Assange case relies on US guarantees: Sweden

Drop this case. It is obvious that the more it drags on the worst it gets for Sweden's reputation. It is also waste of tax money, etc. Sweden stands for freedom of speech and what JA and his team have been doing is exactly that (free speeches). The rape charges are nonsense. He did not plan to come to Sweden in 2010 to rape women.

Is there anyone out there who strongly believes that JA raped the two women?

Neither Swedish law nor the European human rights convention protected Mohammed al-Zari and Ahmed Agiza, both rendered by Sweden to Egypt, via the CIA.

Sorry Sweden, you have form for kidnapping people off the streets and bundling them onto CIA black flights at the request of the US. It is not surprising that those who consider themselves to be of interest to the US are suspicious of a country that goes in for a spot of kidnapping and torture every now and then.

So... They want to extradite him to the US.

BIG surprise.

JA is trying to make himself look like a victim in all this,(and there are a lot of laim people that believe him). The only thing he is wanted for is questioning for rape allegations in Sweden. The Swedish and UK legal systems are not going to let themselves look stupid by JA thmbing his nose at them. There is no evidence that the USA wants to extradite him. JA tries to put blame on everyone else, but not accept the responsibility for his own actions.

I believe he just shake handed them without using gloves. I think the 2 women thought he sexually shake handed them (because someone asked whether he shake handed directly or did he use gloves?). They need money now to make a luxurious holiday. They will suk the social money until the fake case is solved.

I know he has wife and a child. I hope he meets them.

themoron says: Almost all the world knows about the promises made by the USA. They promise whatever, but its delivery is quite different.

Guarantees that Assange will not be extradited to the US, should be given by Sweden. Mohammed al-Zari and Ahmed Agiza know perfectly well the promises Sweden received that they were not going to be tortured in Egypt. Assange is requested by Sweden for charges made against him of sexual nature. USA is accusing Wikileaks for treason, the same accusations are against Bradley Manning, the US soldier that provided Wikileaks with the film that proves how the crew of an US helicopter, massacre a group of civilians in Irak, while laughing and commenting their heroicity.

UK has acted as a lakey of the USA; Sweden too. It looks like if the circus is directed by Hillary Clinton, who went to Sweden some weeks ago to discuss many things. I suspect she discussed also Julian Assange with Sweden's Minister for Foreign Affairs, Carl Bildt. The show must go on, otherwise, worldwide media will start again writine profusely about Obama, Romney and the coming presidential elections in the US.

I bet none of these people who are currently criticising their own governments would do that if they lived in that free democratic nation called Ecuador? Some have tried it and they didn't fair too well.

Perhaps the US/UK/Swe is more free than people think, when compared to other nations? If the grass is so green all these people can get away from the corruption and head to Ecuador, they can wait at the airport for the arrival of their King. :)

themoron says: if;in the event that; whether; in the case of; would that; despite; on the condition that; provided that; when... If I were not themoron, but only if. Facts are more needed than "if"s.

US should offer Life sentence, but, time is on our side. Sweden and US will get him someday. Rape and terrorism are worth waiting for. His family must be proud.

So if the US wants JA for a 99 year sentence without parole, would the response be: Sure. Take him. ?

The remaining Wiki staff need to find some new leaked cables that describe how the US would proceed after JA is in Sweden, if at all.

#6 you are certainly appropriately named. An examination of the pertinent law would show that Assange's claims are absolute BS. He could be extradited from GB much more easily than from Sweden. Once he is in Sweden, it will require the permission of both GB and Sweden in order to extradite him to the US. He is charged with forcing one woman to have sex with him. That is rape. He is charged with assaulting a second woman in her sleep and refusing to stop. That is rape. If he isn't guilty, he can answer the Swedish charges and go on his way. Either the commentators supporting him do not live in Sweden and therefore are not aware how ineffective of how Swedish law functions and how ineffective Swedish "justice" is or they are, like Assange, raising a straw man to knock down to try and divert people from the real issues. If Assange were facing the same charges in Britain, as stated by the British Supreme Court, he would have already been indicted and brought to trial. Assange is an egotistical blowhard who thinks he is above the law and is seeking public attention. Let him face his accusers if he is so "innocent". If he ever actually goes to Ecuador, he won't have that luxury.

Sweden should not drop d case. Aldrig i livet.

themoron says: Some people's children. Some here want to lynch Assange without even making a thorough research of a story that began in april of 2010. And yes, my nickname is "themoron", because I am a moron trying to teach some posters the difference between facts and wishful thinking.

I believe that beeing a moron is better than being a burrillo, sorry, a Borilla.

It would be nice if Wikileaks would release the cables between the Ecuadorian government and the Ecuadorian Embassy in London concerning Mr. Assange's asylum request. After all, isn't openness what Mr. Assange and Wikileaks is all about.

@ themoron,

No one is calling for his "lynching", we're are calling for him to man up, except the decision of the U.K. courts, and go to Sweden and face his accusers accusations and answer the questions.

Just wanted to teach you the difference between the facts and your extreme exaggeration of a lynching.

@4, poorly bred,

Please familiarize yourself with the facts before making all those silly comments:

http://nnn.se/nordic/assange/sequence.htm

Also, it is illegal to use the European Arrest Warrant simply for questioning, it must be for prosecution.

@16 sgt_dumb

Here is the fact and a quote from the article above; "Swedish police want to question Assange over allegations of rape and sexual assault,...".

So your statement "Also, it is illegal to use the European Arrest Warrant simply for questioning, it must be for prosecution." is bs.

You should work harder to get your IQ into double-digit numbers.

themoron says;

I have read from the beginning, the majority of the comments of those who want to see Julian Assange in the hands of the US. Under my viewpoint, which I am entitled to have, it looks that some would like to lynch him or let the US lynch him.

sgt_doom is completely right. Some posters here and in all the Assange's threads, do not familiarize themselves with the facts, being that the reason they make, as sgt_doom wrote, "silly comments.

Assange was questioned once in Stockholm. After that, the police told him he could leave the country. When Assange was already in London, prosecutor Marianee Ny issued the warrant for him to be extradited to Sweden. Assange asked twice to be interrogated in London. Sweden could have had accepted that, but it refused, in spite of the fact that under Swedish law, any suspect cn be interrogated in another country.

Assange requested being interrogated at the Embassy of Ecuador in London, Ny refused again.

Read what I wrote in comment # 6. Please read it.

And I repeat once more: Do not charge him as guilty before proving that he is. He has been accused, not for rape, murder, violation or something similar. He is accused of "casual sex" and something quite subjective (at least for me)named "sexual harassment", because nowadays, it might be just by touching a woman's hand. But, for what I have read, in Sweden everything is sexual harassment, because they say that Sweden is a feministic State. Besides, the ladies who accused Assange, have a lawyer,Clas Borgström, who is a feminist and the prosecuter, a very close friend of him, is known for being a radical feminist. For me, and for other posters, it was just obvious that the would like to see Assange behind bars in Sweden. Then they would take all the necessary time to interrogate him and then, if they receive a secret cable from Mrs. Clinton, Sweden will hand Assange over to the US.

I have read that in Sweden, almost everybody is guilty as charged and the defendant has to prove the opposite. In free countries, the opposite is what counts. A defendant is innocent and the prosecutors have to prove that he is guilty. In the meantime, the defendant is free to move. They only request him not to leave the country.

What I wrote are facts. If Assange is guilty for sexual misconduct, he has to face a penalty. If he is not, nobody has the right to harass him in the way Sweden and UK have done.

If others write that "Rape and terrorism are worth waiting for", there is nothing more to say. Assange is a rapist and a terrorist worse than Osama Bin Laden. Being that, the US should fly illegaly wherever Assange might be hiding and kill him like a rat in front of his family.

Is that what we are looking for?

Pleaaaase do not drop the case! We are having so much fun! I mean HOW ELSE in the earth could we have this much humor about stupid laws in Sweden?! The other day, a lady, I assume, had written that "someone ejaculated in me after I said stop, can I sue?!"...lol.... Really how else could we laugh at Swedish right wing nonsense government like this? Please let the show go on...

The prosecutor who took up the case after the first one dropped it wanted to belittle Assange and attack his personality. Now we see that the whole Sweden and its politically-correct-morally-wrong nature is under attack.

oh oh oh... and by the way... a "middle eastern" is laughing at you... Please keep the show :)

Seriously, if u cannot see how the event would have unfolded had he gone back to Sweden, its not worth posting any opinions.

The charges would have been dropped due to inadequate evidence and the USA would have issued for him to be extradited. It was going to be as simple as that.

America are just sitting back while the manipulated counties try to sort this out for themselves. America are distancing themselves as they gain nothing from being involved at the moment. When the board is emptied of pieces, no Ecuador, no England, just Sweden and America or similar, then they will move with multiple charges, once in america he is lost to the system and will have an "accident".

If people hit back saying that he has to "man up" well, it all right saying that stuff until your the one in the dock with multiple countries coming down on you choosing how you will spend the rest of your life be it 60 years, or as little as 2 months. With this much publicity the death sentence comes quick and has no appeal time.

Even if USA´s government does not aply the death penalty to Assange, if he is inprisioned will not survive more than a few hours. No normal person can survive in the United States prisions

" Even if USA´s government does not aply the death penalty to Assange, if he is inprisioned will not survive more than a few hours. No normal person can survive in the United States prisions "

LOL

themoron says:

1) Julian Assange is not charged with anything in Sweden.

2) Julian Assange did not flee Sweden to avoid questioning. He was given permission to leave the country on the 15th September 2010.

3) The case against Julian Assange was initially dropped, and deemed so weak it could not warrant investigation. After the intervention of a Swedish politician close to American diplomats, a different prosecutor revived it.

4) In all instances, the 2 plaintiffs consented to sexual intercourse, which they did not take the initiative to stop: they never expressed non-consent and afterwards declared to not have felt threatened by Julian Assange.

5) A condom submitted as evidence by complainant AA, who claimed it had been deliberately torn by Julian Assange during sexual intercourse, contains no chromosomal DNA from either the complainant or Julian.

6) Text messages exchanged between complainants and their friends contradict the factual allegations in the European Arrest Warrant (EAW) issued for Julian Assange

7) After the date of the alleged sexual misconduct: a) Complainant AA created then deleted evidence (tweets) indicating she was enjoying Julian Assange's company; b) AA went as far as suggesting one of her friends (Witness C) should be intimate with Julian as well.

8) The law firm hired in the Assange investigation is ran by Claes Borgström and by former minister Thomas Bodström. Bodström is a friend of police interrogator Irmeli Krans, who interrogated complainant SW

9) Police interrogator Irmeli Krans is, in turn, friends with the other plaintiff, complainant AA, with whom she has political ties. Krans also breached protocol by commenting negatively about Julian Assange on social media. [Source: Irmeli Krans: The Facebook Trail]

10) Swedish prosecutor, Marianne Ny, refused to provide Julian Assange or his lawyers with information on the allegations against him in writing. This violates the Swedish Code of Procedure (RB 23:18) and the European Convention of Human Rights (article 5), and the EU Fundamental Charter on Human Rights. Prosecution also refused all voluntary offers for cooperation.

11) Both the EAW and the Interpol red notice were issued for Julian by Sweden just before WikiLeaks began to publish Cablegate.

12) The allegations against Julian Assange do not constitute an offense in Australia or in the UK. The offences described in the EAW are not extradition offences]

13) If extradited to Sweden: still without charge, Assange would be held incommunicado and placed under solitary confinement. Pre-trial detention would last for an indefinite period. Trial in Sweden would be held in secret.

14) The Swedish legal system features lay judges who are appointed because of their political affiliations. Have no formal legal training

15) Sweden has the highest per capita rate of cases brought to the European Court of Human Rights relating to the right to a fair trial

The fact is the US says they have not subjected Bradley Manning to torture.

The UN says they did.

The US says they will not subject JA to torture, and that they never practice torture.

Considering Manning's treatment, and what we know about Guantanamo Bay and Abu Graib, why should anyone believe ANY assurances given by the US about how they will treat JA ?

Remember, they insist they NEVER practice torture!!

Who do you believe, them, or the UN?

As a Swede I am very sorry that this country does not always follow the UN Human Rights Conventions, e.g. many cases with social authorities that in a cruel way have taken away children from their parents based on very vague and questionable reasons. Also innocent people have been secretly handed over to CIA. The legal system here is not reliable, not at all as good as many people still may believe it is. After have read the police protocols from the hearings of the 2 ladies I am convinced Julian Assange fully innocent. This rediculous case is harming Swedens reputation and should be dropped. I have partly lost my faith to the legal system and the authorities here.

Convenient how Assange's supporters have forgotten he wanted to live in Sweden and his application for residency was turned down in October 2010.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11570283

What I find shocking is how....

A) People who think Wikileaks was right to leak the stolen documents believe Assange is not guilty of the charges,

B) People who think Wikileaks was wrong to leak the stolen documents believe Assange is guilty of the charges.

Surely they are two different things? Whatever your own convictions about text messages and other evidence which is currently known (or guessed) its impossible to pre-judge without having all the testimony. He deserves his day in court here in Sweden as an innocent man and we can rest assured the court will come to the right conclusion.

To Assange supporters...

Explain how he goes from October 2010: "Sweden is a nice free country where I am safe, I want to live there" to spring/summer of 2012 - "Sweden would send me to the USA so I would prefer to stay in the UK where I am safe". How is he in more danger now in Sweden than he was in October 2010?

?

I'm sure JA has learned a lot about the Swedish justice system over these past 2 years, as we all have.

I for one had never heard about the shocking CIA renditions of the two Egyptians before this month.

These bizarre charges and the inconsistencies in Swedish prosecutors, refusing to travel to London to interview, claiming it is legally impossible while they have a precedent of doing questioning in Belgrade for far more serious charges.

We are all living and learning.

Cheeba

The extraordinary rendition via Sweden was already general knowledge several years ago. Somebody like Assange who pays attention to everyone else's but his own failings would scarcely be unaware of it.

There is a big difference between Belgrade and London.... One if out of the EU (and therefore the remit of the European Arrest Warrat) and the other isn't. The European Arrest Warrant is supposed to facilitate easy transport of suspected criminals between EU states.

Its good that you write you are learning. May I suggest you challenge your own prejudices by looking at facts which are inconvenient to your case.

themoron says:

Sweden's 'reinterpretation' of the Mutual Legal Assistance (MLA, a common legal practice in the European Union. It is an agreement between two countries to help cooperation during investigation of alleged crimes. The EU's website states "mutual legal assistance and agreements on extradition are essential for the EU in order to achieve a European area of justice".

The Swedish prosecution has requested Julian Assange's extradition for the purpose of questioning on allegations of sexual misconduct. He is yet to be formally charged with an offense.

Since his arrest, Mr Assange has offered himself to be questioned under the MLA practices, by telephone, video conference, or in person. He continues to retain this offer, even during his current stay at the Ecuadorian Embassy as he awaits a decision on his application for asylum. The Ecuadorians have agreed to letting the Swedish prosecution come to the Embassy to question him.

WikiLeaks' legal adviser Jennifer Robinson met with Sweden's Minister for Foreign Affairs Carl Bildt on July 5 during Almedalen Week, a political conference in Gotland. She discussed with him the allegations against Julian Assange and why Sweden has refused to question him over the past 18 months.

He told me it's not allowed. And when I pointed out that Sweden had only recently done just that in a murder investigation in Serbia, he had no reply.

Swedish prosecutor Marianne Ny made similar statements in 2010, saying that Swedish Law prevents Mr Assange being interviewed by telephone or video link, and that both Swedish and British law prevent her from traveling to London to question Mr Assange. Many of the articles containing the latter statement were later removed.

Since Julian Assange has not been formally charged, he does not have the rights of a defendant, i.e. access to the full accusations against him or any of the evidence. Could the fact that he only faces allegations affect the use of MLA law?

The guidelines for getting Mutual Legal Assistance from the UK state the contrary.

In the section entitled "What must be included in a Letter of Request" it states:

A description of the offences charged or under investigation and sentence or penalty

Furthermore, in an "Example Letter of Request" it states:

Supply information on the charge or proposed charge.

A full page of the document is also dedicated to the information needed to request a telephone or video conference call, which includes an address, a possible list of questions, and any formal notification of rights.

Neither Carl Bildt nor Marianne Ny would explain how or why it is illegal under Swedish law to question Mr Assange via telephone, video conference, or in person. With no explanation on their behalf, the EU promoting the use of Mutual Legal Assistance, and a document explaining how to achieve information this way, it opens the door for speculation as to why Sweden refuses to question Mr Assange.

Why don't more people call on the 2 women in the case to come out and make public statements that Assange is not really guilty of rape?

These women know that they weren't raped. They are just going to have to own up to the fact that they were mad that Assange was having sex with 2 women at the same time!! For everyone's good, the women need to admit this to the world. It's the truth.

As long as Assange's enemies are able to make this false claim that "Assange is a rapist" it will be just impossible to rally and real public support for him.

keep going moron. I love those facts - clear and precise.

sadly no amount of facts will ever stop the less educated people of the world.

it is abundantly clear that both the USA and Sweden pay stooges to flood forums to defend their actions trying any tactic what so ever to deflect the truth. Incognito of course.

Keep up the good fight. the truth is out there. The yanks will do anything they can to make sure no one gets access to it..

I wonder how long before there is a mysterious attack on america which will be traced to Iran requiring an immediate military strike from the USA and Israel.

Ive noticed they have started down the syria has chemical weapons path used so successfully in Iraq.

themoron says:

"Adrian Lamo, the hacker who betrayed the alleged WikiLeaks source Bradley Manning, dubbed the "world's most hated hacker" for his role in passing information on Manning to military intelligence after the soldier befriended him on internet chat, said that he understood that Manning was an idealistic young man who believed he could change the world for the better and "who didn't necessarily know what he was doing.

"A soldier alleged to be Bradley Manning contacted Lamo on AOL instant messaging on 21 May 2010, using the internet handle Bradass87. Lamo was known to the soldier because of his celebrity status in the hacking world having been prosecuted in 2003 for breaking into the computer network of the New York Times, for which Lamo was put on six months' house arrest.

The soldier confessed to Lamo that he had been downloading US state secrets on to a CD labelled "Lady Gaga".

Lamo took advice from two friends who had experience working with military intelligence, and, with their assistance, he passed the details of the internet conversation to the US military. On 26 May, Manning was arrested on duty at the Forward Operating Base Hammer outside Baghdad, where he was working as an intelligence officer. The U.S. soldier is accused of leaking classified information to WikiLeaks

"The US military officially adds 22 new charges, including 'aiding the enemy' against alleged WikiLeaks leaker Pfc. Bradley Manning.

Manning is accused of illegally downloading tens of thousands of classified US government documents that were later released publicly by WikiLeaks.

New charges filed in the investigation range as high as aiding the enemy, which is a capital offense and carries a potential death sentence.

Department of Defense officials claimed information leaked to WikiLeaks contained the names and personal details of informants and others who once cooperated with US military forces in Afghanistan, possible endangering their lives."

Marcel Rosenbach from Der Spiegel, wrote on July 18th, 2012-08-24

"Following a fundraiser held in San Francisco in April, US President Barack Obama said that Manning "broke the law."

"Even US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton seems to have formed a clear opinion on Manning. She recently told the American magazine Vanity Fair that she cannot fathom how a soldier with psychological problems and a "drag queen" for a boyfriend could embarrass the United States in this way."

These premature judgments at the highest level are as unusual as they are questionable. The presumption of innocence is normally respected even in the United States."

For months, a grand jury has been meeting in Virginia to consider whether charges should be brought against WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange. One person summoned for the grand jury claims it will be tasked with finding whether there is sufficient evidence to prove a link between Manning and Assange.

smiling jack (#31)

Hold on! hold on...let me get my tin foil hat on. Hey, hon, hand me that set of rabbit ears...just let me get these plugged into the ol' hat here. OK, I'm good to go, wait, let me tweak these nobs, fine tune y'all ll in. Good, got it.

the moron says: Incognito means incognito, not "cognito".

Someone wrote hear: "Explain how he goes from October 2010: "Sweden is a nice free country where I am safe, I want to live there" to spring/summer of 2012 - "Sweden would send me to the USA so I would prefer to stay in the UK where I am safe". How is he in more danger now in Sweden than he was in October 2010?"

For the same reason an Iraqi, friend of mine, told me: I felt safe in Baghdad back in 2000, but not now. I would never return there".

In 2010, Assange wanted to live in Sweden where he thought that the "freedom of speech" (?) laws whould be a save haven for Wikileaks. He woke up to reality after the hunting he has suffered by the Swedish judicial system personified by Marianne Ny, Claes Borgström with Carl Bildt involved.

I wrote on #23:

1) Julian Assange is not charged with anything in Sweden.

2) Julian Assange did not flee Sweden to avoid questioning. He was given permission to leave the country on the 15th September 2010.

3) The case against Julian Assange was initially dropped, and deemed so weak it could not warrant investigation. After the intervention of a Swedish politician close to American diplomats, a different prosecutor revived it.

So, I believe that Assange has many good reasons for not wanting ro return to a country that fully respects freedom of speech and does not follow any line, especially if it comes from Hillary Clinton.

@34 the moron

It's "cogito." Nothing to do with incognito.

You need reading glasses. Or an education, like most of J.A. devotees.

@ Nomark;

There is still something fishy about this matter. The prosecuter is legally banned from questioning in London because it is in the EU? It does not appear so.

Some here have said Swedish law prevents questioning outside its territory. The Belgrade precedent proves that is not so.

I do understand the principle that EU countries are obliged to cooperate within the EU on these pan European arrest warrants. The point in that is to expidite justice.

In the JA case, common sense tells one that her hard line is doing the opposite, just making matters harder and far more expensive for everyone.

The British are stuck because he is in the Ecuadorian embassy, her refusal to conduct her questioning there is just as responsible for this embarrassing and costly circus in the middle of a recession than JA's behavior itself.

themoronsays:

Yes, I need reading glasses. Someone here needs a brain. I can order my reading glasses with an eye doctor. Unfortunately they do not sell brains. no matter how hard the incognitos look for them.

Everybody defending Wikileaks and Assange are a bunch of lunatics who truly believe in the freedom of speech and are against the poor legal system of Sweden.

Some incognitos do not know how to do a proper research and they only talk and write like parrots repeating what somebody else wrote.

!Attention! I said "some incognitos"; not one incognito. I do not want to be called a moron, because it is my nickname and not an insult.

If this were simply an office clerk named John Smith, would Britain and Sweden have expended and continue to expend vast sums of taxpayer money on this witch hunt?

No I thought not.

Of all countries in Europe Sweden is the one where I would most hate to fall foul of the law. The whole place is run, in the background, by money. The people are not happy but believe that they are. Dark, dark place."

Themoron says: "I'll be back " said Douglas MacArthur. So, I'm back!

For all of those ( GLO, Hisingen, cogito, Prince T, bcterry, Borilla, jack sprat, James Seastrom, Nomark and friends) who hate Assange and want him in jail because he is a rapist and a terrorist. Because he is worse than Breivik, worse than pest and cholera together. Because he is the human representation of the Apocalypsis, the anti-Christ and Al-Qaeda together, here is an eye-opener.

"The Mail on Sunday has published a photo of a beaming woman, pictured with Assange and three other people, who would later tell police that 48 hours before the picture was taken, the WikiLeaks founder pinned her down in her flat and sexually assaulted her.

"If the case ever reaches court - Mr Assange is currently holed up in the Ecuadorian Embassy in London - his lawyers will argue that the photograph undermines the 33-year-old woman's entire story. And, they claim, there is more.

"In the two days after the alleged assault in Sweden, Mr Assange and Woman A, as she is known, attended a conference and two dinner parties where it is claimed they were practically inseparable.

"During one party, Woman A tweeted that she was "with the world's coolest, smartest people!".

"The photograph was taken on August 15, 2010, at the Glenfiddich restaurant in Stockholm, at a dinner of meatballs and schnapps hosted by Rickard Falkvinge, the founder of the Swedish Pirate Party (PP), which campaigns for greater government transparency."

There is more…so go to the link and also to the link of the Mail and Sunday.

http://www.news.com.au/world/julian-assange-hopeful-a-photo-could-help-clear-him-of-sexual-assault-allegations/story-fndir2ev-1226458585105