More low-paid jobs for refugees proposed

More low paid jobs, europe is coming closer and closer to becoming a 3rd world continent once again, we are even bringing the people in for this to happen! What are the goals of bringing people into Europe! we should export welfare, ideas and technology and not import poverty. I say, lets help the people from the outside, help can be brought to their home countries, THAT is real development!

Any person, immigrant or local, with dignity and self-respect would prefer to do any kind of job, no matter what the pay, than live off other people's charity.

Those who do prefer to live off other people's charity should be forced to attend classes where their values can be adjusted, so they can feel more comfortable living in Swedish society.

Well i agree with the parental leave, but low paid jobs i dont think so, they will exploit ppl with this new suggestions, and even praktik is exploitation!

Totally agree on the issue of parental leave. As an immigrant myself, i get repulsed by the idea that one can draw full parental benefits for old children. It is unfair to the system and those with infants.

On the issue of low-paid jobs, this is unnecessary as immigrants generally get laid less anyway. Making it a law only entrenches social inequality that will create other problems.

Can someone tell Nyamko Sabuni to keep quiet. At what age did she arrive Sweden? Whether she is minister or not, to me she is also a foreigner who benefitted from the rules of engagement with parental leaves.

Sabuni has slavery mentality, she forgot to say that someone profit more if people accept to work for less money. Low paid jobs produce rich owner of such company. Even if people have job, which is low paid, they can become criminals, in order to reach Swedish level of living. Society should be economic equal, if people want to integrate immigrants, homeless, social cases, etc.

RobinHood, better choose name: Superciuk (alcoholic man from comic Alan Ford who robbed poor in the name of rich). There is no dignity in slavery.

These low paid jobs will never happen if they still have that praktik thing going on because these days all employers need to do is let Arbetsf. know that they need a praktikant and then they get free labour for three months or more without the promise of employment afterwards.

I do not agree with the low paid job issue. If Sweden stands and tries to promote equality, then suggestions like this should not even arise.

Sounds to me that this person Nyamko Sabuni is being used by her fellow conservatives to do their own dirty work.

And yes asteriks, you are right, there is no dignity in slavery.

Robin Hood you are not living up to your name, the legend was a hero among people, fighting for a good cause and fighting for their rights.

I suggest Robin Hood you change you name, as you are not worthy of it.

I agree with Robin Hood, no man should prefer to be taken care of rather than taking care of himself. If you prefer to lie down and wait for a government to pay you rather than work yourself and even make more money, you are becoming a parasite!

This comment has nothing to do with refugees, or immigrants or any group of people on anywhere on earth! This is a moral issue valid for every human being!

The problem with Sweden is as a foreigner it is almost impossible to integrate into society. I have been here for 10 years, living in Spain, Greece, France, and Norway, fluent in 4 languages.

After months of living in those countries I was welcomed into, yet after 10 years I have one Swedish friend, I know many however never invited to their get togethers even after they have been invited to mine.

Sweden really needs to look at the integration of non-swedes and address theses issues.

How funny !

Does she really care about refugees ?

Those who may not know , Sabuni was a refugee in Burundi before her family moved to Sweden . Recently , there have been a lot of news reports about how the Swedish Immigration police has been mentally torturing Burundian asylum-seekers .

How many times has Sabuni gone to Märsta investigate if these reports are true or not ? Has sabuni even visted a refugee camp , talked to refugees and heard how they feel ?

I suggest that it is a bit disingenous for her or anyone to talk about intergration of refugees without bothering to find out what most of them have to go through before the are even allowed to join the main Swedish society .

Swedes don't even like themselves, so how the hell do you pretend that they like immigrants or refugees?

And I can tell you it will get worst in the future so get the hell out of there! It's my advice as an immigrant

To me I think it's better for people to think well before they contribute to a national issues development. However I think this issue has northing to do with refugees, immigrants or any group of people but rather a moral issue that should be treated with high level of human dignity.

The US Government is led with the motto "what is good for business is good for America". The US is honest about it. Sweden should also be honest about it also. Cheap labor is a bonanza of profit for corporations. The reason why capital is moving from western countries to China and relativeliy stable developing countries is for cheap labor. When you have cheap labor it in your home front it is even better.

For the people of most developing countries there is no way out, but sale their labor below its international market price. The sale of cheap labor in Sweden by people of the third world will bring them the needed income to finance the survival cost of families at home.

Global warming will bring extreme weather conditions. Africa, part of Asia and part of the US will be the most hit by crisis, e.g., one-quarter of Pakistan is now under water. 20 million people are without food and water! in 2030 the crisis will be biger and wider, i.e., forest fire in Russia type will also be common.

The Sabuni proposals are very unfortunate but show a very big problem that any Western country needs or will need to face in the near future. The people that think that integrating 3rd world immigrants is a positive contribution to the development of our societies should reflect more. Either integrated or not integrated, people coming from poor countries will most of the times promote ideas that represent a big step back from our civil and socila rights. The idea of creating low paid jobs for immigrants is very close to how this kind of things are hanlded in Africa between different ethincal groups. If you are of the "wrong" group, then you need to expect nothing more than having a job as a cleaner of the big house of the leading etnichal clans. This is exatcly what she propose because this is what she has inherited from her background. This is the moment to stop this madness.

MTH,

What you say is true.

Not to worry too much. Everything will soon be under control. Today's SvD tells us that there are 9,000 asylum seekers who have gone underground because they were not granted asylum - what is worrying about that is that there could be one or two criminals among them....

I listened to Shapiro ( adviser to Obama) comparing the relative economic decline of Japan with the rise of China which has a work force of 800 million people in the agriculture sector alone. He was asked whether China will eclipse USA by 2030 - and his reply was that - if China which is about six times bigger than the US, remains one, and continues along the present trajectory, who will surpass them?

In the meantime USA has 2 million people in the agricultural sector and exports a surplus of agricultural produce.

On the surface of some peoples minds:” ah the people who consume but do not produce”.

But even the lowly paid asylum seeker drinks milk, lives in a newly constructed house, has the latest electrical kitchenware, wears new clothes, provides the dentist with his daily bread....

But there is strength in numbers ( look at reunified Germany!). Sweden is really a little country (some say terribly underpopulated and hence the necessity of replenishing the diminishing - or stagnant Swedish stock, ( negative population growth) by importing foreign re-reinforcements.

In my opinion this will surely be paying off by the 2nd to 3rd generation. We may not be here by then, but we ( Sweden) will be reaping the dividends.

http://www.globalfirepower.com/

I think the problem with her suggestion is that usually these kinds of methods would not be limited to low educated with low training foreigners, it usually develop to higher education levels with academy degrees (I remember it had been done for some years ago)! About integration, I can say it's impossible in Sweden. Integration can not be one sided, it's mutual and I don't think Swedes are interested about it; the idea of integration is just an imagination in here, it cannot be done, I can explain why but not in here!

# Great Scott and Asreriks

Your comments simply prove that dignity and self respect are not innate, and for some those values must be learned. Good luck in your search for enlightenment.

To live on another's charity is slavery. To support yourself by honest labour is freedom.

Statements and proposals from ''Integration and Gender Equality Minister'' are always funny.

Nyamko Sabuni some questions for you.

1.Does it means that foreign born children are not equal to the children bon in Sweden?????????

Foreign born children don't need attention and time from Parents in the same way as Swedish born children????

Robin Hood, get off your right wing rocking horse and start to understand what you are reading.

@MIK in Sweden , I told you she doesn`t care , didn`t I ?

I have never been able to know what her views on Swedish immigration law is . This is strange coming from an immigrant who aslo happens to be a mother and a lawyer . I saw her crying on TV on a progaramme about how women and children get victimized most in war situations . And yet , she said absolutely nothing when African asylum-seekers are forcefully collected from their camps , dumped in prisons ( förval ) where they are kept indefinately , until the police decides to handcuff and load the "human cargo " on chartered planes , and flown out in the dead of the night to be dumped in any African airport that can take them .

If Sabuni does not mind this type of mistreatment of immigrants , how can she be the same person who will work to integrate those who are lucky to escape this sort of silent brutality ?

Sabuni is a typical hypocrite !

Can somebody explain to me why a new immigrant would want 16 months of parental leave for an older child. Why wouldn't an immigrant want to get out to work as soon as possible, and quickly integrate into, and contribute to Swedish society?

The humblest of jobs in this exciting new country must be better than vegetating at home, living on state handouts, wasting time, and with nothing to do.

I assume all the critics of this policy suggestion already have jobs and are already well-integrated into society. Don't you think someone trying to offer new immigrants the same opprtunities you already have, deserves your support?

Sabuni is a your typical "Uncle Tom" with low-self esteem peppered with a huge amount of self-hate. Sabuni is married to a "white" Swede; I gather she only wants melanated people form Africa to be welcomed in Sweden if they agree to be a Swedes sex slave or work slave.

"Hursomhelst" (anyway), Anyone that believes Sabuni has any real power is kidding themselves; she is a puppet, and a bad one at that. Indeed the Swedes are covert racist. They promote a altruistic country and people but this is just an illusion and not the truth. Swedish society wants people to believe they are magnanimous since they don't like to fight (female behavior) wars; they prefer America to look like bullies and protect European interest. Swedes in general are feminine (cunning), and I don't mean that in a good way.

Back to Sabuni;

In Swedish an African should call her "förrädare" (traitor).

En svart människa som är en förrädare.

Den svarta afrikan kvinna som förråder sina människor.

She wants to promote 4th place citizenship for African people. Her father must be proud.

Well put Khazala !

But the truth is that not all African women who marry white Swedes act like Sabuni . I know a few who have used their " white " marital connections to fight for the rights of other immigrants .

I dare say that Sabuni is not alone in looking down upon Africans . Somebody told me that 2 well known "black" Swedes , Tainton , Kayo and another one whose name he could not remember said that they can never date Black men . Asked why not, their answer was : " de är jobbiga " .

Was that what Taintons mum thought before she dated an immigrant called Tainton ?

How about jobs for teenagers who aren't spoiled by their parents and actually need an income?

Khazara

or whoever you are, you ought to be ashamed of yourself

Have some self respect – which means respect yourself.

What harm has Sister Nyamko done to you? Has she done you any harm?

Yours are the lunatic ravings of an improperly informed, a poorly informed and probably frustrated some body and now you want to take your frustrations out on Sister Nyamko Sabuni, with some of your racist, kitchen sink psychology and racist ( “the Swedes are covert racist.” - where did you learn that?

Where is all this hot, foetid, racist steam coming from and is there any other reason why it is being released on Sister Nyamko?

First of all let me tell you this: before Nyamko Sabuni was appointed Minister of Gender Equality and Integration, she addressed us at a meeting of African organisations in one of the rooms of the Swedish Parliament ( I was there as a Nigeria representative) and she struck me as being a very impressive person and very what in Swedish is “ sakkunnig” - direct, practical, intelligent, empathic and going to the heart of the matter ( more about that if you request it)

Don't be afraid, here is some freedom of speech , so please respond to this – use any words you like or that you think that I won't like, so that I can meet you with the sledge hammer that I have ready and waiting.

I haven't yet read her book "The New Sweden" (Det nya Sverige),which we are to understand must be about creating opportunity and in the same liberal spirit of her party leader Jan Björklund who spelled it out quite convincingly at Almedalen where he also outlined his vision of the New Sweden and the kind of education that will keep the country on course to meet the challenges that lay ahead, the rest of this century. One of his memorable phrases was that “ the future of Sweden will not depend on A Kassan” - and so too we must expect that immigrants must learn the skills to pay the bills. Unemployment is not of any political party's making, and yet Sweden has not adopted the kind of immigration rules of Canada and lately Australia , both of whom prioritise qualified manpower – and this is reflected in their standing in many of the surveys, such as the UNDP country rankings.

http://www.google.com/search?source=ig&...nd+at+Almedalen

The synopsis of Nyamko Sabuni's book that's presented here would suggest that it's a very humane and humanitarian approach that she has adopted to the problem of getting newly arrived refugees to learn basic Swedish and to get a footing in the job market on the way to integration which doesn't happen overnight.

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=hp...q=Nyamko+Sabuni

Nowadays everybody’s busy being visionary and talking about change.

What do you say about Mr. Obama and his “ The Audacity of hope”?

And what do you have to Mona Sahlin's “"Möjligheternas land - min vision för Sverige". Have you read that yet? Is it the New Social Democrats or the Old?

Only Lars Ohly is being true to colour among those of the so called “left”

swedes can never understand this simple question, the problem is not the pay, it's the freaking tax structure that kills all the business cases, creation and jobs

I have to give one clue to Ms Sabuni, I don't know how long you are living in Sweden, but be sure to get job doesn't mean to be integrated in Sweden. I know people who work over twenty years, pay tax and have their own business but are not integrated in Sweden! This stereo type thought that if you have job then you are integrated is a typical Swedish understanding of job and integration, which is very limited.

...and once again it's all about hand-outs....

If you have taken any basic class in macro economics, then you know a high minimum wage actually increases unemployment. In order to let younger people into the working force, it's been done in many countries that a lower minimum wage being introduced to teenagers, encouraging companies to hire them. What Nyamko suggested has nothing to do with discrimination. However I'm only worried about how it works in practice.

It is nice to see the top brass of the so called "liberal" party of Sweden come out and show their true colour. They are very real socialist planners who love to meddle with every little parameter they can identify in the system. They have a long time ago abandoned the theory that the old liberal parties that previously existed still to some extent identified themselves with, or at least had a theoretical understanding and *knowledge* of.

Sabuni on the other hand as well as Major Björklund have no liberal understanding whatsoever. They don't understand market economy nor do the understand basic concepts like equality before the law or equality of opportunity as a guide to lead politics whenever it comes across a particularly difficult and treacherour issue in politics.

Instead it is the good intentions of the leaders and good common sense that guides and instructs on how to solve problems. However, as has been well documented and argued by Hayek and many others "being good" and having "good intentions" is exactly the type of politics that preceeded the nazi takeover in Germany. Socialism and communism always leads to fascism and dictatorship. Without fail.

Low paid workers for a certain class of the population. What will this lead us to? What will happen to those Swedes and probably in many cases 2nd generation immigrants who depend on these already low paid jobs?

Does cause and effect ever come into the heads of the political nobility before they utter a word or even go as far as writing a whole book?

What about Swedes who have lived in Sweden all their life and paid a humongous amount of taxes, who leave and come back, now with kids? No parental leave for them? Despite the fact that they saved and contributed towards that throughout their life?

Folkpartiet is a truly braindead party devoid any vision or ideas to take Sweden into a better place.

Rather it is sticky tape, plaster and soldering on with the same old planning ideas, more rules, more red tape, more regulations, more interferance, more special rules etc..............

This is what got people to commit suicide in the first place after they were utförsäkrade. Good intentions led to chaos for a substantial part of the population.

The former liberal leaders who were inspired by Bastiat, the Manchester liberals and the concepts that the French revolution put up as high ideals are all spinning in their graves.

Cornelius: "Unemployment is not of any political party's making"

I have heard this uttered so many times now, and it is usually a fp politician. I am getting truly sick of it hearing it from "liberals".

Sweden has unemployment because the state has been directed to extract too much money from the population in taxes and fees, but the problem is that the divine superhumans who direct the state is no match at all for the free market and cannot keep up with creating lasting wealth creating jobs for the population that then needs to seek and have their employment from the state.

If you understood economics you would understand this.

If you set the taxation pressure at 50% it means that 50% of your time goes to work for the state. If the state has no ideas on what to do with all that time, you will be unemployed.

In the good old days (when men were...) we paid these taxes not in money but in actual work. We really went out, walked up to the castle and waited patiently at the gates for instructions on what to do, what new fortress to build or which field to sow or harvest. If the nobleman was too drunk or uncaring we did nothing and we were unemployed. If things got really bad, his superior found out and chopped his head off.

Now we don't do that any more, we pay taxes in money.

That does not mean that the system is any different.

At 50% taxation, for 100 kr earned in the private sector 50 kr goes to the state.

Two people in the private sector therefore earns 100 kr and the state earns 100 kr.

The state can employ one person at the same rate, 100 kr but hey ho public sector workers also "pay" taxes and therefore "pay back" 50 kr. So we employ another person for the state.

So now you have 4 people working, two originating the income or as it really should be called *surplus* and two consuming it working for the public sector.The only problem is that out of the two public sector guys, one might be working and the other one is sitting outside the castle waiting for instructions on what to do.

DO YOU UNDERSTAND?

I get so frustrated with you lot.

1968 taxation pressure in Sweden the same as it is today in the UK.

1958 taxation pressure in Sweden the same as it is today in the US.

Do you think people were starving back then, in Sweden?

Now be a good boy and run over to SCB and check how many worked for the public sector + unemployed back then and report back to us.

Hint: it will be close to 38% and 26%. Amazing right? Who would have known! Awesome.

And hey we had capital goods back then. We didn't consume it as we went along. Sure enough it is never a good idea for the state to own liquor companies or real estate firms but to sell off 112 bn kr just to be able to stand there and say public debt lower than before, when you just sold of something to make it up, while structurally there is no difference whatsoever?

It has a name in capitalism. Balance sheet cannibalism. It is the opposite of capitalism, which is all about *accumulating* capital not sell it out for a pittance.

...and while I am at it. Reinfeldt. We will start to cut taxes.

Let's think about this. Let's say we half taxes (to show effect).

Same two private sector people: 200 kr, but they now keep 150 kr.

Taxes: 50 kr

Two public sector workers. They have to be paid 100kr but we only have 50 kr. Now we are in trouble.

We pay the first one 100 kr but we only got 25 kr back. What are we going to tell the second guy?

It won't happen. Not here in Sweden. Reason: salaries cannot fall due to the union system. Government Carl Bildt already tried this and saw public debt sky rocket.

Solution:

If taxes fell to 25% we can only afford to keep one worker, receiving net 50 kr.

And this actually makes sense, because if you suddenly halved taxes the required profit margins in the private sector would have to fall too. The remaining worker in the public sector would see real wages rise, because deflation and competition in the private sector would lower prices.

And that my friend is why everybody is afraid to do it. It would put a some really large ten inch nails into the Keynesian coffin and it would destroy the debt based fiat system.

And the rich who embrace Keynes and socialism as a moat around the castle to keep the pleibians out would be terrified because capitalism is hard for everyone - competition might spank them back to poverty.

what about highly educated European immigrants, that moved here with a good CV and are stuck because they are MARRIED to a Swede?

We don't seem to integrate either...

I was a PR manager for 10 years in my country, i have been offered only cleaning jobs at AMS....

I also speak 4 languages, including Swedish....

So? wouldn't this just open a gate to abuse foreign working force? are we getting closer to slavery? are we starting to legalize having A class and B class residents?

There should be more corporate politics like at Ikea, where they have to have workers that represent a sample of the nationalities living in their areas.

@MTH

Thats right, i agree with you. If the rich Western Countries like Sweden really want to help, they should take the development to these poor countries and implement some serious development projects that would actually help these poor economies. Better to teach a man how to catch fish instead of giving him fish.

#35

I can definitely identify with you. First time that I was unemployed, is when I moved to Sweden. I thought after having 14 years experience working in engineering, that I will be able to transfer my skills to Sweden. Not the case. Since my education and experience were not from Sweden, I was basically rejected.

I finally ended up in Norway, where I had no problem finding work.

"Swedes don't even like themselves, so how the hell do you pretend that they like immigrants or refugees?"

Totally agree with you!

Taxalien,

Perhaps here is your first and last word:

“Party politics in Sweden can be summarised as being a choice of which particular flavour of socialism you want:”

http://www.thelocal.se/discuss/index.php?s...c=33284&hl=

The government cannot do the impossible.

Unemployment figures have been constant and dilating at around 7% these several years under both lefty, right and centre governments and you want us to believe that if they adopted your miracle theory there would be no unemployment? Perhaps with the rest of the immigrant population as “the permanent underclass” working as hewers of wood and carriers of water – for a minimum wage instead of social welfare could be feasible?

Today, it looks like everybody ( well, almost everybody) loves Anders Borg, and not just because of his pony tail. The Swedish Conservatives also - to almost the same extent liked Kjell Olof Feldt, throughout his period as the Social Democrat's Minister of Finance. Whilst the Liberal Folk Partiet's Ann Wibble, got some of the greatest praise from The Economist, the FT, and the BBC, during her reign as potus of Sweden's finance policies.

As far as I can remember, since I first arrived in Sweden ( from Ghana) for a summer holiday honeymoon and to meet my wife's kith and kin in 1970, the traditional tug of war between Swedish Social Democracy ( during the Gunnar Sträng era) and the Swedish Conservative “Moderate” and Liberal forces has been on two main issues: the “Let the markets forces decide” Conservatives ( who I can only compare them with the British Conservative Party with whom I am more familiar) have always blared that taxes should be lowered so that the private sector can take off and afford to create more jobs, employ people etc. and of course the Social Democrats who, although they have gradually ( almost surreptitiously) moved from left to centre and are ever moving to the right, still maintain the ideology of lowering taxes and securing the social welfare model that they built through a 40 year period of continuous social democrat governance.

I have gone through some of the ideas that you have forwarded to this forum and cannot say that at least you are consistent, because ( perhaps I have not understood you as you intended and that's why although I'm docile I cannot reconcile the contradictions that seem so evident. Your strong anti-socialist tendencies are clear from your earlier statements, especially your grand vision with which would like to take us back to, as you say “the individual freedom that Sweden was renowned for before 1960s restored. That is when we had the 2nd strongest economy in the world. There is only one country that grew faster than Sweden and that was Japan.”

At the same time, you say “It is reasonable to privatise companies.” etc. Posted on: 9.Aug.2010, 12:11 PM

http://www.thelocal.se/discuss/index.php?s...c=33365&hl=

Is Michael Moore's forecast going to come true on 19th September( 9-19)?:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz...Moore+on+Sweden

Before making any comments look at the Eastern Europeans. Sweden should rather support them instead of feeding the parasites who expect more and equal rights without having any proper knowledge.

If you visit Baltic states or all the countries which are in EU bordered to Russia you people will understand that the parasites in Sweden are very happily provided with food and shelter. I researched that the gap between rich and poor is very big and that I found out that in some of these countries there are no middle class people at all. They even cannot pay for the local transport which costs around 5 kronor each trip. They earn almost nothing.

Cornelius Hamelberg ( from Ghana !)

you seem to be an incient lad with ancient ideas . It does not help that your comments are both too long and disjointed .

Sir , this is not about what "harm" Sabuni has done to somebody, it is about her failure to stand up and be counted when Africans are unfairly treated by the government she works for as Minister of Intergration .

You must remember that not everybody immigrates to Sweden to meet a wife. Some of these people have horrible stories to tell . There are women activists , lawyers and politicians that have done their bit to see that immigrants are well treated , and that even if they have to be deported , it is done with dignity . Sabuni should be one of them , but she is cconspicously not . That bothers a few of us .

What makes Sabuni so special that she cannot show any respect to the immigrants before she can recture about intergratiing them ?

@Cornelius

You explanations sound very fuzzy. In my opinion there are two important points in @Taxalien arguments, one is the equality right and another one the fair of "competition" in Swedish labour market. The Sabuni's opinion on integration is concentrated on the new comers refugees. Actually immigrants in the last two decades are mostly refugees, and refugee is a person who may impose him/herself by illegal entry (which mostly had done), but surely refugees cannot impose a government to give citizenship to them, and if they get the citizenship, it's just because the authority wants it for some reasons and when the refugee is a Swedish citizen then he/she has the full citizenship right without any distinction with a Swede. Now, about the first five years to be integrated by low wage job, actually the problem is not when the refugee is not educated, because there is a good possibility to be educated in the first five years; the problem is when the refugee is educated and can't get job! Any by getting job, there is not any guaranty for integration (unless you assay it by low Swedish standards). But why the can't get job by their education is in the subject of "competition" , I stop in here.

It is DISCRIMINATION , stupid !

A skilled immigrant from Germany or Spain that can hardly construct one sentense in either Swedish or English is more likely to get a job in Sweden that an egually skilled immigrant from Africa South America or any Arabic country .

A Uganda trained surgeon was once denied a medical practice certificate in Sweden ; but when when some Swedish sugeons found out that the man had very special skills , one famous hospital around Stockhold invited him to act as a surgical consultant , a job he performed brilliantly in perfect English . That man was later responsible for training a lot of medical students .

This means that the Ugandan surgeon was not denied work because he was unqualified ; he was blocked because Sweden still has that type of people who are either suffering from superiority complexies or are too insecure to open their doors for other people .

Well, we'll see it her proposals can be implemented in reality. I fully supported her. Enough of parasites living off social n child benefits. Time for them to sweat a bit. Only the leftists, communists n parasites are protesting.

This is silly as it discriminates between "foreign-born" and non-foreign-born.

Why don't they just put a cap on this parental leave above a certain age for the kid? Foreign born or not!

Sheesh...

she came from a place that was in deep s**t (that's why she came I guess) and now she wanna do the same here.

Lower wages for teens is one thing as they don't have too many reponsibilities + don't have experience etc, BUT lower wages for immigrats is racist... plain and simple.

@Jes Great comments, however I would have to disagee with your theory that "white" swedes are being just bigots.

They are practicing racism.

Dr. Frances Cress Welsing has said:

Functional Definition Of Racism = White Supremacy = Apartheid:

"As a black behavioral scientist and practicing psychiatrist, my own functional definition of racism (white supremacy) is as follows: "Racism (white supremacy) is the local and global power system and dynamic, structured and maintained by persons who classify themselves as white, whether consciously or subconsciously determined; which consists of patterns of perception, logic, symbol formation, thought, speech, action, and emotional response, as conducted, simultaneously in all areas of people activity (economics, education, entertainment, labor, law, politics, religion, sex, and war); for the ultimate purpose of white genetic survival and to prevent white genetic annihilation on planet Earth - a planet upon which the vast and overwhelming majority of people are classified as nonwhite (black, brown, red and yellow) by white skinned people, and all of the nonwhite people are genetically dominant (in terms of skin coloration) compared to the genetic recessive white skin people"

Black African people should be aware that any black person who buys into an inter-racial marriage can in no way stand up and support the black race completely. He or she will compensate psychological or physical defense mechanisms to protect his her white wife or husband and in many ways shield their own conscience. Sabuni fits this discription perfectly.

Statements and proposals from ''Integration and Gender Equality Minister'' are always funny.

Nyamko Sabuni some questions for you.

1. Does it means that foreign born children are not equal to the children bon in Sweden?????????

2. Foreign born children don't need attention and time from Parents in the same way as Swedish born children????

3. If parents will not get same money from Försäkringskassan for Parental leave for foreign born child as they get for Swedish born child, do you think they will spend time with foreign born children?????

4. Isn't it discrimination with Foreign born children????

5. Foreign born children needs more time and attention from Parents to help them to adjust in new environment. If Sabuni don't want parents to help their kids to adjust in new environment and want to put parents in Labour market, did she thinked, what impact it will have on the children.

for Low wage jobs, it doesn't seems a statement from a ''Swedish Minister''.

I think she should always ''think'' before giving such statements or suggessions. her ''thinking process'' stopped after becoming a ''Minister''

Good luck with her and her Party in coming elections

Jes ( short for Jesus?) –

I'll get to“ Skatty” in a while ( I'm not aware of having “explained “ or trying to explain anything.)

I'm still being polite and civilized with you – I'm not here to lecture or “recture” you or to correct your essays. Ama just chatting. I could ignore you as part of the idle wind which blows from Östersjön; the wind which Caesar respects not.

My last comments such as they are – were not addressed to you but to a more interesting and from my point of view contemporary person called “Taxalien”. Didn't you notice that or are you not a straight A student? Too long and disjointed for whom ? You? Who are you? What is my purpose?

I suppose that you would find John Fowles “The Aristos” disjointed, not to talk of Norman O. Brown. Don't you know the significance of paragraphing? For me, usually ideas are assembled in neat paragraphs, of course here I'm talking to everybody.

I'm not an economist (No, very formally speaking, as an ancient ( it was such a long time ago, I graduated in English and Philosophy, and you may think that I am “an incient lad with ancient ideas “, because I study the Torah - or read Heraclitus on change, but I am very much of a contemporary man, get news alerts from the New York Times, read the FT, have my own contacts, and contacts of contacts and read this, daily:

http://www.dailyalert.org/

No I'm not from Ghana, like Social Democrats' Joe Frans, who is married to Nyamko Sabuni's sister. My wife and I did postgraduate studies there at Legon – the University of Ghana – she in African history and politics – whilst I was more interested in African Dramatic arts and Literature.

I don't know where you are from, but my reaction to the rude fellow called Khazar who said such nauseous things about Nyamko Sabuni was the question what harm has she done to you? ( If he said the same about me, I'd kick his ass with the same kind of language that he was permitted to use.)

Having got all the above clear please make no mistake about this: you seem to think that if an Iranian were appointed to Nyamko Sabuni's position, her primary function would be to take care of Iranian refugee problems. Africans are not the only foreigners in Sweden you know, in fact there are considerably fewer Africans in Sweden, than say Iranians, Kurds, Arabs...check it out... and it's not only Nyamko Sabuni's responsibility – it's also yours to keep the dialogue going with critiques of the government's performance in every department. “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” ? Where have you been all this time?

Yes Sir or Madam, I can confirm that “not everybody immigrates to Sweden to meet a wife.” I didn't. I got married at the American Embassy in , Freetown, Sierra Leone, where my first cousin Lucy Hamelberg was a Secretary and moved to Sweden two years later. Having said that I must point out that I am very well acquainted with the African Diaspora in Sweden and their problems. By the African Diaspora I mean North, South, East and West Africa, the Caribbean, North America, Afro Brits and first and second generation Africans living in Europe, and a few from Basra.

Talking about women activists ( like the very admirable Mariam Osman Sherifay) lawyers and politicians, did you by any chance watch this very moving interview which I also watched last night?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/hardtalk/8912269.stm

At the very beginning of her ministerial career she did get into hot waters with a generally over-sensitive African community, when she took up a problem that she and many people in this country feel, has to be addressed, namely the so called Female Genital Mutilation ( FGM) which was discussed here, in an African Forum and perhaps you would like to add that to your agenda of showing respect for other people’s sexual values etc.:

You could type SABUNI in the search engine that pops up here:

http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?A0=gambia-l

Mr.Cornelius Hamelberg ,

if you have that desire to wave your CV , you are doing it in a wrong place . This is an open site where anybody is free to give their own opinions . My opinion is that you write a lot of things that don´t really connect . I could be wrong .

I am less bothered to which University you and your wonderful wife went to or where you got married . Congrats all the same .

My other opinions about Sabuni are based on what I ( not you ) think of her , as a former refugess in Burundi and later in Sweden . I would expect her to have some moral connection with the Irania refugees if her family had lived in Iran as refugees . Iam sure that if a Swedish immigrant was mistreated in Congo or anywhere in Africa , it would naturally be some Swede to shout louder about it .

By the way , for what reason did Mariam Osman have to address the FGM ? According to your philosophical thinking , one should not have to deal with these kind of issues unless it is "their responsibility", right ?

Did Mariam Osman have to be Africas Minister before she could take on a hot one that some nuts threatened her life for ?

Anyway , I think that you are a very fanny man , Mister Hamelberg .

Your biograpy is also very impressive . On another day in another place , I would envy you .....

Jes is short for Jespa . don´t put me in trouble with Jesus, okay ?

@cornelius

My purpose has never been to write a book in here, but seems that yours is!

Jeez,

Look through all the issues here:

http://www.israpundit.com/

It's always a moral question.

No,

I wouldn't say that “one should not have to deal with these kind of issues unless it is "their responsibility", right ?”

If my sister Nyamko Sabuni bothers you so much, why not take your case to the Police, or to the Immigration Department, or to Human Rights Watch, or to Amnesty International or better still to Gudrun Schyman? Or report the matter to the Prime Minister, for some disciplinary action ?

Even Jack Straw, was not above the law!

You say that your opinions are based on what you think and not what I think. Congratulations. You could go ahead and be a solipsist for all I care. You could / can even be a fanny man if you think that's funny.

I hope that this is intelligible to you: I have not been waving any CV – and my CV ( I have two) certainly does not end with my first visit to Sweden. I was merely explaining that just as you say you are not part of the trinity or from heaven, so too I'm not from Ghana.

You may be right and you may be wrong sitting here in our social paradise, the place where we are privileged to meet as polite human beings, not necessarily to enjoy lifelong intellectual companionship

You may be right, having read Popper, Satre or Marcuse, that all the dots don't connect in your head – there could always be the missing piece - as you know some heads are bigger than other heads – and as to length – since you complain about that too, some are “ too long” and I assure you that for now at least, mine is not dis-jointed., not even at the hip or at your fanny.

I should suppose that both Lady Nyamko Sabuni and Mariam Osman Sherifay are träffbar, should you want to have more meaningful discussions with either of them - or with your member of parliament.

Now there are many questions that may be arising in your weak, little mind and since two heads are better than one I advise that pay close attention to what the fuzz or fuzzy “Skatty” has to say about competition.

And whilst you are at it – at pointing out defects, you could try to learn the grammar and the alphabet and at least spell correctly so that your well worded intentions do not go astray or miss being correctly interpreted and understood. I mean common words like biography not “biograpy”( 800 pages or longer) - and then there's always the danger of doing what Khazara did, of committing what's known as the biographical heresy – ascribing this and that nigga behaviour to yourself or someone else, all based on some scurrilous gradgrindian facts that you have so scurrilously put together to explain the prejudice of your own peculiar point of view.

If you are also interested in the lingo this should not be too irrelevant:

http://groups.google.com/group/usaafricadi...1db74695bfae7aa

No reason to feel insecure,

Ta-ta for now

PS

Skatty, ask your friend Jes, whether he's ever heard of this guy:

http://www.sweden.gov.se/sb/d/7576

@Khazara , personally , I prefer judging people by what they project rather than which kind of social class or situation they belong to or find themselves in .

It is for that reason that I am neither anti or pro inter-racial marrieges . I will agree with you , though , my own obseveration is that in Sweden , most black women who marry white men seem to carry an attitude . They tend to go about with that air of " having arrived " .Evidence is usually their fair skinned kids . It becomes tough if they had real black ones before . I am told this causes a lot conflicts within the families .

I asked one African lady why she chose a white man instead of a black one from Africa . Her response made it worse . She said that white men have better manners and have better respect for women/ wives . She forgot to remember that she was this guys 3rd wife !

I told her that this was her own illusion that , sadly , her mans record does not support . I also agree that it can be difficult for people who are in inter-racial arrangements to tackle the issue of racism with honesty . One of the "side effects" of living with a wife/ husband from a different race is that you may tend to surrender your "OWN SELF" to your spouce in order to prove that you are part of him/her. If you are a public figure like Sabuni , you will either make hard or patronising statements ( on immigrants ) or simply say nothing . By so doing , you will show the white public that you are " no prisoner " of race ; that you have been totally freed of primitive Africanism.

You are therefore more likely to hear the Sabunis placing Swedish language skills as a condition to citizenship , than people like Mona .

So we will integrate immigrants better by putting them into a lower social class right of the bat?

Yeah that sounds logical

Wow, just read Khazara's last post.

That Dr. Frances Cress Welsing is the biggest unabashed racist I have heard about in a long time.

Let me tell you all something.

Sweden doesn't grant asylum on Poverty.

And 99 % of asylum seekers are almost poor in their countries. So, if such people come here and live on low wages they should be thankful and happy to live here.

Such parasites are encouraged only in Sweden. Look in Eastern Europe and come back. They already have their own local white and Russian beggars on the streets. You can count coloured people on streets. Because, you almost see very few brown or black people. Why?

Eastern Europe doesn't encourage such parasites. They just keep quite. They almost take none refugees. So, is the reason they flock around westwards.

primitive Africanism. ?

The observing eye might be in need of an eye transplant.

It's really sick, all this trashy amateur Nazi, chicken- & kitchen-sink psychologizing and generalising about so called inter-racial marriage, by people who are not “inter-racially”married (which is a marriage between two human beings such as former Secretary of Defence William Cohen and his wife Janet Langhart ) and yet based on their very limited observations some people , who don't know any better, want to be the expert negative propaganda centres about the experience of living/ being in such a relationship.

Or some uncircumcised, big white hairy ape, wants to tell me - a simple or complex human being about how I feel about me or how somebody's mother feels about herself – as if they are in somebody else's skin and as if if they know what they are talking about.

Some incognito or anonymous white cracker telling me what it's like to be black because they happened to read

“Black Skins White Masks.”

Someone should pay some attention here and start a re-education about the value of being human at the Center for Human Values headed by this guy:

http://www.google.com/search?q=Kwame+Anthony+Appiah

Or spend some time with him:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=...do+Lewis+Gordon

It is not only Nyamko Sabuni who has rightly emphasised the importance of at least acquiring rudimentary Swedish as an aid to adapting to the new environment in which Swedish is the main language of communication and that it's a very necessary language acquisition if the immigrant should want to integrate ( of course if he or she is not interested in integration or assimilation, or getting a job for which the Swedish language is necessary, then the lack of Swedish Language cannot be a problem.

I am an expert on racism, but not about to start a long or short discussion about it here with some bigots.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=...en&q=Racism

Cornelius Hammarbag , haha , the joke is on you ear-e h--e !

You started off as an old but fine rag from the 60s who thought he knew much : Suddenly you sound like a little spoilt brat whose toy has been snatched away .

Why on earth should an educated fellow think that if I don´t like what Sabuni ideologically s for ,I should take her to the police , Human rights Watch or something ? what kind of primitive thinking is this ?

Sir , life does not work like that . Public life comes with its own down-sides , one of which is that one gets to be critisized every now and then .

This is exactly what I thought I was doing until you started sobbing in "lingo"

Gosh , what would you fool say had I called her a criminal which I think she is not ?

Man , you sound like a dictator who is intoxicated with a high doze of narcissistic self-promotion .

Oj ,I wish I could apologize for stepping on your bubble !

Look here wet twart , do you have to be so childish? How old are you anyway , from the 70s going to 13 ?

Well , isn´t it just a shame that a bloke that writes and can master so much "lingo" and can really really spell tough words such as "biography" so well can turn into an infantile mourner in a twinkle of an eye !

Camelberg , the trouble is that you chose to bring your drunked head here . If you can`t take it , leave . Should you stay , count on the possibility that someone like me will step on your glass toes . That is the deal Mister 2 CV .

I hope that Sabuni is more mature than her cheer-leader .

By the way , is this the correct spelling of "deal" or is it still fuzz or fuzzy Popper Satre ?

IDIOT !

You can call yourself Jes and shout from your snout... that's ok.

Men will be men and be satisfied with who they are.

Louse,

“ Criticism is as inevitable as breathing” ( Somebody said that a long time ago)

The correct spelling is spouse, not “spouce “

indefinitely, not “indefinately”

sentence not “ sentense “

complexes not “complexies”

refugee not “ refugess “

criticized, not “ critisized “

dose, not “doze “

Cornelius Hamelberg, not “Cornelius Hammarbag” or “Camelberg “

“drunked head” ? Trying to be cute are you, or are you thinking about your shruken head – or may be you need to see a shrink?

Jesse? Jeez?

“See the primitive wallflower freeze

When the jelly-faced women all sneeze

Hear the one with the mustache say, "Jeez

I can't find my knees"

Great guys:

http://www.onlinenigeria.com/music/seagulls/

Great man :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kotK9FNEYU

What you still have to develop is a sense of huma correctly spelled, humour.

And if the devil ( fan) wants to take you

you can go and tell the police..

Lastly, I have two Cvs : One is official, the other is a secret document dressed in rags and not meant for outsiders like you.

" And if the devil wants to take you you can go and tell the police "

HAHA, what an intellectual mind !

Scumbag,

There are all types of people here.

Nyamko Sabuni is more of an intellectual than you are

@cornelius

I went through you recent comments. You sound like that I should get your permission or book time to write comments in here. I look at the comments, some sound interesting and I involve; which means sometimes suggest, sometime praise, sometimes use other's ideas to say something. I mean there is not copy right protection in here, is it! And it helps to prevent long writing in the box. About the grammar, it sucks, I know, but obviously I don't care, I believe it's understandable and it is enough for "The local" readers! About Sabuni, I have never seen her or listened to her (don't have TV). I have criticized her suggestions, the weakness of her suggestions (in a compact way). You seems unusually very sensitive and protective to her! Have a nice time.

Sure , she is .That is why she is a Minister and I am not .

But does that mean that I am forbidden from disgreeing with her self -appointed cheer-leader ? I think not !

Mister Hamelberg , you really have a lot of self-respect issues. I intentionally shook ( or should I say shaked ?) your tree , and look at what come down!

At the end of the day , it is now impossible to tell which one of us is more refined than the other . You are as uncouth , as uncultured , as foul-mouthed as any cyber fool who cannot spell "spausi" correctly . I have helped to prove the point that claims don´t buy class .

Tongue in cheek , I bet that other intellectuals of your endangered species are now very proud of your contributions here .

But then , if you share space with a badly raised pet , you get used to few noises -sometimes .

Incidentaly , I have been told by a few people who have visted several of your blogs that , plus those who have met you personally that you are a bully . So far , I have no reason to conclude that they are wrong . They have other stories to share about you , but that is your life and nobodys .

Your mistake is that you confused this place with those blogs you operate . ´Wrong , this is THE LOCAL , a meeting place for all sorts of vistors . We come here to comment , not to "market" what products are on which Google , youtube , onlinenigeria ,etc etc .

This is not a judgement , but a statement of fact . Relevancy is a philosophical virtue. Strayers stand to be checked .

Finally , it is quite amusing to notice that a man who studied philosophy , the owner of 2 CVs , cannot figure out that there are people here who use English as a 3rd language . Some may seek the help of a spelling corrector ,or a LO , while others may want to appear "live". Confident souls stay unbothered , either way .Content remains the object .

I will soon be back to say my last words to you . Hold your poetic fire .

”Skatty”?

Sounds more like a shortened or affectionate form of ”scatter-brained”.

Certainly sounds more scatter-brained than Anders Borg's tax system which makes a lot more sense to me, than you do.

You probably think that when I say that, I am using ”other's ideas to say something” That's OK with me, and so is the history of ideas in Western and some other philosophies, Eastern, Jewish, etc. - even if that sucks to your own, very personal, scatter-brained or skatty way of thinking. All men are equal, sure, but some are more equal than others when it comes to the grey matter up there. You are no exception and moreover it's obvious that unlike me, English is not your mother tongue and must be your third or fourth language, therefore the jihad – the struggle to say what you want to say, and even the greater struggle to understand what you read.

Perhaps all of the above would be more comprehensible to you in Arabic or the King's Swedish?

Please continue, if you will: your words:

”some sound interesting and I involve; which means sometimes suggest, sometime praise,”?

”copy right protection in here, is it! And it helps to prevent long writing in the box.”???

Precisely what are you struggling to say ? ( or as Dr. Ojo often asks, “ What is you point?”

N.B. Copyright is one word. A word, not two.

Balaam's ass could see that which Balaam could not (see) and the power through which Balaam's ass could speak is the same power through which I say what I say. This does not mean to say that it's the evil one and not ignorance that is guiding your high-falutin praise of yourself when you say things like ”About the grammar, it sucks, I know, but obviously I don't care, I believe it's understandable and it is enough for "The local" readers!”

I'm used to keeping much more intelligent company than what you can provide or comprehend or appreciate.

Is there any reason why I should pay you any mind, or waste more time, talking to you?

Think about it.

Now let me see what your sidekick and comrade-in-arms “Jes” ( pronounced Yes?) has to say and what kind of foul breeze he is puffing out ,today. Perhaps, he is still bursting at the seams with his great racist idea that if Sister Nymako were white ( like Santa Claus' beard) or greyish and profound like old Karl Marx's beard which is still buried ina Inglan then she'd have different suggestions for your intellectually much weaker self to criticize, as you say, ”in a compact way”

But for now, if you'll excuse me I'll just check this out ( a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do read and understand some a-this

http://www.freeman.org/other.htm

and then I'll get around to updating my blog with ” The Battle for Sweden”

Don't go away.

@cornelius

Actually, there is not any reason for you to pay any attention to me or waste your time talking with me, but you do; you pay attention to me and talk with me, and this is you weakness!

From the sublime to the ad hominem and the personal: you say of your friends, that “They have other stories to share about you” - meaning me. My name is Cornelius Edward Hamelberg. What's yours? I am not anonymous, I have eight great-grandparents. By all means go ahead and share your friends' stories about me - and I hope that that's all they are - stories. Perhaps one of them will even win the next Caine Prize:

http://groups.google.com/group/usaafricadi...9ea5c65e62235bc

Some of your language trademarks that I can identify because I have encountered them before and the general manner in which you express yourself and your attitude indicates the part of Africa from which you hail; all that's missing now, is your regional accent - and of course your IP address.

Do yourself a favour and take note the term “ intellectual “, which seems to hold a lot of fascination for you, is really not very important to a fool like me.

“Jes”,

You are invisible yes

but on display and free

to jest and make a fool of not me

but your most intelligent self called Jes.

You say that ” At the end of the day , it is now impossible to tell which one of us is more refined than the other”. You really think so?

There is no doubt about the matter because it's very easy to see that according to how you would like to define refine, you are more refined and from head to toe, much more easily defined.

You are probably more integrated, assimilated, sophisticated, cultured, complicated, crazy, intellectual, charismatic, musical, holy, rich. You may even dig Otis Redding or Chopin on your way home to your paradise which is really of no great importance to me, personally, and you can greet your people in hell if you happen to wind up there, after all.

You “have been told by a few people who have visited several of your blogs” about me, eh?

Well I only have one blog and that's “ We Sweden”. Which other blogs are they talking about?

I'm also on Facebook, and you are free to visit me there.

Me, a bully?

That's news to me. I thought that my weak point is too much CHESED, especially to Africans.

You can agree with Shakespeare or Karl Marx himself for all I care.

anonymous as you are,

or go and bury yourself and your little head in a hole

like a mole.

Still far from the topic of all the good things that Nyamko Sabuni is doing for your immigrant and economic refugee kith and kin:

You say that “Finally , it is quite amusing to notice that a man who studied philosophy , the owner of 2 CVs , cannot figure out that there are people here who use English as a 3rd language “

My “poetic fire”? So you think that the fire of hell is poetic/ metaphorical and not real?

And the virgins?

My advice to you is simple: Stay amused and I hope that your last words to me will be more amusing than your first word.

Now let me just zap through this

http://www.dailyalert.org/

and then in about an hours time you can check me out, for yourself in We Sweden, it's my reaction to the headlines in today's Dagens Nyheter.

YES , Mr. Cornelius Edward Hamelberg , you just made me laugh some more . Frankly , you could earn a better living as a comedian .You actually look like a comedian ( on weed )

So many grand-parent ?

Man , you are lucky ! Some of us just dropped from a tree and have no are not sure we were even born by women , you see ?

But seriuosly , your tast 2 comments comfirm what a baby you are . Old men should not be saying the kind of things you say . A 13 year girl would glady borrow some of your lines to send to a rival teen-ager.

I am glad that I followed someone`s tip . She was spot on about you , Sir .

I am now happy to move on , but I will still follow what you write . It costs me nothing ,really .

By the way :

1)Nyamko Sabuni is an immigrant , just like all "immigrants ".Aslo , she was a refugee in Burundi and Sweden . If she is doing " all those good things" she needs to be reminded that there were people who did " good things" for her( and her family ) that made it possible for her to be where she is at today .

2) if you think that I am from Africa ,I glad to say that I wish you were right . Apparently , you have not been talking to an Octopus .

Somebody should give you the adress .

Cheers mate !!