After a curious claim by a bartender about Swedes' manners, The Local's Oliver Gee looks deeper into the question of whether a whole nation may be more polite when using English instead of Swedish.
I was sitting in a bar recently, observing an English-speaking bartender in an Irish pub, while he charmingly dominated some small talk with a bunch of Swedes.
Later, after I discovered that he was both proficient and educated in Swedish, I asked him why he’d chosen to speak English with the customers.
He got serious all of a sudden and glanced around the room. Checked on the Svenssons to make sure they were still having a good time. Then he leaned in close, confiding in me.
I could smell the stale chili nuts on his breath.
“The secret to getting by in Sweden isn’t learning Swedish,” he said.
“Certainly, learn it, embrace it, but the real secret is knowing when to stick to English. You see, Swedes are more polite in English.”
I was stunned. Gobsmacked even. I’d never considered this before. I’d always got better help in English, sure, but I’d put that down to the fact that Swedes understand my English better than my Swedish.
The bartender continued.
“If you need or want something from a Swede,
always speak English.”
“How do you mean,” I asked.
“Well, if I’ve got the wrong train ticket, I’ll speak English. If I’m in a shop and need something a little out of the ordinary, English. Nightclub bouncers, unquestionably English. And the best secret of all, for me anyway, is that Swedes are much better tippers if the conversation has been in English.”
Almost as if on cue, a smiling Swede waved farewell from the other side of the bar, and the bartender picked up the pile of change he’d left behind.
“Goodbye,” they both yelled, very apparently in English, I noted.
I’ll admit, this whole concept was new to me, and if true, rather frustrating. I’d spent my formative Swedish-speaking months working in a bar, struggling with new Swedish words, heading home with empty pockets and a twisted tongue.
I should note that my bartending was even more questionable than my Swedish, but my pockets were still empty and I still can’t make a good martini.
Sober reflection on the bartender’s words aroused my curiosity. Are Swedes more polite in English? Is purposely speaking English the secret handshake that opens doors to unknown opportunity.
Ask a foreigner, they may agree. But what about if you ask a Swede?
I’ve since asked regular Swedes about these revelations and they’ve all been floored.
“That’s ridiculous,” they protest, “We don’t act differently… do we?”
Well, do they? Do Swedes tip more, help more, chat more just because they’re speaking the expat’s lingua franca? It’s a well-known fact that people have different personalities when speaking different languages. So is the backup Swedish personality a more polite one?
I talked to a Swedish expert on etiquette, manners and style - Magdalena Ribbing - author of 15 books on the subject and columnist for the Dagens Nyheter (DN) newspaper.
Her response was frank and surprising.
“Well, this isn’t something I’ve noticed as I mostly talk to Swedes in Swedish. But I can say this: Swedes are not particularly polite, generally speaking,” she told me.
“Pleasantries are not a Swedish specialty. The ‘please’, ‘thank you’ and ‘excuse me’s’ have not been needed, and not been used.”
But why not? Does this mean that Swedes are not actually more polite in English, rather, that they’re rude in Swedish?
“In short, people just aren’t accustomed to being polite while speaking Swedish,” Ribbing said.
“It’s a question of national adaptation. It’s also a cultural thing. In France, everyone is polite – provided you’re speaking French. People are always walking around saying ‘Bonjour madame, bonjour monsieur’ but you never hear a ‘Goddag min dam’ in Sweden.
“You see, this a vast country, and people have not been talking to one another for a long time. In Britain, where a much bigger population lives in a much smaller place, the English are simply forced to talk more, and a certain politeness has naturally developed.”
Interesting. So the etiquette expert reveals that the population density of Sweden makes people “less polite” than in other countries. But what about when they speak English.
“That’s a good question and I don’t really have an answer for it. We can only speculate,” she said.
I went back to the bar for some more speculation. Instead of asking the bartender why he speaks English, I asked him why he thought Swedes were more polite.
He had a more concrete theory. He claimed it’s because people feel they’re back on holiday when they’re in his bar. Happier times, perhaps. I’ve asked other bartenders since, especially in Irish bars, and their stories are the same.
Others claim it might be because Swedes get caught off guard, perhaps a little nervous and eager to please – the famous “be nice to a tourist” syndrome. Perhaps it’s because they want to show-off their often impeccable talents with their back-up language (and I stress, Swedes are brilliant at English).
So, whether it’s true that Swedes are naturally “ruder” in Swedish, or whether Swedes are simply happier and thus politer in English, we’ll probably only ever be able to speculate.
But if you’re a Swede reading this, make a note to see if you act differently when speaking English, and then, more importantly – ask yourself why.
Meanwhile, if you’re a struggling bartender, Swedish or otherwise, take the next customer in English and let me know how it goes for you.
And if the tips start rolling in, grab me a martini. On you.
I’ve gotta learn sometime.
Oliver Gee
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Silly profanity filter on thelocal.
Swedes are taught how to use 'polite' English, and don't handle conflict in English very well, (Swedes don't handle conflict very well in general). They know how to be formal in structure, even using profanity, and don't have the common usage and abbriviated structure that allow one to be disagreeable in English.
I think it's due to the fact that Swedes (at least the under 50's) enjoy speaking English as they don't get to do it so often.
One big reason for this is that your position in a discussion is stronger if your opponent does not speak in his/her mother tongue. And Swedes are polite enough to stock to English, also in discussions of course. (the same strategy would not work in France).
i dont get why the swedes are infatuated with america, england and the like, they have a much better society then either of these places.
Speaking Swedish for me has meant that I can get things done in shorter time and sometimes if they had been impossible if I was English speaking.
There had been one time I remember when I opened a beer just outside systembolaget and half way through the bottle a vakt came towards me, keeping cool, I talked in my British English and surprisingly he let me be, just asked to "go drink it further away from systembolaget" next time :D
Do not confound a lack of knowledge of the most vulgar words with 'politeness.'
Yiddish boasts the most powerful insults, with Irish Gaelic a close second.
"Politeness" is really a matter of style rather than language.
To truly humilate someone is an art form in any language.
Why simply call someone a 'son-of-a-b*tch' when you can praise the sharpness of his mother's dewclaws?
The English language definitely commands respect in Sweden, though I wouldn't try to analyse the reasons why, which could be many and complex.
She doesn't agree with the article saying that, Swedish don't like confrontation. My wife isn't afraid to confront people. I'm not sure if that's the way she was when she was living back in Sweden 8 years ago or if that's somethings she picked up from being over here,
Agree with your point on F bombs as well as a whole range of other words. I think the problem is that lots of Swedes learn their language from all the terrible US movies that manage to make it to Sweden.
I also use English when I want to make a point of setting an example of good manners for other Swedes. If there is a pregnant woman, or older person who cannot find a seat on the bus or subway, I always offer mine to them in English, with a smile and comment about how it's my pleasure to be helpful.
Occasionally I my path will cross with a xenophobic older person, but I just smile and tell them in fluent Swedish that I am not in the habit of biting and that seems to help most of the time.
After I first had moved to Sweden and went on my first vacation outside of Sweden I went for a walk on the beach. After only a half kilometer of walking, I was moved to tears because I realized how much I missed people looking at you, smiling and saying good morning as they passed one another.
The extreme lack of politeness among the general population of Swedes is probably the single most depressing thing about living in Sweden. Whenever I have been out of the country for a while and I return, I am so struck by the lack of manners in this country. I hate that when you pass someone, even a neighbor, they go out of their way to not look at you. I sincerely miss eye contact, a smile and a "good day".
I myself am a Swede but I really appreciate the fact that I was raised outside of Sweden where I was taught proper manners.
Although I like the Swedes very much, its much easier to make new friends in Canada (and the US) than in Sweden..
Its a cultural/educational quality: I don't think ANY Swedish child is told, at school, 'There are other people in this world, apart from you'. Swedish people always think their rights must come before anybody else's
I think this is definately true... to a point. Ive been here 8 years now and have definately notice this.
Thats said you have to be very carefull about where and when to use english. I'm still grappeling with this but I use this system.
If I am PAYING for something and they are providing a service I use english but only if its privately owned and not state run (basically if they are living on your custom).
If I want something (information, help, advice) and am not paying for it, I always use swedish.
As to whether swedes are ruder than brits.... hmmmmm not sure there. I think they definately dont belive in being polite just for the sake of it, that would be false in there eyes.
I think when they speak english they are genuinely appreciate for the chance to brush up on there language skills.
Im not sure how much english training they get at school but its around a few hrs a week for say 10years.
Lets say 3hr x 30wks x 10 years = 900hrs
Your average immigrant if they push themselves will have far in excess of this after 5 years.
30hrs x 52wks x 5 years = 7800hrs
As you can see a immigrants command of swedish is way better than the average swedes command of english after 5 years.
I digress... my point is after 5 years of living in another country (reguardless where and which) people who can speak two languages are in a far stronger position to control the power balance of a conversation.
Its called evolution!
But before we all get a little smug about our lingual dexterity. Remember that without wisdom power is nothing.
But another reason is the differences between the languages themselves. A language is a reflection of a society's culture, and so Swedish is much like Sweden: egalitarian, cynical, and unromantic. The qualities inherent in English move Swedes closer toward its cultural base when they use it, even as non-native speakers.
I study langagues as a hobby and I notice what many others have mentioned about English in that much of the politeness is built in both linguistically and culturally where it doesn't seem to be the case with Swedish and other Nordic languages. Although I do agree with the geographic isolation suggestion which was mentioned, it does make sense. Here in the US, one must go out of their way to not be around another person and it is perceived as being VERY rude if at least some basic form of pleasantries aren't exchanged. I have had to explain this to some of my native Swedish relatives when speaking with them about coming to the US and they notice it right away. English is a language and culture where one is all but expected to be very open with pleasantries, Swedish, not so much.
You should try Afrikaans.
As for the general theory of the article. Maybe. But also, a person speaking their mother tongue will be more powerfull than a person speaking a learned language. Maybe its not politeness as such but merely a shift in power? When i learned spanish i felt like i was 5 years old again and it was very frustrating and i was totally dependent on the goodwill of the spanish i met. Fortunately, the spanish are, by and large, splendidly friendly and social and accomodating people that like to communicate, no matter little deficiencies in my grammer. But still, i could not assert myself in spanish.
First and foremost I think that much have to do with upbring and how hard your parents were on "thank you" and "please". The reason why we swedes seems like more polite in english I think is because that's how we are taught the language, I remember from my own school days the importance of being polite when talking in english, "you have to be polite, you have to say please and thank you, that's how its done!" and that's something that stick with you, if you speak english, be polite.The reason why many young adults/teens use all those f-words and s-words is that well, since it isnt our mothertounge we arn't raised with the "wrongness" (Is that a word?) of saying them, the equaliant in swedish are not considered as that rude. I know my mum (working as a english teacher for year 10-12) always have to stress the point of the rudeness of those words, and that they shouldn't be used in a civil converstation.
Shes an expert, but she's has never contemplated talking english to see changes in behaviour? 15 books on one subject, i guess she couldn't fit it all into one book, or get it right first time, i wouldn't call that an expert.
For me, the swedish language is very rude and how people react during conversations can be rude and unacceptable in many cultures. I wouldnt say other cultures are much better, but we use please and thankyou alot more with less expectation that people do so as we ask, in sweden everything seems more like a command.
That is utter rubbish. Unfortunately the profanity checker will stop me from showing you quite how wrong you are.
"You see, this a vast country, and people have not been talking to one another for a long time. In Britain, where a much bigger population lives in a much smaller place, the English are simply forced to talk more, and a certain politeness has naturally developed."
I am a Canadian and, correct me if I'm wrong, but Canada is a much more 'vast' country than Sweden, no? And I can honestly say that Canadian are the nicest people I've interacted with. Very polite, and will often say hello to a stranger!
The size of your country has nothing to do with being rude!
When I instead spoke English, I found that the situation was reversed. Suddenly I found that people behind the counter smiled and asked me if I wanted any help. Suddenly they became not only polite but also alive and friendly.
I asked a friend who is the son of a diplomat and who had the benefit of growing up in many cultures around the world what he thought about this. His answer was very simple.
In Sweden everyone is equal, and so the concept of 'serving others' is difficult to grasp for many Swedes, because in serving others one automatically puts the person being served slightly 'higher up'. This is reflected in the way they are treated with greater respect, politness and sometimes even reverence. If you treat someone like this, he said, then obviously you are not equal any more, because if the customer us 'slightly up', then where does that put you? 'Slightly down' or 'below' of course, and this is simply unacceptable.
So, my friend explained, if you speak Swedish, then you will be treated like a Swede, as an equal, and as an equal you don't deserve more respect than anyone else, which is why you get the 'normal treatment', which is pretty blunt and impersonal, or at best just 'politely' neutral.
If you however speak English, then you could be a visitor to the country. For a Swede it then is easier to 'lower oneself' for a moment, for the benefit of the visitor, because it is only for a moment, and it will look good in everyone's eyes. We Swedes don't want to make a bad impression with foreigners, he said.
He added that some Swedes may also be more polite and friendly when others speak English because they have lived abroad and appreciate the difference.
This may be common in Sweden but also in other small countries with unique culture. Everybody knows English as the universal language of communication, travel, etc., and so if one speaks in English, it is assumed that he is a foreigner, businessman or traveller and thus, the local people will
speak in English with a certain measure of politeness and decorum. Who wants to speak in a foreign language and use rude words? But if one opens up in the local dialect, then you get the same treatment as others.