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UK citizen rejected by Skatteverket

Migrationsverket granted right of residence

AaronS
post 9.Oct.2012, 03:34 PM
Post #1
Joined: 8.Oct.2012

Hi all,

I'm hoping that someone might be able to offer me some advice.

My problem is similar to many others out there: I've been refused a person number by Skatteverket. I've done a lot of searching around the forums and found people with similar stories, but my case is a little complex and there are still several issues I'm unclear about.

First, a bit of background: I have a British passport and lived in the UK for the last 9 years, during which time I was studying. I arrived in Sweden in May this year from the UK to live with my girlfriend, who's a non-EU citizen halfway through a PhD here. I went to Migrationsverket and successfully registered my right of residence as a person of sufficient means, showing my bank details and my EHIC issued by the UK. I then took all these documents to Skatteverket, who told me within a couple of weeks that the EHIC wasn't sufficient; I needed another form from the UK to prove that they would pay all my medical costs. I phoned HMRC in Newcastle and was told there shouldn't be any problems; I could expect to receive the form a couple of weeks later. Instead, however, I received a letter telling me that my application had been rejected as I haven't paid sufficient National Insurance contributions in the UK; moreover, they had cancelled my EHIC card as I've moved abroad and any further attempt to use it would be 'fraudulent'.

I'm wondering, firstly, whether the fact that the UK have cancelled my EHIC card invalidates my right of residence. It states in the letter I received from Migrationsverket that the right of residence is valid for as long as I fulfil the necessary conditions. which I suppose includes having the EHIC card.

Secondly, I'm wondering whether the most simple solution to all this is to get my own private medical insurance, and take that to Skatteverket instead. I've read the discussion here http://www.thelocal.se/discuss/index.php?showtopic=52353 about what constitutes sufficient insurance, it seems that nobody really knows, but I could give it a shot. Am I right in thinking that as soon as I have the PN I'll be fully entitled to Swedish healthcare? In which case all the issues regarding the EHIC would become irrelevant? That also brings up another thought: what's to stop anyone buying 'comprehensive' insurance and then immediately cancelling it once they have the number? How would it actually function if I needed to go see a doctor here?

I'd be very grateful for any insights; I feel like I'm going round and round in circles trawling the message boards and I just don't know what the best option is.

Thanks,

Aaron
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Yorkshireman
post 9.Oct.2012, 03:54 PM
Post #2
Joined: 22.Nov.2011

Skatteverket, but the UK Social unfortunately.

Your Right of Residence is based upon person of sufficient means, which implies You can cover all Your own costs. Part of the reasoning that Skatteverket use with regards refusing to issue personal numbers if You do not provide the EHIC plus a few other forms, S1 + 3 more!!! from the UK Social, is that You are not covered by the UK Social Insurance, not just Health Care, more rather Everything. They use the EHIC as proof that You are covered by Social Insurance, without it You are a risk of becoming a burden to Sweden's Welfare System and therefore they deny Your application. Even with Comprehensive Medical Insurance it is likely they will refuse you a personal number.

You have 2 choices, get the stuff with the UK sorted, ie. go back and this time don't say You have moved permanently until later ... or, find a job, even part-time, and then after a while everything will click into place.
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trumanshow
post 9.Oct.2012, 07:11 PM
Post #3
Joined: 8.Aug.2012

Hi Aaron,

Join the wonderful club. I had the same experience and different equally annoying experiences. I got a pn in the end without what they said that I needed. I got my right of residence because of Sambo and she had to produce paperwork to say that we were indeed samboing. I was turned down with only proof of a short work contract having been misadvised by migrationsverket. I chanced my arm a bit as i had read on here that it was occasionally a little random. 3 skatteverket employees all sit in a row facing me told me that I needed private medical insurance and letter from my sambo saying that she would buy me some ramin noodles and a loaf of stale bread to feed to the ducks whilst kicking my heels. Although individually they couldn't come up with that information, collectively they pieced it together. However, i took my registration card to the other skatteverket office knowing there was a none-Swede working there and he processed it. It was then confirmed as OK by someone with an African sounding name in Gothenburg. I don't actually know to this day if there are any hard and fast rules or if i just got lucky. If you go to the 'Sweden' website it doesn't tell you that you need any of this stuff. Ultimately it happened how they tell you it happens. EU citizen - register right of resident - go to Skatteverket, get personnummer. I even contacted the European Commision legal advice team and they told me that Sweden is a real problem in this area because of withholding personnummers. They told me to persevere - which i did. I suppose its very complicated but I would assume that a Swede traveling to the UK wouldn't have all this nonsense.
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trumanshow
post 9.Oct.2012, 07:28 PM
Post #4
Joined: 8.Aug.2012

"You encounter in Sweden a problem that most of EU citizens do to get a personal number, without which you cannot do anything in Sweden: open a bank account pass agreements, going to hospital. The Skatteverket is the provider of this number but they are issuing this number only if you prove that you are holder of the so-called portable document S1. (which is wrong other forms and proofs of health insurance can also be presented)."
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MTBB
post 10.Oct.2012, 07:57 AM
Post #5
Joined: 24.Aug.2012

I'm from Holland, tried three times through Sambo and got refused. I gave up. I'm quite disappointed on things here anyway so probably my Swedish GF and me will move on. I'm currently uninsured, which bothers me a bit. That's why I'm flying over to Holland in two weeks and register myself back there. In that way I can get a health insurance in Holland again, and on paper I'm here just as a tourist. If nothing else works that might be a solution for you as well
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Puffin
post 10.Oct.2012, 09:08 AM
Post #6
Location: Dalarna
Joined: 5.Apr.2006

By applying for an EU sufficient means permit you are guaranteeing that you will not be a burden on the Swedish state at all (as you will not be paying taxes here?) and so you must cover your own healthcare costs. However if you had a job or had applied for a family ties permit then your healthcare would be covered.

Unfortuntely the European healthcard if only for short term visits to other countries - it is only for emergency care as well. So for example if you slip on the ice and shatter your leg - the EU card will cover the x-ray and the plaster but not the long term physio and medical care as it is assumed that you return to your home country for this. You are not allowed to use the EU card for living in another EU country - the UK are now taking a tough line on this owing to the rise ofhealthcare tourists including people living abroad but who never register for taxes in their new country and are then returning to the UK for medical care as they do not pay taxes anywhere

If you have sufficient means approved by MV could you not just take out private healthe insurance for 6-12 months (Skatteverket would accept this) and then look for a job in Sweden that will give you cover for *both* medical and social insurance
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AaronS
post 11.Oct.2012, 02:38 PM
Post #7
Joined: 8.Oct.2012

Thanks for all the responses; they're very helpful.

I have considered the option of going back to the UK and re-registering there before coming back here as a 'tourist', and I think it might end up being the solution.

I'm still unclear as to what exactly the PN entitles one too. Is it the case that as soon as you have a PN you have access to Swedish healthcare just as any Swede would? In that case, I just don't understand the requirement for insurance, because as I said before you could just cancel any private insurance the moment you had the PN, or not claim back from it when you had treatment. If you get a PN as a person of sufficient means, do they somehow put a note on your record that says if you go to the doctor you still have to pay?
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Puffin
post 11.Oct.2012, 04:35 PM
Post #8
Location: Dalarna
Joined: 5.Apr.2006

QUOTE (AaronS @ 11.Oct.2012, 03:38 PM) *
Thanks for all the responses; they're very helpful.I have considered the option of going back to the UK and re-registering there before coming back here as a 'tourist& ... (show full quote)

I have heard that you have to live in the UK for 6 months before you can be reregistered

QUOTE
I'm still unclear as to what exactly the PN entitles one too. Is it the case that as soon as you have a PN you have access to Swedish healthcare just as any Swede would? In that case, I just don't understand the requirement for insurance, because as I said before you could just cancel any private insurance the moment you had the PN, or not claim back from it when you had treatment. If you get a PN as a person of sufficient means, do they somehow put a note on your record that says if you go to the doctor you still have to pay?

The PN with give you access to education, kommun services, unemloyment office, long term/chronic medical care

I guess the fact that you have your own insurance pay be attached to your number and show up on the computer - not entirely sure how they do it

You always have to pay to see the doctor in Sweden - they difference is that you only pay about 10% with a full personal number
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johnjohn
post 9.Nov.2012, 02:07 PM
Post #9
Joined: 10.Dec.2010

bump
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Pursuivant
post 9.Nov.2012, 02:25 PM
Post #10
Joined: 12.Aug.2008

Basically in all the Nordic countries (and the UK as well) you won't be give the right to put your fingers into the pie before you contribute into baking it. Sweden's system denies you the PN that gets you access to various things, but thats just because they've lumped everything to be conveniently done with Skatteverket and the one number then works everywhere due to the principle of all residents getting equal welfare. Other countries in the region will give you a PN or equivalent, but either the "computer says no" or they require the EU registration done and the police won't give you one because you can't show health insurance (or job contract). So its not a Swedish invention, and frankly, if the UK gives benefits to any Tomasz, Diego and Hans that show up, thats the UK's "problem" of being too lax rather than Swedens problem of being too tight. After all, the EU is talking of "free movement of workers" and not "free movement of welfare recipients".
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frenchviking
post 11.Nov.2012, 09:15 AM
Post #11
Joined: 19.Aug.2012

I have also gone through the painful experience... In my case i had an apartment and a job when i arrived, and still it was a pain...
I lived on other eu countries and it was much easier there...
But i am pretty sure it would be a pain in france too so i should not complain here!

One way that seems much easier is if you come inas a refugee! No problem to get free everything then and on top of that you can complain that you are not satisfied and you will receive more and get the poor people that helped you investigated for not giving you enough...
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kityatyi
post 13.Nov.2012, 11:15 AM
Post #12
Joined: 4.Nov.2012

Frenchviking, you are right...

It is totally annoying that we as EU citizens are getting rejected, whilre refugees are accepted so easily, they get everything immediately. Then what is the point of being an EU citizen... This is discrimination.
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Puffin
post 13.Nov.2012, 11:30 AM
Post #13
Location: Dalarna
Joined: 5.Apr.2006

QUOTE (kityatyi @ 13.Nov.2012, 11:15 AM) *
It is totally annoying that we as EU citizens are getting rejected, whilre refugees are accepted so easily, they get everything immediately. Then what is the point of being an ... (show full quote)

Do you even know what you are talking about? Most refugees wait years in Migrationsverket camps before they are approved - the ones that I did SFI with had been in Sweden for 2-4 years before getting approval where they get 30-70kr/day to live on (hence the school lunch row in Öland)

The only ones that start life straight away are the quoto refugees that Sweden takes from UN - but their status is assessed in the refugee camps in war-torn areas prior to coming to Sweden

Personally I would hate being on the refugee introduction programme and have to *ask the social worker's permission* to buy larger items and have social workers checking up on me - some social workers can be very nasty and march into SFI announcing that they have come to check up on so and so's attendence and grades!!

EU people have it much easier in comparison - it is really only people on the "own funds" permits that have problems and people do not understand that "own funds" relates to full healthcare coverage
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Zedman
post 1.Apr.2013, 08:45 AM
Post #14
Joined: 16.Mar.2006

After suffering similar problems and being on the verge of catastrophy i contacted the EU, i was passed to their advice people. Here is a section of their reply:

The taxboard is wrong.This problem, persists since at least two years. The situation is as you say very frustrating and in violation of Directive 2004/38/EC on the free movement of citizens an their family members. Citizens have no access to any service, telephone, internet bank account, follow courses..
Sweden is infringing Directive 2004/38/EC on the right of citizens of the Union and their family members to move and reside freely within the Territory of the Member States. the directive has been transposed into the "Alien's Act no 2005:716) see:
http://www.riksdagen.se/webnav/index.

They went on to say:

We recommend that you make a complaint to the Commission.
Anyone may lodge a complaint with the Commission against a Member State for any measure (law, regulation or administrative action) or practice attributable to a Member State which they consider incompatible with a provision or a principle of EU law. You will find a complaint form on:
http://ec.europa.eu/eu_law/your_rights/you...ts_forms_en.htm
You should also send a copy of this to the Employment DG, their address is:
EMPL-B4-UNIT@ec.europa.eu

So there you have it, You are all right and the taxman is wrong. It is a known problem which if enough people contact the comission may get sorted especially as one of the top people who is supposed to be ensuring EU policy is followed is Swedish (just a tad hypocritical).

Good luck to all
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PDX
post 1.Apr.2013, 09:16 AM
Post #15
Location: Stockholm
Joined: 2.Aug.2011

QUOTE (Zedman @ 1.Apr.2013, 09:45 AM) *
Sweden is infringing Directive 2004/38/EC on the right of citizens of the Union and their family members to move and reside freely within the Territory of the Member States.

Erm.. they are not refusing you to move and reside in the EU, the Migrationsverket grants that. They are refusing the personnumber and rightly so if you come here only to enjoy the social security benefits.

~~~PDX~~~
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