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Did Sweden's haste in implementing 4G

Cause too many mistakes?

byke
post 13.Sep.2012, 08:11 AM
Post #1
Location: Europe
Joined: 28.Oct.2008

I just saw that the new iPhone 5 will NOT be 4G LTE compatible in Sweden.

Since the bands used in Sweden are in areas that the new iPhone 5 chip wont be able to access.
While the iPad 3 was limited in many respects due to the qualcom chip used, the latest chip used and sold by qualcom to both Apple and many manufactures still wont reach Sweden's unusual spectrum.

And now with the UK launching a somewhat late 4G service, but with much greater compatibility in terms of spectrum to that of phones using qualcom chips as with other larger nations.

Has Sweden's haste in attempting to to be first with 4G left Sweden with an infrastructure that could lead it to be last in terms of handsets?

Shame as I really would have liked a iPhone 5 (please don't start a apple versus fandroid debate),
But I wont be bothering if it cant be used in Sweden to its meant potential.
Much in the same way I wouldn't want to go out to Täby to look for Sweden's flagship Apple store.
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PDX
post 13.Sep.2012, 08:49 AM
Post #2
Location: Stockholm
Joined: 2.Aug.2011

Where did you read about this? Sweden has LTE bands 3,7,8,20 and of these, the iPhone 5 supports band 3. Did I miss something?

Sources:

LTE bands worldwide:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LTE_networks

iPhone 5 LTE support (model A1429 GSM specifically):
http://www.apple.com/iphone/LTE/

Here is some short article stating that band 3 will be coming to Telia soon:
http://www.mobilabredband.se/telia-och-dess-4g-planer/

~~~PDX~~~
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AW1
post 13.Sep.2012, 09:06 AM
Post #3
Location: Södermanland
Joined: 20.Mar.2012

http://macworld.idg.se/2.1038/1.465564/dar...e-lte-i-sverige
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PDX
post 13.Sep.2012, 09:07 AM
Post #4
Location: Stockholm
Joined: 2.Aug.2011

It does indeed look like the band 3 support is coming from Telia in 2013:

http://nyheter.telia.se/10388/telia-fortsa...-och-mobildata/

https://forum.tewss.telia.se/topic/7031-4g-i-iphone-5/

~~~PDX~~~
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byke
post 13.Sep.2012, 10:17 AM
Post #5
Location: Europe
Joined: 28.Oct.2008

I suppose even if Telia were to adopt the more popular standards of 4G seen in the US, Korea and larger networks of the world. It would still mean a significant delay and by that time a newer qualcom chip could be released for say a iPhone-5S by 09/2013

I guess its a case of no solution but waiting either for Sweden to change to the more commonly used spectrum or waiting for Qualcom to release a new chip that can work on Swedens less popular system.
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PDX
post 13.Sep.2012, 10:28 AM
Post #6
Location: Stockholm
Joined: 2.Aug.2011

QUOTE (byke @ 13.Sep.2012, 11:17 AM) *
I suppose even if Telia were to adopt the more popular standards of 4G

What do you mean by if ? Telia has adopted exactly the same LTE standard as elsewhere. The iPhone 5 issue only considers a specific frequency band. Telia are allowed to reconfigure their networks to support band 3 beginning from 2013, that is the only issue - don't hallucinate this into anything else (and especially your favorite Sweden vs the rest of the world -debate).

~~~PDX~~~
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Rick Methven
post 13.Sep.2012, 10:40 AM
Post #7
Location: Linköping
Joined: 30.Nov.2005

TeliaSonera chose the 800mhz band because it was available after all TV transmissions went digital and freed up the analogue UHF channels 61-69. The EU then allocated the 800mhz band (790-862 Mhz frequency range) for Mobile data transmissions.
There is however a problem in as much as modern digital TV receivers can also tune in the 800mhz band and so there can be some cross interference with TV's and 4G modems operating in close proximity.

The cost to operators to buy 800 mhz licences is greater than 1800 or 2600 frequencies so EE in the UK has gone for band 7 -2600 mhz.

One of the main advantages of the 800 mhz band is longer range which makes it better for use in rural locations. the higher frequency bands work well in urban area's with high speeds as you have more transmitters close by. The drop off in speed as you get further away from the transmitter is greater with higher frequencies. It should be possible for Apple to have a multi band modem covering all the frequencies, but as the iphone 5 will be sold locked to their partner operators in the US and the UK, they are already sure of enough initial sales. Pandering to a relatively small market in Sweden is never going to be top of their list of must do today
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byke
post 13.Sep.2012, 10:45 AM
Post #8
Location: Europe
Joined: 28.Oct.2008

QUOTE
What do you mean by if ? Telia has adopted exactly the same LTE standard as elsewhere. The iPhone 5 issue only considers a specific frequency band. Telia are allowed to reconfigure their networks to support band 3 beginning from 2013, that is the only issue - don't hallucinate this into anything else (and especially your favorite Sweden vs the rest of the world -debate).

According to the article I read,

QUOTE
Apple is simply going where the current LTE networks lie, and for the most part they’re in Korea, Japan and in the US. The Scandinavian countries may have been pioneers when it comes to LTE, but they make up a small part of the overall European market. Most operators over the Atlantic won’t have sizable LTE networks launched until well into 2013. Apple figures it can tackle their frequencies with next year’s iPhone.

Still, it must be a bit disheartening if you’re a European planning to buy the iPhone 5, knowing your new phone won’t work on the 4G networks in your country. The iPhone 5 may be a revolutionary device for the US, but that revolution won’t hit Europe until the iPhone 6.

http://gigaom.com/europe/iphone-5-snubs-mo...europe-for-lte/

Nothing anti Swedish about my thread.
Although thanks for using it as per usual as a way to justify a claim.
From my understanding there are numerous differences the world over when it comes to 4G which is particularly evident given the iPhone 5 don't work in Sweden at present. And given that the networks will have to make changes to fall into line with larger nations to be able to use such technology as the qualcom chips presently available. It goes back to the original statement, did Sweden's haste in implementing 4G so early cause too many mistakes? But if you feel that question is too anti Swedish to talk about, maybe the answer lays within that response.
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Yorkshireman
post 13.Sep.2012, 10:56 AM
Post #9
Joined: 22.Nov.2011

QUOTE (byke @ 13.Sep.2012, 10:45 AM) *
Nothing anti Swedish about my thread.Although thanks for using it as per usual as a way to justify a claim.From my understanding there are numerous differences the world over ... (show full quote)

Actually, truth and motive is more relevant in the fact that the quote you use from the article reference European and Scandinavia, however You choose to present it as Sweden! A classic Trowism. biggrin.gif
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byke
post 13.Sep.2012, 10:58 AM
Post #10
Location: Europe
Joined: 28.Oct.2008

Actually I think you will find the article was called "Does Apple hate Swedes?".
I didnt write it, but it sure did catch my attention.

Now what was that about truth and relevance? again maybe the answer lays within the response.
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PDX
post 13.Sep.2012, 11:07 AM
Post #11
Location: Stockholm
Joined: 2.Aug.2011

The question is worth discussing but you are mixing apples and oranges here. The Swedish LTE network is well built up (in the urban areas where it is of relevance) and operating in bands 7,8 and 30. Reconfiguration for the "iPhone 5" band 3 will come in the beginning of 2013. All of this you can all check first-hand sources, for example here:

http://www.telia.se/privat/mobilt/mer-om-m...d-mobilnat.page

~~~PDX~~~
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Bender B Rodriquez
post 13.Sep.2012, 11:12 AM
Post #12
Joined: 25.Mar.2006

QUOTE (PDX @ 13.Sep.2012, 11:28 AM) *
What do you mean by if ? Telia has adopted exactly the same LTE standard as elsewhere. The iPhone 5 issue only considers a specific frequency band. Telia are allowed to reconf ... (show full quote)

Exactly!

4G frequencies were auctioned out in 2008 and five operators jumped on it, however none of them use band 3 although they have the rights to use it.

Why they did that you have to ask the operators, but in any case "Sweden" is not to blame. It was entirely the choice of the operators.
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mångk
post 13.Sep.2012, 11:16 AM
Post #13
Joined: 27.Jul.2008

The 'problem' has pretty much existed since mobile phones have existed!

Europe and pretty much the world went in one agreed direction and US, Japan & Korea went in a different direction in an attempt to 'support' its industries!

Going way back to 2G networks the popular 'bands' in most of the world were not supported in the US!

It is not really that much of a 'shock' that Apple has done this and realistically it is nothing to do with 'Sweden' itself rather than the allocated European bands. biggrin.gif
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Rick Methven
post 13.Sep.2012, 11:22 AM
Post #14
Location: Linköping
Joined: 30.Nov.2005

QUOTE (byke @ 13.Sep.2012, 09:11 AM) *
Shame as I really would have liked a iPhone 5 (please don't start a apple versus fandroid debate),

Why not? biggrin.gif

Reading a few of the reports out after yesterdays launch, the general view taken by the pundits, including Apple aficionado's is that they were totally underwhelmed by the launch and the phone. The whole thing had been accurately leaked prior to the launch which left the launch just confirm what had been expected weeks beforehand, something that would never have happened during the Steve Jobs years.

The phone itself only has 2 real new bits 4G ( for some countries) and a slightly bigger 4" screen

The Samsung Galaxy S3 has a 4.8" screen and the Nokia Lumina 900 a 4.3" screen so Apple is still playing catch up. buyers of the iphone 5 will find that a lot of their old apps will not work on the new OS and will appear with a black border until the developers are able to produce a new compatible version.

Anybody who has an accessory that they have bought to go with an earlier iphone/ipad will have to buy an adapter to connect it to the iPhone 5 which has a new charger/connector interface. It is yet another proprietary Apple connector like the old one but a bit smaller! cost of the adapter sold only buy apple is expected to be £30 in the UK on top of a £500 price tag for a unlocked phone.

Apple signed up to the move by all the other phone manufacturers to make a standard micro usb connection on all phones so that buying a new phone or changing brands will not mean a new charger, saving money and electronic waste. Apple chose the option to tie their customers into them even more closely so that they can bleed even more money from them. Both my Samsung Galaxy and Nokia Lumina use the same micro usb connector for charging and connectivity. No extra cables/ chargers at rip off prices.

Nowadays the same apps are available for Apple Android and Windows mobile phones so you no longer have to have an iPhone to get the latest must have app.

If Apple wants to keep it's existing market share in the smart phone market, it needs to either come up with something really innovative or be price competitive and open up to 3rd party products. They currently make a 30% margin on their phones and accessories, which you can do if you have no competition but nowadays they are going to lose out to the likes of Samsung/Google and even a comeback by Nokia/Microsoft. Jobs resuscitated a dying Apple by innovation and taking on the might of Microsoft. Today Apple is sitting back and acting the bully boy like Microsoft did 20 years ago. Where will they be in another 20 years?
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byke
post 13.Sep.2012, 11:32 AM
Post #15
Location: Europe
Joined: 28.Oct.2008

Again, the question was ... has Sweden's early adoption of 4G set itself at a disadvantage?

Germany, UK, Italy etc ... all started the process later.
And as a partial result have operators catering for the iPhone 5 - straight off the bat.

Whereas Sweden who adopted early standards in 4G technology are not able to offer such services and as a result are having to make changes to their network.
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