(edit title) 'Varudeklarerat' for property sale Any experiences, please? Options

[SimonDMontfort]

I’m considering paying for varudeklarerat to try and help sell my house. (the house is nearly 100 years old.)

Varudeklarerat seems a pretty good ‘product’ to me, as it promises a thorough survey (besiktning,) before the house goes on to the market, protection against so-called hidden defects and errors the inspector should have noticed.

It also seems to avoid the need for buyer and seller to confront each other over ‘faults’ as an insurance company deals with claims.

However, I’m sometimes sceptical about insurance.

Any feedback, please, from anyone that’s ‘signed up’ to varudeklarerat? Is it worth it? Does anybody know about a claim from a buyer, and did the insurance cover operate correctly?

Are there any options to buy this product – other than through an estate agent? (Tried a few insurance providers and couldn’t find any)

Thanks in advance

[PDX]

Have you asked on any Swedish forums? There are plenty of reports (both positive and negative) about this on the net..

Oh, and regarding the purchasing of this insurance, it is a product sold by Svens Fastighets Förmedling and provided by Anticimex Försäkringar so it does look like going through an estate agent is the only way.

~~~PDX~~~

[SimonDMontfort]

@ PDX - the enquiries I’ve made suggest that virtually any buyer would opt for a besiktning on a property as old as mine. From that point, reductions in an asking price could be sought.

The perceived disadvantage of ‘varudeklarerat’ seems to be that some people think the value of the house is somehow ‘set in stone’, and buyers may be deterred (especially in a buyers’ market) because they think its more difficult to negotiate the price

No probs if varudeklarerat can't be obtained anywhere else - I just wondered how it worked in practice

[Yorkshireman]

@ PDX - the enquiries I've made suggest that virtually any buyer would opt for a besiktning on a property as old as mine. From that point, reductions in an asking price could be sought.

They should really do it on every property!

As a buyer, when I have a property surveyed, I choose the surveyor, the full survey includes a guarantee that if they missed things then they, the surveyor, will pay for rectification. This way, the surveyor is absolutely more thorough, and will even highlight all potential risks within the near years.

Hidden faults can be claimed up to 10 years after purchase. And can set of a chain reaction backwards down the owner chain. Watch for any small print in the insurance

I wonder if people would feel more comfortable claiming against either the previous owner, their own surveyor or an insurance company that wants to minimise payouts?

The perceived disadvantage of 'varudeklarerat' seems to be that some people think the value of the house is somehow 'set in stone', and buyers may be deterred ... (show full quote)

The perceived disadvantage of 'varudeklarerat' seems to be that some people think the value of the house is somehow 'set in stone', and buyers may be deterred (especially in a buyers' market) because they think its more difficult to negotiate the price ... (hide full quote)

Must admit, I wouldn't see it that way as a buyer.

What I would see is all the faults, before I have even shelled out to have the property surveyed. ie. The seller has potentially helped me avoid the emotional issue of wanting the property and paying for a survey, which would then reveal the issues that I would balance against the want for the property. Surveyor reports are quite brutal often identifying all potential risks, that would quickly help Me say No, or potentially Yes if there is much less than if I surveyed it myself. (which I probably would do anyway to be sure )

One can always negotiate price ...the only value something has ... is what someone else is prepared to pay for it!

[SimonDMontfort]

@ Yorkshireman

Agree with much of your down-to-earth wisdom here.

I’m only repeating what I’ve been told by local sources, and Swedish friends and neighbours

Are you suggesting (because varudeklarerat would cost me 19200 SEKs) that it may not be worth the money?

[Yorkshireman]

Maybe if You look at it this way, You can decide for Yourself (I certainly won't say if it is worth it or not!)

In the law with regards buying and selling property there is an obligation from the Seller side to reveal all known faults. Knowing that there can be hidden faults, and not all sellers are totally open, there is the hidden fault 10yr rule.

However, this Seller declaration of faults, is also balanced in law by a requirement from the Buyers side that they also have an obligation to have the property fully investigated beforehand. If they do not, it is certainly harder to make any claim against the Seller!

So, if You as the Seller has a survey done before the sale, even though You make that available to the Buyer ... You cover Your Ass. It provides no security whatsoever for the Buyer, in fact, if the buyer does not have the property checked and later even hidden faults are found, the Buyer will have very few legs to stand on as the Seller can simply say ... if You had checked the property You would have found that, but You didnt.

The insurance provided along with that survey is just an additional ass-coverer for the Seller ..and income source for the insurer. Since they also, if the Buyer didn't do an investigation, will use exactly the same argument.

I remember seeing something about this before, just don't have time to check right now, but Konsumentverket have previously warned about this false sense of security for buyers, and reminding them of their obligation to investigate the property before purchase for greater security.

At the end of the day, the Seller (You) and your Agent will always point out everything wonderful about a property ... it is the buyers surveyors job to highlight the faults and risks... the rest is up to the buyer

If someone is going to buy a 100yr-old property, it is not because of modern techniques and technologies in construction etc.. it is emotional, charm, subliminal they build things better in those days, etc... They will expect something wrong with it, most likely indeed suspicious if there isn't! And expect to haggle the price.

[SimonDMontfort]

Thanks Yorkshireman (didn’t mean to put you on the spot there )

Estate agents have explained things in much the same terms – I was really looking for anyone’s experiences (if there were any) of how ‘good’ varudeklarerat is – if a claim is made subsequent to the sale.

At the end of the day the market is the ultimate arbiter: if I don’t get an acceptable offer for the property, and have to sell, say, in a year’s time – then I would still have to pay for the inspection carried out now (which may have little value in the future)

[Frank Arbach]

Any feedback, please, from anyone that’s ‘signed up’ to varudeklarerat? Is it worth it? Does anybody know about a claim from a buyer, and did the insurance cover operate correctly?

I am reminded of the old Danny Kaye song The Emperor’s (King’s) New Clothes because nobody’s actually answered your question yet – although its useful to be reminded of what a buyer’s priorities might be.

I sold my Swedish property in March this year and left the country. I paid for varudeclarerat. My experiences have been that:

• By buying it you are absolving yourself of responsibility for hidden faults, so its almost inevitable that
buyers need to satisfy themselves with their own survey
• BUT – what estate agents don’t always mention to buyers is that if they seek to make a claim (against
Anticimex), there is an ‘excess’ something like 20K SEKs
• It came to my attention that the agent actively tried to discourage my buyer from taking on his own survey (on
the grounds that Anticimex had already done it) This caused a certain amount of friction for a time, but I told the
buyer I was more than comfortable with the additional survey.

The only area of disagreement between the two surveys was over moisture readings in one of the bathrooms – which was resolved. Personally I cannot see why a survey needs to be carried out in every case (a new house with guarantees..?) but if the property is around 100 years old, I would cover your own back – and expect the buyer to do the same

The only issue I can really see is whether a buyer might come back on the vendor and try to recover this excess…?

Best of luck

[NordicCrown]

• It came to my attention that the agent actively tried to discourage my buyer from taking on his own survey (on the grounds that Anticimex had already done it) This caused a ... (show full quote)

• It came to my attention that the agent actively tried to discourage my buyer from taking on his own survey (on
the grounds that Anticimex had already done it) This caused a certain amount of friction for a time, but I told the
buyer I was more than comfortable with the additional survey. ... (hide full quote)

I’d be suspicious of that kind of behaviour if I was a buyer. Having said that, when I did varudeklarerat on my old house, I cant remember anything being said in the policy docs about the buyer’s ‘duty to inspect’ (it’s a ‘must’ here) and some might think ‘the wool is being pulled over their eyes’

I cant really say how well the insurance works in practice as I’ve heard nothing more from my buyers in the 3 years since I sold. As a previous poster said, you’re covering your posterior

[Yorkshireman]

If You decide to take out the insurance, ask the insurance company what happens if the buyer finds a fault that is not covered by the insurance? Or the insurance company is being pig-headed about disputing a claim. The buyer can still take the seller to court, in fact it is their only option!, which is exactly what You believed you had insured against! .

Also, what if there is only 1 buyer, and they refuse to agree to the insurance take-over? Will you still sell?

[SimonDMontfort]

Thanks for the replies! (Been away for a few days)

As I say, I'm suspicious of many insurance products, and there are some issues with my particular property, I want the agent to get clarified, from the insurers.

But if all seems above board, I shall probably buy in to varudeklarerat

[Yorkshireman]

Ask what happens even when the buyer agrees to take over the insurance surveyor report and sign the dotted line, but then within a few years re-sells the property. If I recollect this kind of insurance, the excess amounts reverts back to You (the seller taking it out) as the buyer who signed cannot pass that on to another buyer.

[SimonDMontfort]

I think thats an unlikely scenario actually - but you never know.

I'm seeing the agent on Wednesday to finalise things for the sale - as I say, if I'm reassured, I'll go with varudeklarerat