ranked in the world in education and what the impact of immigrants is on the tests. sweden complaines about a few hundred thousand immigrants, try having 20 million illegal immigrants from countries where education isnt found, plus millions others there legaly. even if the kids are there illegally they still are allowed to attend school and also hospitals. Dont get me wrong there are some dumb ass Americans, but there are dumb asses in alot of countrys!

And just because you see shows like ''So you think your smarter than a fifth grader'' doesnt mean its real, America is in love with reality shows and dumb game shows like that, its called Entertainment, and thats what America is good at, hence 90% of shows here are American, i watch more American Tv here than i did in the states, Not to mention movie theaters and how there all American and in english....... i think its time for people to stop worring about what goes on in America and start doing something with your own country. come up with something, stop making Swedish idols because of american idol, stop dressing like Kanye West because you saw his video on MTV......all my girlfriends friends are obsessed with america and its hollywood, culture, and clothing..... it drives me nuts....... i like alot of swedish stuff and think some of the things here are cool but damn these people take it to the next level

Have to say that the Swedish economy is much stronger today than the economic situation in Ireland, the UK or Latvia. In Ireland pubs are closing down, houses have been taken by the banks, shops have gone bust, hotels are empty, people are spending less. In Sweden, if I walk downtown Stockholm on a Saturday, everyone's still spending like crazy. And I've heard that the laser and cosmetic surgery is still going strong in Sweden, despite the recession.

I spent my life in the US. I have lived in Sweden for 7 years now (on and off)...now granted I lived in Cambridge Mass...I also lived in the South for a while. If a man cannot find Rhode Island on the map or Ireland for that matter it does not make them less of a human. The US has produced a LOT (SEE NOBEL TABLE) of great researchers. In the US I met a lot more intellectuals if I went to a pub (again Boston). The most wicked smart people you ever met. I love Sweden but it is just silly comparing the two countries. If I go out here I hear the same opinion about any given world problem over and over. I would just love some variety outside of the Swedish immigration question!

Sweden has done a great job taking care of it's citizens...punkt. America has always surprised the naysayers (1972, 1982,1994,....?)...We all do the best we can! What if Sweden had 308 million people?

While many people are following the unemployment statistics, the most telling of employment data is actually the rate of underemployment. Underemployment is where people take jobs at lower salaries or below their qualifications. The number of underemployed is almost twice the number of unemployed - and that means more people are tightening their belts, and doing whatever they can to make do and not run for payday loans or pawn shops. A lot of people I know have had to resort to freelancing in whatever capacity they had to in order to bring in a little money, when their 9 to 5 job left them out to dry, and the job market is pretty dismal. You have to work hard at freelancing wherever you get the opportunity to, but you can survive with it.

and why is everyone on here so fascinated with who knows where what country is? what does that make you? dumb? Can you point out Angola on a map? im in an SFI coarse right now and on the first day we introduce ourselves and where were from, most of those people couldnt point on the map there country or city(France, Morroco, Belgium, Korea)....... and they all think Washington D.C. is Washington State, 3500 miles away...... i mean where does your argument go? America still has more successful people than any other country in the world, Why is it Important for Donald Trump to know where Belgium is on a map? or Micheal Jordan to point out India on a map? SWEET, sweden is good with countrys......... greeaaaat !!!! But they still cant find a way to provide enough housing for their citizens?!?! I love it here, but dont base a debate on the difference in countrys by who can point the most countrys out on a map. Im sure if you asked them to point out ''Europe'' on a map they could do it..... thats like asking a swede to point out Iowa on a map or North Dakota .... silly

@JDV Bravo on listing your sources.

Thanks. Though I may disagree with you, you do show your quality and I respect your input. I must also note that you didn't resort to personal insults and attacks on those who disagree with you. Bravo again.

I read the National Geographic article in your link. I must say that it does ring true in my personal experience. Many of my American friends asked for me to bring them home some chocolate when I told them I was moving to Sweden -- they mixed up Sweden and Switzerland. I think some of the geographic ignorance in the US is tied to ethnocentrism and the fact that you can live in America all your life, see many wonders and never leave your country. It's a great thing about America, as well as one of our challenges. It is true that Sweden excels in Language and geography (from my personal experience as well).

The trouble with this article is that it is targeted on a particularly bad area in the US education system. It does not provide a clear picture of the overall average nor does it reflect the educational opportunities in America.

My children went to one of the top schools in Trollhattan and they found themselves four years behind their American grade level in math and science. We pulled them from that school and sent them to a prestigious school in Goteborg. This school was much better; it was only two years behind. Even worse than their peer's academic level was the egalitarian attitude of the school masters. It was seen as an insult for our children to ask for something beyond what their peers were studying. Eventually we had to pull them out of Swedish schools altogether. Despite all of our efforts, my eldest son was not able to return to his grade when we moved back to the US. Fortunately, there are opportunities in the US to make up for what he lost while in Sweden.

Sweden does excel in many areas, but it and Socialism are not all they are claimed to be. You need to have a pretty narrow scope to conclude that Sweden is better than the US. This article is a tool for that scope, but is not definitive.

REpat-expat

It is importent to realize that argument is not that Swedish schools produce a better results, as all school systems are absolute terrible at producing what they should be capable of doing, It is to look at the results in terms of what it cost the world (40% of the resources directed at 5% of the population) to provide such dismal results, it is not just about finding Rhode island on map it's about knowing where one of the two oceans that border the country is…and 11% can't even find the country… that was just one example along with the many other dismal results I pointed out and many, many more … as results of a free market capitalist system. A system where the operating principle has not been "What's good for the country is good for General Motors" but "What's good for General Motors is good for the country".

We are are only a country of 9 million souls with limited resources at the freezing edge of Europe and it is quite impressive to see the results of what has been achieved by an ideological socialist economy where results of the economic sector is, can and as it should be focused on the greater good of "ALL" the people.

In a world of dwindling resources that must be shared more wisely and equably it very important now to de-mythify the "American Capitalist Dream" as a consumer driven role model and show it for the nightmare it is... both in its unsustainable, unexportable, unfair… documented results and its real potential for harm if adopted even in part as demonstrated by our sudden now documented by the OCED fall in our living standards.

JDV:

Thank you for your respectful and well stated reply. Proof that debate can be civil, even when people disagree. I do disagree with some of your points, but I pray you will forgive me for not providing the reply you deserve. Work is pressing on me, even over the weekend. I didn't have this problem so often while I lived there (another plus for Sweden :)