May 26, 2012
Published: 12 Mar 10 08:14 CET | Double click on a word to get a translation
Online: http://www.thelocal.se/25484/20100312/
Sweden's ambassador to Turkey, Christer Asp, was summoned to the Turkish foreign ministry on Friday morning after the Swedish parliament voted to recognize the 1915 mass killing of Armenians and other ethnic groups as genocide.
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The intention was to move Armenians from Russian border and some other strategic places, which anyone with clear mind would totally understand the reason, after the things with Russians. The process however, failed badly and actions were taken by The Ottomans right after the unfortunate event. In the same year, responsible 1673 people were prosecuted, most of them found guilty and 67 of them sentenced to death. These occured in the same year(1915) so it was a self made decision by The Ottomans, (no parliaments were around to force anything) Also not all the Armenian people were moved, so even this only shows it was never a genocide. These and lots more are documented in our archieves, which we are willing to share, debate on or cross reference with anyone. Only by doing so, it would be fair to make assumptions.
Here's another fact: Sweedish parliament denied the same motion with 38 to 252 in 2007. It feels like there are some doing their job really well. Bravo!! Now EU has a valid excuse not to let us in since we will never accept the word genocide, ever.
I am really sorry your people lost their lives but it was not intentional and was not a genocide!!
Hey Armenia you can not discover false "Armenian Genocide" and you can not realize it, because it is not reality. There was not any Genocide.
Anar from Azerbaijan
The fact of the matter is that Turkey will continue to ignore the claim. It has the footsteps to follow. In our receant history the US committed bigger crimes. In vietnam, three million vietnamese lost their lives and about five million were disabled. In Iraq over one million people were killed. What name shall we give to these crimes. The Swedish government had condemned the first one and has not supported the invasion of Iraq.
Those are some pretty broad strokes you just made.
Doesnt prosecuting your own officers and giving death penalties count as taking responsibility? Nazi's didnt do that as i recall and thats why the two shouldnt be compared. It was a crime and justice served even before anyone asked for it.
Russia,
Germany,
China,
Japan
USA, yes, USA,
Australia,
UK,
Belgium,
Indonesia,
Iraq,
maybe Israel...
You know, Turkish, as Michael Jackson sing: You are not alone...
Don t be so jumpy!
Peace!
Best
You can pay some of the politicians some of the time, but you cannot pay all the politicians all of the time...
You can also pay some of the historians to write books the way you want some of the time but you cannot pay all the historians to write what you want all of the time.
Just accept that it has happened and that this event is a crime.
How in gods name is the USA, commited bloody genocide. NEVER in its history did it kill off another ethnic group. I fact, USA is famous for its melting pot enviroment where many persucuted groups came to seek shelter. The US, too has made many mistakes in its history which they lived up to, Ie slavery, but never genocide.
Please stop putting names on a list without any proof.
This is out of the topic but since you are so innocent, I ll try to help you:
the destruction of native American Indians, killing of 3 mil Vietnamese people, Cambodgia and Laos bombings and killings, backing of Guatemala and other South America criminal regimes and direct implication in some cases, backing of Indonesia genocide in East Timor, in 1999. I m sure there are much more to say, but now I must go to work so that is what I can remember now.
All these worth much more than Armenian genocide, don t you think so?
There must be justice for those poor people from Armenia.
Turkish are just acting stupid.
Only turks(as a loose term for muslim population in the area when consider 1915) killed people throughout the history right? For example, russians are like the angels? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor) No one can stand the image of Turkish people as bloody murderers and other countries as saints especially in that time(Dont say that other countries accepted their guilt, Europeans decided killings of hundred thousands Bosnians was not a genocide of Serbians just happened 15 years ago) I guess I should agree the saying of 'turks are the jewish of Europe in this century'. We suffered a lot as well in dissolution of ottoman empire with slaughter of our countrymen(civilians) in Balkans after Balkan war millions ran away(like one-third of my friends are balkan descendants) and even in Bulgaria before the 90s as well. It is also strange that when germans did a genocide, only Nazis did it( and even they didnt think by themselves low creatures of turks gave the idea) when russians did, only Stalin did it but for armenian genocide of course inclusively all turks did it.
Of course when the Armenian side is blocked then the political games are easy to play: just call few guys some hands up andothers down: That's it you have another country recognizing in fact they have no idea at all!
'I heard somewhere Hitler was taking some examples from Armenian genocide and he said that noone remebers Armenian genocide so noone will worry also for what he does. This are real words and you can find them in internet and books'
This is very classic allegation like you can find this comment of Hitler in books and INTERNET. I heard this argument thousand times but no binding proof just rumors. I also saw a photo that armenian corpses next to Ataturk`s chair that apparently montaged from a original photo of Ataturk sitting with his dogs. So i believe of course there were many deaths in Armenian side but many sutff is fabricated as well by armenians and allied forces which were pissed of because they lost the turkish war of independence as memoirs and stories. If you see how it work in a more decent narration check wilfird helmans post on this page of website:
http://www.armeniangenocidedebate.com/armenians-full-of-contradictions#comments
Still there is not a single order of the leaders of that day in 1915 with execution of a genocide besides the deportation and people are executed for crimes against armenians in the time of war not later.
australia and genocide please explain that one. A tip for you it had to happen after 1st Jan 1901. That is the date we became Australians, before that the British
I'm NOT talking about recognizing it as "Genocide" or NOT...
BTW, do you really think that US cares about Armenians ???
US cares only about Israel. Since Turkey stands by the poor people in Gaza and caused embarrassment to the Israeli war criminals. So, US wanted to teach Turkey lesson and they came up with such issue and make it as a big deal.
And in Turkey, in fact, Ottomans did it. No turkish. In Russia, soviet communist did all the murders, no russian were involved ...
You really are a bright mind, Jimmy! Carry on!
Sweden is not following the U.S., they are leading the U.S. The U.S. Congress has not passed an Armenian Genocide resolution, only the House Foreign Relations Committee has. You should be proud that Sweden is not afraid to say the truth in the face of bullies that want to interfere with its internal politics. Our politicians in the U.S. are gutless cowards who treat our nation as if it was a third-rate cess pool. America is supposed to be the leader in human rights; we are supposed to lead the world against Genocide-denial; we are supposed to defend the defenseless. Instead, our useless politicians cower to nations like Turkey who want to cover up Genocides, when even nations like France and Sweden, whom we mock in the U.S., are brave enough to stand up against Turkish bullies. So please be proud of your nation today and your politicians today, because they did the right thing; they did the honest thing; they did the moral thing.
Here is the link :
http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?_r=1&res=9B03E0DC1738E633A25750C1A9679D946596D6CF
Still for me the best way to find smth is wikipedia so go here and read about the Hitler's Armenian quote if you really can't find it anywhere. You will see that it's real, not made up http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_quote You people like to say that everything is a lie without even considering the possibility that maybe it's not. Read books , not the turkish ones, and not the Armenian ones but other. A lot of writers of that time all over the world have written about the Genocide. Turkey has to get on from the Denial stage and enter the Acceptance part.
And to those people who say that parliament should not waste their time and resources on these kind of matters, I would like to say that this issue is already an international one and every country's opinion and position is very important. and the fact that it happened doesn't change anything. @ Clever Dick - I am pretty sure that a lot of people in 1920s said the same thing , that's why the Holocaust happened, because the organizers of the previous genocide didn't get punished.
And then you read the Sweden's Minister of Foreign Affairs Carl Bildt's speech expressing his concern regarding the ruling and stating ' "History can not be politicized." How ironic !
Presenting some nonsense you want us to believe that genocide didn't happen? Just take a look what are you presenting and what it has to do with the genocide? I don't trust your source but even if Armenians wanted to revolt that wasn't a reason for committing genocide. It was their land and Tatar Seljuk came to their land 10 century ago and occupied their land. What would you do if someone comes to your home and occupies it?
Seriously...do you think Turkey which is a bigger country than Sweden would say "Thank you for your kind words about us". ? I suppose (I hope) that advisers to the Swedish government has done enough homework before taking such the action (irrelevant politicized vote).
If Turkey tears business contracts with Sweden ...it is Sweden that will suffer economically more than Turkey. Swedish tourists to Turkey account for a small fraction of the total number of tourists to the country. Politicians, regardless of which side, should think about the national interests before political gain.
The Turkish Lie:
watch?v=AVJSUYkkXSk&feature=player_embedded
Exile in the Ottoman Empire
The Turks initially welcomed the Swedish king, who managed to incite a war between the Ottomans and the Russians. His expenses during his long stay in the Ottoman Empire were covered from the Ottoman state budget, as part of the fixed assets "
by Wiki ..
Thank you very much for your " kind " response Sweeden ... We will never forget this ...
The leaders of Jonturk are killed by armenians(2 of 3) in Europe when they were in Exile after WW1.The killers walked free. Enver died fighting with Russians in Caucasia. 57 that involved in massacres are executed in 1915(soldiers fail to protect armenians or kill them for their valuables) and many others even unguilty were executed by the puppet government in Istanbul after WW1.What kind of punishment are you talking about further?
Btw i hate the idea that even for the holocaust the turks are blamed like Adolf Hitler wouldnt get the idea to kill Jewish otherwise.
Second, "How in gods name is the USA, commited bloody genocide." You could ask a few native Americans that question and you will find your answer. Is had been reported Hilter used that example to plan his genocide.
Let us reevaluate Armenia's persistence on the word 'genocide' on political and educational platforms but not in scholar and juricidal platforms from a different perspective:
Let us evaluate why the Armenians urge politicians and school boards to use the word genocide', while vehemently rejecting to present their thesis in scholar and judicial platforms from a different perspective:
Armenia's attitude towards Turkey's land integrity: Article 13 (second paragraph) of Armenian constitution declares the 'Ağrı Mountain' in the Eastern Anatolia of Turkey, as the state symbol of Armenia . Article 11 of the Armenian Declaration of Independence of August 23, 1990; refers to Eastern Anatolia of Turkey as Western Armenia and as such beholds that this area is part of Armenia. Since the Armenian constitution recognizes as a basis "the fundamental principles of the Armenian statehood and national aspirations engraved in the Declaration of Independence of Armenia", it likewise accepts the characterization of Eastern Anatolia as Western Armenia and this, albeit indirectly, translates into the advancement of territorial claims. The Armenian politicians and school books call Eastern Anatolia of Turkey, 'invaded mother land of Armenia' and in Armenia the school children are being grown up being conditioned to be patriots to rescue their invaded land. Even the marches they sing are about this condition. The Armenians who write in such blogs that the Eastern Anatolia cities do not belong to Turkey, as if the present Eastern boundaries of Turkey was not determined by treaties of Gumru (1920), Moscow (1921) and the whole boundaries by Lausanne (1923) Treaties; after the Turkish Freedom War.
Armen Aivazyan, Director of Ararat Center of Strategic Studies, told a news conference that Armenia must never renounce its territorial claims to Turkey http://www.panarmenian.net/news/eng/?nid=28877
Additionally Armenia refused Turkey's recurrent offers to commit an agreement declaring that each country recognizes the other country's land integrity, in 1992 and later.
'It is necessary to stress that we wish to open a road between Armenia and Turkey, not the border, since who said that the existing line is the true boundary between the two countries?", Galust Saakyan, the head of the parliamentary fraction of the Republican Party of Armenia told a press conference on 24 July 2009 (Panarmenian).