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Driving and phoning

Road conditions

Seamus Sean
post 7.Dec.2012, 08:16 PM
Post #16
Joined: 4.Oct.2009

I am afraid to say I disagree and firmly believe that a law banning the use of hand held, or even hands free phones while driving would make the roads safer.

A person could drive and hold a conversation without driving dangerous, in fact they could drive the same road every day of the week and have a phone conversation each time but what happens if the unexpected happens, i.e kid runs out in front of said car? Reaction time is greatly reduced and someone ends up serious hurt or dead.

Now that driver had driven that road all year long, he/she had driven past cops who saw him or her on the phone but as the driver wasn`t driving in a "dangerous manner", which I take it you mean at a speed higher than what is the limit or swaying from side to side etc, having only one hand on the wheel and the other to your ear is deemed not dangerous enough for a ban at this moment in time in both Albania and Sweden, so there is someone serious hurt, maimed, crippled or dead but rest asured the guilty party will be punished in my opion a little too late to have saved a family a lot of hurt and why??

Because a government body told us it wouldn`t stop people using their phones while driving having a law banning the use of phones while driving! In a land where not cleaning the laundry room after you gets you reported to the land lord or parking in the wrong parking place gets a phone call to the qpark people, playing music a little too loud gets a neighbour ringing the cops, where having your dog poo and not picking it up...etc. you get the idea, of course it would work, every one would be reporting each other on such a scale that within a month...no, I reckon a week a driver using a phone whilst at the wheel would be as rare as hens teeth and the roads would be a safe place to be!!!
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Yorkshireman
post 7.Dec.2012, 11:59 PM
Post #17
Joined: 22.Nov.2011

QUOTE (Seamus Sean @ 7.Dec.2012, 08:16 PM) *
Because a government body told us it wouldn`t stop people using their phones while driving having a law banning the use of phones while driving!

No, that was just one part of input. There is no ban on mobile phone use whilst driving because no proposal for legislation creation/amendment has been presented to, voted on, and passed through Parliament.
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Flutterbye
post 8.Dec.2012, 12:05 AM
Post #18
Location: United Kingdom
Joined: 11.Feb.2010

I'm somewhat stunned, it never occured to me that Swede's could use mobiles while driving, just assumed it would have been banned.
Although it is illegal here in the UK it makes no difference, never a day goes by I don't see someone on their mobile chatting while driving. angry.gif
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Hisingen
post 8.Dec.2012, 12:36 AM
Post #19
Location: Västra Götaland
Joined: 5.Jul.2012

Here in Sweden they can drive, talk on the phone, text, do whatever they like it is not dangerous. Well that is what the minister responsible said, and she should know, since doubtless she is chauffeur.-driven, and can therefore talk or text at will. I followed a woman driver the other day who was talking more or less endlessly on her mobile, weaving around roundabouts, clearly - somehow - changing gear, steering now and then, but when forced to stop at yet another roundabout, seemed a bit put out and flustered as to where to put her car - or phone - I don't know which.
I have downloaded an episode of Traffic Cops from Sky which I am seriously thinking of putting onto a DVD and sending to the minister concerned. It is an episode in which a texting lorry driver ran into the back of a stationary column of traffic at full speed, on a motorway, killing the young lady driver in the car that he squashed into an unrecognisable heap of metal. There, the police were hard-put to obtain the necessary evidence, but they eventually managed it, and the driver, after months of pleading not-guilty, finally confessed just before his trial, and was then put away.
It is not simply a case of talking on a phone, it occupies one hand, too, or two if the driver is texting, so in effect who the heck is driving the car??????
Any policeman who had been to a road accident that has been caused by the driver using his/her phone whilst driving will tell you that such a driver is a downright menace on the road. And often, it is one of those policemen who has the painful task of going to the home and notifying the relatives of the fatality when such is the case.
They know it, we on this forum know it, but the powers-that-be seem to be living in cloud cuckoo land.
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Yorkshireman
post 8.Dec.2012, 01:37 AM
Post #20
Joined: 22.Nov.2011

QUOTE (Hisingen @ 8.Dec.2012, 12:36 AM) *
They know it, we on this forum know it, but the powers-that-be seem to be living in cloud cuckoo land.

Should legislation be created for everything that has the potential to be dangerous?
one could also argue:
- it is the drivers that are dangerous so all drivers should be banned.
- Vehicles are dangerous, they should be banned from the roads.
- Mobiles are dangerous, they should be banned.
- when all 3 are together, they are dangerous, so all three should be banned.

It is not explicitly legislated against having sex whilst driving! Yet if you have an accident whilst doing so, or are caught by the police doing so ...You will be charged with negligence.

Today there is legislation that one must follow the speed limit set for the road one is driving on. Yet, people speed. A lot of time, resource and technology is used to police this ...yet people still speed. Now, there are more and more radar speed traps, they don't stop people from speeding, doesn't stop speeders from causing accidents/killing, it has just turned that law into a revenue generating process.

How much are You willing to spend to police and enforce a mobile use whilst driving ban? How can that be achieved?, more police on the roads?, It is costly enough just to try police the existing road laws, and what the research questioned was, is there proof that legislation reduces accidents?, are there other ways to tackle the problem eg. technology solutions, education etc...
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Seamus Sean
post 8.Dec.2012, 09:25 AM
Post #21
Joined: 4.Oct.2009

You are still not getting what I am saying about the way Sweden works.

People more or less play by the rules, partly down to being genuine good, decent law abibing people and partly down to this being a land of informers, curtain twicthing, shop your neigbhour types, the only requirment for policing such a ban is a "hot line" a special phone number where Sven can report Anders and Anders can rat on Sven.

Stick the number on a few bus stops, local papers, even a TV ad, tell folk it´s their duty (as if they need encouragement) to report drivers seen using their phones whilst driving, a fine and a few points on the körkort awaiting those that are caught, and it won´t be just Anders word against Sven or Svens against Anders, their moblie networks will have records of when they were chatting or texting, ok they may claim they had pulled in at the time, but most people today can back up claims of wrong doing with photographic evidence...taken on their phones!
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Taxalien
post 8.Dec.2012, 11:04 AM
Post #22
Joined: 24.Dec.2009

Research have already proven that using a mobile phone is more dangerous than drink driving. Especially when texting, since the brain switches over to a different context and quickly loses track of controlling the vehicle.

I have also wondered why a country like Sweden, renowed for its nanny state character, refuses to impose a ban.

It seems so out of character.

However, I have come to a conclusion.

I was reading about the work that Swedens best police officer and foremost researcher in Dagens Nyheter a few weeks ago when it clicked for me.

In that article the journalist explains how Stefan Holgersson had camped around all over Sweden to get the facts behind the statistical output about the police work, which seemed to contradict reality.

One of the things observed was that police checks against drink driving appear to avoid periods when there are known peaks of drink driving related traffic accidents. Instead they put up these things when they are almost certain not to catch any offenders.

I therefore put it to you that the reason why use of mobile phones have not been banned while driving is that it masks the problem of drink driving.

There is almost no difference observing someone texting or using a phone from someone who is drunk at the wheel.

And everytime you are out driving we have habitually come to think of it as a mobile phone problem, which conveniently does not carry any penalty. We don't even consider that it might be that the driver is drunk or intoxicated any longer.

The strategy has therefore worked.

Before the age of mobile phones, if you saw anyone driving like that of a texting driver you would have assumed he was drunk and law abiding Swedes would have tried to contact the police.
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Yorkshireman
post 8.Dec.2012, 11:58 AM
Post #23
Joined: 22.Nov.2011

QUOTE (Seamus Sean @ 8.Dec.2012, 09:25 AM) *
You are still not getting what I am saying about the way Sweden works.

I have lived in Sweden for over 20 years, I think I have a pretty good idea how Sweden works wink.gif
QUOTE (Taxalien @ 8.Dec.2012, 11:04 AM) *
One of the things observed was that police checks against drink driving appear to avoid periods when there are known peaks of drink driving related traffic accidents. Instead ... (show full quote)

Close, but no banana wink.gif ...the police have a quota for the number of breath-tests they have to perform. They choose periods and locations of unlikely to catch anyone for 2 simple reasons ...they can meet the quota for the number of tests they must perform ...and the 2nd reason is manpower/resources and administration, if 2 police are doing the tests and they catch a drink driver they need to break from doing more tests to take that driver to the police station, or call up other officers to pick up the person ... all of which takes time away from meeting the quota for the number of breath-tests. As one retiring senior police man said not so long ago ... they even at times where they were in danger of not meeting the quota, took turns in the station to blow their own tests/samples to get the number up to quota biggrin.gif
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Yorkshireman
post 8.Dec.2012, 12:13 PM
Post #24
Joined: 22.Nov.2011

And just to add ... no-one is saying that mobile-phone use whilst driving is not dangerous ...what they say is that it is pointless to create a specific legislation banning it, when that legislation has proven ineffective in other countries, the issue needs to be tackled in other ways.

As someone pointed out, the majority of people know that it is dangerous, but they still do it. Just as drivers know it is against the law to drive above the speed limit, but still do it. Creating a law that bans it, does not change that behaviour ...not even in Sweden!

As said, one can already be charged with negligence.
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Seamus Sean
post 8.Dec.2012, 12:45 PM
Post #25
Joined: 4.Oct.2009

[quote name='Yorkshireman' date='8.Dec.2012, 10:58 AM' post='780023']
I have lived in Sweden for over 20 years, I think I have a pretty good idea how Sweden works wink.gif

Aha now things are becoming clearer...you have been here so long you now also just take what governments or government bodies tell you to be 100% correct and right without using your own God given logic.

To say that there is no point in bringing in a ban because people would not stop using anyway, (has to be true the government said so) is a tad silly, why not allow people to drink and drive so, take away speed limits, wearing of seat belts, I am sure if a report was published on official government paper saying to do would make no difference to anything you would be standing up for just such changes in the law!!!!!

As I have said already I haven`t studied any government reports into the use of phones being reduced in other lands due to bans being in place I only have my own two eyes and see a hell of a lot less use of phones by drivers in other European countries I visit...but hey maybe in another few years I will stop believing my own eyes and instead swallow everything I am fed from the government also!
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Hisingen
post 8.Dec.2012, 12:53 PM
Post #26
Location: Västra Götaland
Joined: 5.Jul.2012

The point is that as long as those in power are saying quite clearly that it is OK to use a cell phone for calls and texting whilst driving, then people will continue to do it - just because - - - -.
In the UK the message is gradually getting through, especially when the offenders get hit both in the wallet (where it hurts) and with penalty points on their licence. Sure there are those who think it is clever, but there it is laid down that it is dangerous, in contrast to Sweden where 'it isn't'.
Texting is on the increase, which is like driving a vehicle with blinkers on. But it is not illegal. That is my point. You can wriggle all you like, but I hope that you don't do it anywhere near me, matey.
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Hisingen
post 8.Dec.2012, 01:17 PM
Post #27
Location: Västra Götaland
Joined: 5.Jul.2012

By the way, your 20 years in Sweden is but a short time. I have been here since 1960, and have seen many changes, many of which are/were not for the better.
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jostein
post 8.Dec.2012, 01:42 PM
Post #28
Joined: 22.Mar.2011

Being a terribly bad driver myself i would not dream of using a cellphone while driving. When i get into a difficult situation while driving I usually just cling to the steeringwheel so hard my knuckles turn white and close my eyes and hope desperately nothing bad will happen to me..

I generally agree with the posters that say that Swedes have a strong tendency to obey rules, a ban on cell-phones while driving would have effects on Swedes.
My personal prejudice is that such bans do not filter over to the nonswedish population of sweden.
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Hisingen
post 8.Dec.2012, 03:02 PM
Post #29
Location: Västra Götaland
Joined: 5.Jul.2012

QUOTE (jostein @ 8.Dec.2012, 01:42 PM) *
. . . . I generally agree with the posters that say that Swedes have a strong tendency to obey rules, a ban on cell-phones while driving would have effects on Swedes. My perso ... (show full quote)

The same applies to the UK at a guess, in both respects to the quotation.
But Yorkshireman is still missing the point that, with a minister saying that it is not dangerous, who will think that it is as a result??
Generally Swedes are pretty law-abiding. See how they bend over backwards to the EU regulations!!
With a law saying that it is dangerous to use a phone whilst driving, then they have it in black and white that such is the case. With hopefully positive results.
But as long as those at the top maintain their attitude, then the driving populace will not react in a positive way since it is OK not to do so.
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Bender B Rodriquez
post 8.Dec.2012, 03:54 PM
Post #30
Joined: 25.Mar.2006

The idea that Swedes are particularly law abiding is just a bunch of BS.

It is now law to wear seat belts on buses. How many Swedes have you seen wearing seat belt on the bus?
It is the law to use indicators when exiting a roundabout. How many Swedes do you see doing that?
It is against the law for bars to serve intoxicated people. How many bars do you see doing that?
How many Swedes bother to follow the speed limits? Not many.

Sure, we could introduce a new law against the use of mobile phones in cars, but if you believe that it would have a significant effect only because "Swedes are law abiding", then you're just naive.
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