• Sweden's news in English

Nightclub ordered to pay for ethnic discrimination

Peter Vinthagen Simpson · 23 Feb 2010, 13:24

Published: 23 Feb 2010 13:24 GMT+01:00

Facebook Twitter Google+ reddit

The court has ordered Elite Hotels to pay 15,000 kronor ($2,000) to each of the six men who were refused entry to the Nasty nightclub and filed a complaint with the discrimination ombudsman (DO) alleging ethnic discrimination.

"That's great. Of course this is positive. I wish that this was given more attention - I hadn't heard about this ruling until you called, for example," one of the men, Waqas Yousaf, said when The Local called on Tuesday.

The young men, whose appearance is described by the court as "foreign", decided to act on their suspicions that they were systematically refused entry to bars and nightclubs in Stockholm due to their ethnicity.

On the night in question, April 3rd 2005, the men recruited some friends whose appearance is classified by the court as "Swedish" and divided themselves up into separate groups according to their ethnic appearance.

When the two groups - identical in age, gender and attire - approached the entrance of Nasty the group with a "Swedish" ethnic appearance was let in unhindered, while the group with a "foreign" ethnic appearance was refused.

The door staff at Nasty, which was then housed in the Elite Hotel Stockholm Plaza Hotel in central Stockholm but has since closed, told the group that the club was having an invitation-only Easter party, information that was not mentioned to the group with "Swedish" appearance.

The whole incident was recorded on film and the court ruled that the video evidence supported the men's testimony.

The court has thus ruled that discrimination did occur and furthermore established that Elite Hotels was responsible for the door staff at the nightclub, thereby upholding DO's appeal of a district court ruling dismissing the case on the grounds that Elite Hotels could not be held liable for the actions of Nasty AB's staff.

Elite Hotel's explanation that the door staff's comments were just part of the standard nightclub practice of "white lies" told to maintain the right age group of clientèle at the club was ruled by the court to be insufficient to prove that discrimination had not occurred.

Story continues below…

The court has ruled that Elite Hotels pay the sum of 15,000 kronor to each of the men plus interest, and that each party should pay their own court costs.

The Local asked Waqas Yousaf if he felt anything had changed in Stockholm in the years between the incident and Tuesday's ruling.

"I am in another situation now, so it has changed for me - I don't go out as often as I did then," he said.

Peter Vinthagen Simpson (news@thelocal.se)

Facebook Twitter Google+ reddit

Your comments about this article

14:37 February 23, 2010 by Deema
Everywhere else, I am always welcomed into clubs free of charge just because i am foreign. The swedes need to learn common courtesy! it will only benefit them.
14:58 February 23, 2010 by livinginsweden
I am gathering a group of 500 foreign guys to visit all these nightclubs with video cams .... i am sure we cam teach these racist clubs a bigger and more expensive lesson ...

Want to make some easy money?

ha ha
15:21 February 23, 2010 by Beef
Great news. I've had this treatment too as a non-white immigrant. I've actually given up trying to get in anywhere in certain parts of Stockholm. It is absolutely horrible feeling. Good on them for taking this this far...
16:00 February 23, 2010 by eZee.se
should have been 150k instead of 15k each.

I dont care if you are an Arab, Indian, Brit or whatever, as long as you are coming in to party in a decent way and not act like a pr!ck, they should not discriminate.

I have heard a lot of stories like this, and although i this never happened to me I can sympathize,

Like I said above, the fine was too low, but hey in a country where multiple rapes gets you less than 2 years and filesharing a song carries upto 2 years... what can be said?
16:19 February 23, 2010 by Beavis
Wonder why this took 5 years to go through.. Leaving the nightclubs in Stockholm free to openly discriminate.
16:24 February 23, 2010 by Mb 65
If they had gone in two's they would most probably been let in. Clubs don't like groups of men no matter what race they are.
16:32 February 23, 2010 by pallomamy
well done!
17:09 February 23, 2010 by peropaco
This is one of the disgusting thing about the nightclub life in Stockholm and i am sure its the same in Göteborg and Mälmo as well. Riche, Sturehof, Sturecompagniet, Bistrojarl are all the same. Last summer I had a friend visiting from Monte-Carlo and he experienced the same treatment. Scumbags
17:52 February 23, 2010 by mannorun

I am with you all the way.It could really be easy cash!!


@Mb 65 you're kidding me.

This has nothing to do about coming in two's, simply say they are racists.

It's really a shame, but what do you do when you have some group of freaks who have not experienced life outside this "village" of ours...
17:59 February 23, 2010 by Kaethar
It's actually very simple as to why they do it. In Sweden people who don't look ethnically Swedish are often assumed to be poor (since many non-ethnic Swedes and immigrants are in fact poor). And because of this they wouldn't tip as much.

This is basic business and maths and all clubs do it in Sweden - even the ones run by immigrants. ;)
18:04 February 23, 2010 by bezjaj
The biggest racist are those who force their women to stay home and hide their faces, and then preying as their natural right.. As a restaurant owner I dont want them at my place..No hains, just trubble..
18:12 February 23, 2010 by peropaco
@Kaether so what you are saying is that in order to get into night spots in Sweden people need to look as if they are devoid of any blood in their system? So what about us naturally tanned people? Should we curl up in a corner and not go out at all? Or maybe we should buy a green barbour jacket and play the game in order to get in to the drunken spots?
18:23 February 23, 2010 by calebian22
Talk to any night club owner, or security staff. There is a demographic that causes more fights and causes more trouble than other groups. Clubs are for drinking, socializing and having a good time, not fighting and ganging up 5 on 1. Until reasonable people within that demographic, police their own trouble makers this kind of "discrimination" will continue.
18:33 February 23, 2010 by Audrian
We should not be apologetic. We should learn from history. In Hitler's Germany the ordinary people looked for reasons to justify Germany's cruelity against Jews, Romas and Polish when none existed. The result was the holocaust. The same thing can happenining in Palestenia. The people of Israel are rationalizing the criminal behavior of their right wing governments against Palestenians. They need to walk up as we should in Europe.

Where ever racism is played it is inherently evil.
19:34 February 23, 2010 by grantike
if the vart actually didnt allow them to enter and uttered some ethinicity words or whatever then ,these guy deserve even more more for compensation.as a dark skinned based on my origin.i have been to club at london uk.the varts there said they have not seen my face before.was almost turned back untill some1 i came with said i know him let him go in after undergoing series of metal detector and search.it can happen to anyone.but let them shun racism.its so bad.
21:07 February 23, 2010 by Bölö
Elite Hotel owner Bicky Chakraborty is Indian & immigrant to Sweden. Shame to hear the news
22:30 February 23, 2010 by canam
I think it's unfortunate that this is what happens here in "progressive" Sweden but if you own a private establishment shouldn't you be able to discriminate because it's your place? I'm not saying it's right and it's probably bad business-sense, but it wasn't a public venue. Any thoughts?
23:33 February 23, 2010 by MachineGunGirl
Racism here in Sweden is not only perpetuated from swedish people to others... also among different races here in Sweden, we all are a lil racist... you just need to know when, where and how racist you are... disliking someone could be called racism too, that's pure bs.

@calebian22: I've seen swedish boys picking fights as well, never saw a non-swedish guy doing it. Then again, I live in a small town. Maybe the reality in bigger cities is different.

@besjaj : I agree with you! Totally!

@Kaethar: that's ridiculous! But it could be true =/ business is business. Anything's possible in this world, unfortunatelly

@livinginsweden: you made me LOL hahaha!!! I wanna make some money!!!
00:01 February 24, 2010 by bezjaj
@MachineGunGirl, most be boring..to live in a small town in Sweden. Dead boring..
00:26 February 24, 2010 by Deema
Kaethar, I tip not less than 15% in bars, restaurants, and taxis. I have yet to meet a swede who tips more than 3%!!! what you're saying is simply fictional.

bezjaj, all i can say to you is: get a life.. and by that i don't mean "watching TV".
00:44 February 24, 2010 by Blackman_for_Blondes
Well I always get in :)

Im a 196cm & 120kg Jamaican extraction (im a nigger and proud) ex boxer from London with my blondes on my arm, anyway that elite hotel group is owned by a rat from India....who treats his staff and especially our beautiful Swedish women badly as well. He owns the bishop arms chain of pubs too now fancy a curry eating Indian like that so dont blame the swedes!!!
02:46 February 24, 2010 by JoeSwede
Is this the glass ceiling that one has to crash through in order to make it in Sweden? Go get an education and contribute to society. Work hard. See if you can attend an engineering meeting.
05:10 February 24, 2010 by Norrlands Turk

Well said.

But its still annoying to know that such a discrimination exists.
08:10 February 24, 2010 by Renfeh Hguh

I think they need maths lessons really. I've been queuing (if you can call it that when it is more like a fight for the bar) at clubs with English and American friends, clearly old enough to be working and making our presence known to the bouncer.

They let the pretty little blonde students in who will either drink water or slowly sip on a glass of wine, the "pretty boy" Swedes who probably got half wasted at some ones apartment before arriving their and will only drink stor starks.

The group of us they did not let in should have been assumed to be tourists who are in all likelyhood are going to splash the cash. On those nights we were spending at least 1k each at the clubs we did get into.
08:32 February 24, 2010 by calebian22
Machinegun girl,

You are right, many Swedes do like to fight after a long night of drinking.

However, there is a huge difference between a one on one or a two on one fight and a 5 or 10 on one fight. These guys, judging by the one name, match the description of the demographic that starts the most brawls. Talk to any club security guard, don't take my word for it. Letting these 6 guys in as a group was a higher risk to the private establishment because of the actions of previous groups in the same demographic.

Even so, Mb 65 is right. If they had not been in a group, they would have been let in.
08:44 February 24, 2010 by Sunshine09
Well done to those guys for doing something about this! Sadly racism exists to some extent in nearly all people, simply because of your own ethnic background and stereotypes you are brought up with. Making people more aware of it is a good step to cutting down the barriers. It never feels nice to be discriminated against - I have even been discriminated against in my own homeland, and I am better educated than the average person, and it hurts!
09:09 February 24, 2010 by dsc

The Swedish group was late it. Lame argument. Letting the Swedish group in and refusing the other is still discrimination. So obvious, it hurts by brain just to read you say such nonsense with Mb 65
09:22 February 24, 2010 by Brugge
Maybe the clubbers don't want to party with foreigners? If it is their business, shouldn't they be able to decide so? "racism is inherently evil" is such a silly thing to say.
09:36 February 24, 2010 by dsc

Its like this. You need to nail your colours to the mast. in UK the BNP party had policy that they only allowed white people in their party, until recently. Everyone knew their racist policy and so no non-white bothered to apply for membership. So if these clubs would just come out in the open, I don't think non-whites would bother going there.

Racism is always a joke to those on the oppressors side.
10:18 February 24, 2010 by Mackan2017
Anyone who goes to nightclubs/discos (call the crapholes whatever you want) deserves all they get, inside or outside.

There's much more to life than these overpriced, overrated hovels.

Wake up!!!
10:33 February 24, 2010 by calebian22

How about this, on two separate nights get into a fight with a member of a group of "Svens" and then with a member of a group of "Wagas." Guess who's group of friends are more likely to hit you in the back of the head with a bottle? Try it and see if I am right.
11:18 February 24, 2010 by Uncle
Are women invited to management positions in the land of Wakas Yusufs? Are indian/thai/pakistanis invited into every entaitainment place in the land of Jihad Mansours? Are christians invited to freely marry whomever they want in the same lands?

Oh, I forgot... WE are better than THEY are, hence WE will award them money. Pure racism in hidden form.
12:00 February 24, 2010 by square
Funny that the local is running this story when you look at the clubs and people shown in the Out On The Town pages on this site. It always shows pretentious dickheads clutching their champagne glasses thinking they're better then everyone else. These clubs are the same world over and baffles me why anyone other then a pure tool would even go there.
12:09 February 24, 2010 by Xcellent
@ uncle

sounds like you didnt get any for weeks and months and years....decades !!
14:11 February 24, 2010 by Uncle
@Xcellent. I didn't get? I enter clubs easily. Therefore I get enough.

It is someone else here who didn't get so long, that they went to court to complain.
15:56 February 24, 2010 by bezjaj

Good speaking man. I agree.
16:50 February 24, 2010 by CanadianInSweden
im a bartender and worked at some of the best nightclubs in the world and its common practice to have a ¨tough door¨ if the doormen don't like how you look, you don't get in..in my experience any 3 guys trying to enter a ¨decent club¨ together would never get in anyway..gotta keep a certain ratio of men to women.thats just how its done,almost everywhere in the world,if these guys were with 3 women im sure they would have had no problem.. unless the doormen said no foreigners allowed outright then this is ridiculous to me...trendy clubs have to keep there image,its how they keep there upscale clients coming back..

@deema ... same here,the second i show my Canadian passport to doormen at any club here in Göteborg i get in for free and ahead of the line,i do it whenever the line is long lol..play the stupid tourist
16:52 February 24, 2010 by dsc
Its always the fools who don't really have an idea what racism feels like who think its just an exaggeration they can make jokes about.


The reason you have shifted from your initial lame argument to another equally idiotic one, is that you have no clue really what you talking about. Better just shut up.
17:06 February 24, 2010 by Scornful_Luigi

I agree 100% with you.

THIS is real ethnic discrimination: "Jews leave Swedish city after sharp rise in anti-Semitic hate crimes", article from the Telegraph (UK). Link: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/sweden/7278532/Jews-leave-Swedish-city-after-sharp-rise-in-anti-Semitic-hate-crimes.html#
17:40 February 24, 2010 by CanadianInSweden
obviously most of you do not go out to decent places,so i will excuse your ignorance of the business.my advice is if u don't know what your talking about don't comment...this had absolutely nothing to do with racism,when someone gets proof that every single foreigner was denied entrance then i will eat my words,all this ruling will do is scare the nightclubs into relaxing the door which will hurt business overall. If a person doesn't dress to the standards set by the club,or come in big groups of guys i would not let them in,sorry,nothing to do with what country they are from.and i agree with calebian,the club i work at,90% of the problems are ¨foreigners¨(and i don't mean British,Americans,Aussies),harassing women and starting fights with the swedish guys that defend the women,and they dont spend money,the younger ones anyway,..3-4 weekends ago i had 3 Arab-looking guys thrown out because they were annoying me ,ordering 1 beer(complaining about the price and trying to negotiate,it was 40kr) and asking for 2 more empty glass's so they could split it,this happened 3 times,in the 4th they were gone..had nothing to do with what they looked like(that situation is a constant thing in my job).. why they paid almost 200kr each at the door when they can barely afford the cheapest beer shocks me.. as long as you dont violate 1 or more of a doorman's criteria,usually are:have money,look good and keep ratio of men to women ,then no problem,they guys in the article didnt fit,sorry
18:43 February 24, 2010 by calebian22

Thanks for setting me straight with your brilliant rebuttal.
19:35 February 24, 2010 by Blackman_for_Blondes
Your right canadiansweden spot on..
19:57 February 24, 2010 by Deema
It seems that the definitions of foreigner here is: Aussie, american, British, arab looking, asian looking.

The article didn't mention they were underdressed, nor middle-eastern. now the pure assumption they were denied entrance because they looked dark IS in fact RACISM!

Should i tell the story about the white-stingy-underdressed man who tried to touch my privates in one of the best clubs in stockhom then was punched by my Swedish (yet arab looking) friend?.. Nah, i doubt anyone will get my point!
21:33 February 24, 2010 by Mack
Stockholm clubs and their doormen are some of the most unfriendly on the planet. No place on earth have I been treated worse... I am white, well dressed and have money. Just got back from Club 69 in Riga... classy place with classy staff. Would take it over anyplace in Stockholm.
23:36 February 24, 2010 by Uncle
Deema - sure. Waqas Yusouf is a straight finnish name. His ancestors are probably dutch and he clearly has some Islandic blood.

That is why they did not let him enter...

And btw you should tell your theory to this Waqas. Tell him that his assumption that he was not let in because he had "foreign ethnic" appearance is in fact racist and he should pay damages to the club.
01:46 February 25, 2010 by svenskdod
@Deema, you are talking of one incident one time you were at a club. How many times have you been in a nightclub in your life? Stats man...

The majority of people who are commenting here, who actually work in the industry give the doormen just cause to this situation. When people come to a country and are told that they do not have to change their ways, act as you did in your home country, there are going to be issues. Another goal scored for the Multicultural police state.
03:01 February 25, 2010 by dsc
" When the two groups - identical in age, gender and attire - approached the entrance of Nasty the group with a "Swedish" ethnic appearance was let in unhindered, while the group with a "foreign" ethnic appearance was refused "

All the white nightclub experts are conveniently ignoring this part of the story. "Oh no, its not racism. If they were not in a group, they would have been allowed in." You can throw around other silly arguments since most of you are white and have never been on the other side of this issue, but this one is beyond stupid.
04:27 February 25, 2010 by CanadianInSweden
@dsc ...if they had just let in a group of 3 guys, which is lucky enough no club is going to just let in another group of 3 whether they are white,black,yellow or purple.. you people are just jumping to conclusions from one side of the story,there are 100 different reasons they wouldn't have been let in..it obviously seemed like these guys were trying to set the club up. iv never been to this particular club in Stockholm but iv asked friends from the city and they all said its a tough door,need to look and be dressed well...who knows the 3 that denied could have been ugly,fat or even argued over the cover price,many different things.its a private business,they should be able to allow or deny anyone they want,for whatever reason. For those of you that know Göteborg,do you think lounge,nivå or park lane should be allowing people in that are wearing sweatpants and hoodies?? of course not,its a direct threat to there business models..but im sure that fits into discrimination against poor people,same thing. i think this weekend im gonna find a club thats already full of guys and try to get in with 10 of my guy friends,WHEN( not if) they deny me im gonna sue and say they are racist against Canadians hahaha ..you people are obviously just jumping on anti-racism bandwagon and have no idea what actually happened and no knowledge of the business of nightclubs
08:58 February 25, 2010 by Caribbean guy/Swedish Gal
Hmmmm ive never had a problem ...

but then again before the even ask me a word i always hand them my canadian licence, it does the trick just fine.lol

I almost punched an arab guy to pulp the other nite for harrasing a girl and calling her names just because she dident wanna dance with him...what a bunch of ....
12:16 February 25, 2010 by Blackman_for_Blondes
Chill out brother these Arabs are not worth it...you hit one badly they will run to the cops and you get locked up and your blonde has no man..lol..they love the Swedish police you know
15:19 February 25, 2010 by Rick Methven
I do not go clubbing have not been to one for 20 years, BUT my adopted SWEDISH son with dark skin does go.

he goes with other WHITE Swedish friends and sometimes just him with his WHITE Swedish girlfriend. Often the Group or just the couple is barred, but if the mixed skin group is barred and the white skinned members go back without their dark skinned friends, they get in OK.

To all you so called experts spouting some much crap here a question

Is this racism or what?
15:25 February 25, 2010 by CanadianInSweden
@caribbean guy ...yeah i see that same thing all the time at work..it disgusts me how they treat women,and then they start fights with the guys around them when the women tell them F-off..i'm sure not all are like that but in my experience its very common..there religion teaches them that they are above women. When you get them in a nightclub with independent minded girls dressing sexy and drunk the guys act like they have been in prison and haven't seen a woman in 20 years. call it racism or not that's how it is,some of you need to get out more often.. before you all say anything yes it is wrong to just exclude all muslims,but because that behavior is so common you have to be more vigilant..iv tried to say this as delicately as possible ...
15:39 February 25, 2010 by Rick Methven
"..iv tried to say this as delicately as possible "

So what do you say when you are not being 'delicate'

You are certainly one racist SOB
16:39 February 25, 2010 by Uncle
Rick - I am sure that you live in the area with most condensed immigrant population in Sweden and happily send your kids to the most "deverse" kindergarten in the area, so they talk arabic and swahili fluently.

You also own a business that employs only immigrants and you let an arab accountant manage your business affairs and congolese lawyer sign on contracts for you....

Oh, no? So until then - STFU..
16:51 February 25, 2010 by CanadianInSweden
@Rick Methven ..im sorry i see the world how it is not how it should be,its more or less risk management,if you are constantly having problems with a certain group of people it is easier to just not deal with any instead of picking out the few good ones. its simple business,these clubs are potentially losing money by doing it.but they gain it back in reducing the risk,which experience gives them the data to evaluate the risk. they also take into consideration what kind of people the majority of customers want allowed in. best example i can think of is most clubs also have a age limit,some 20,some 22 some 25.. there is a good reason for that...you call it racism or discrimination,i call it business ..to me it doesn't matter where they come from,age,color of there skin,or style of clothing.if something doesn't fit into the business model do not allow it. this article just happens to be about there ethnicity,if it was 18 year olds not being allowed in,or guys in sweatpants not being allowed in i would give you the exact same argument
19:43 February 25, 2010 by Iraniboy
It's funny how everyone like to make a conclusion based on his own agenda without knowing any detail about the incident. For example the way the guys were dressed and the ratio of girl/boy etc can effect the equations sadly again those two groups of posters!! One argue how Sweden and all Swedes are racists. The other claims these immigrants are always bad, they can't speak properly, they humiliate women and this Arab, non Arab argument. Seriously though, I mostly communicate with Swedes since I have come to Sweden I haven't seen this anti-immigrant and hatred against foreigners in real Sweden as I have seen many in this forum!! Actually most of these posters turn out to be non-Swede!!!
04:24 February 26, 2010 by heartbeat
The court should also think about Birgerjarl Uppsal Night club, they also hurt people too much , once I was there one guy when reached at the end of long line after 2 hour standing in Que to the Guard , they did not alowed him , they made excused that your shoes are not good , one other swedish guy said that there is no thing wrong with his shoes , But they did not allow that guy .That guy was assian , he said its my second time that they not allow me.very very sad !!!!!!!
08:29 February 26, 2010 by Uncle
Oh, yeah, I forgot. I all the time forget that you just care about the poor 5 million palestinians and that is the reason of your activity in this forum...

Of course the suffering of 30 million kurds never crossed your mind. The suffering of millions of christians in muslim lands never bothered the grand liberal. The suffering of shia population in Yemen at this very moment never took a minute of sleep from the amazing freedom lover.

It is just the jewish state that aches in the teeth of iraniboy - the leader in tolerance. Just the jewish state's very existence has been on the mind of the second to no one, but Ghandi, iraniboy (and on this I can quote you). What may be the reason for this lover of Jews? Mmmm.... I cannot think of anything....

Yep. I surely would have lost in the court room against such a white pigeon.

One question - why "wannabe uncle"? Why - wannabe? Who wants or does not want to be an uncle?
08:40 February 26, 2010 by Rick Methven

You are one big racist SOB One does not need to have kids in an ethnic diverse school or employ Arabs. I happen to live in a very ethnically diverse Kommun but what give me much more insight and empathy in the matter is that I am a Whit man with a BLACK son. He has held a Swedish passport since the he was 6 months, speaks fluent Swedish and has done his military service for Sweden. He dresses smart and is over 25 BUT is discriminated against by Racist Sib's like you.

You have nailed your racist flag clearly to the mast . The words that come out of your mouth have the same smell as what comes out of your mouth. So STFU because the stench is terrible
09:23 February 26, 2010 by dsc

guys in sweatpants == guys in different skin? Those are comparable in your world?

Like Rick Methven has pointed out, you guys luck insight into this issue because you've never looked at the other side of the situation. Your view is warped and limited. Like I said before, you only have the oppressors view.
10:06 February 26, 2010 by Uncle
Rick - breathe... breathe... in and out...

Wonderful tirade. Continue to show yourself in this light! It is a pleasure to see you spitting and fuming like a which in a cartoon.

He is discrminated because of SOB's who came to Sweden and increased the crime rate by hundreds of percent. He is discriminated because of SOB's who burn cars, who beat up swedish kids in schools by ganging up on them, because of SOB's who attack firefighters and police, who are making entire communities in Sweden to un away from huge parts of cities.

Morons like you refuse to understand that if one is attacked by a bear, or even HEARD of one who is attacked by a bear, he will stay away of forests. It is called self preservation. I am sorry to hear about your son, but if he has 1% more brains than you, he himself understands why people discriminate him even in the MOST advanced society in the world.

I have two nigerian friends with a PhD (biology and IT systems). Both are team leaders in huge companies and are loaded with money.

They themselves are avoiding any contact with Somalians, cannot imagine themselves sending their kids to a non-private school and think exactly the same about the behaviour of the refugees here in Sweden.

It is not fair - I agree, but this is f.. life and in order to change it, change the cause of this.
10:21 February 26, 2010 by ATT

I think this sentence encapsulates your thinking process: "Morons like you refuse to understand that if one is attacked by a bear, or even HEARD of one who is attacked by a bear, he will stay away of forests."

You refuse to deeply analyze the problems and rather have an easy good against evil analysis. Also, you like to generalize, US against THEM. That's a sign of an undeveloped logic (and maybe even brain).

11:00 February 26, 2010 by Uncle
Thanks ATT, wonderful analysis. I feel that I screwed the system by getting it for free.

I am describing why people feel the way they feel and why there is discrimination in general public. The reasons are much simpler than your liberal mind fantasises. That is exactly why 140 millions in Russia dislike US, why 300 million in US dislike arabs, why europeans dislike refugees, etc.

Or it is very complicated... Mmm.
11:25 February 26, 2010 by ATT

Another master piece of generalization! Way to go.

I don't disagree that are some simple reasons for the hates going around, but I am strongly much against simplifications such as 140 million Russians dislike US or 300milion US dislike Arabs. Stating an obviously wrong fact like those often only discredits your entire comments even if you have some good points.
12:14 February 26, 2010 by Uncle
Do you have points disproving my assumptions? Of course there are people in Russia who feel nothing about US. OF COURSE there are people in US who LOVE arabs, or have no feelings whatsoever.

What I mean is that if it is possible for many liberal anti-discrimination activists here to claim that in SWEDEN blacks face discrimination (not "from specific individuals" and not "in specific situations", but "in Sweden" or "from swedes") it is as valid to say why "swedes" feel the way they do and why "in sweden" there is some sort of behaviour.

The same for Russia (media reports increasing dislike of US. Latest poll showed more than 70% of "strong dislike" and about 5% of like of US). If we are to b!tch about all swedes, we are to allow b!tching about all the immigrants. Or?
13:10 February 26, 2010 by ATT
@Uncle I am against generalization regardless if it is for what I believe in or against it. Statements like Swedish people are racist are so obviously wrong that they don't even need a response.

In my opinion, Racism is the father of all generalization. It follows this line of argument: since there are people with a given ethnic background that behave "badly" (whatever that is), we hate all people from such background because they are all the same.

Therefore, I believe to step away from such group hatred, we need to start seeing people as humans and individuals.
14:16 February 26, 2010 by Rick Methven

so you have 2 Nigerian friends so you are not a racist but on the other hand you hate anybody who looks like he might come from the middle east. and claim that 300 million Americans share your view.LOL

Your are a racist QED
14:32 February 26, 2010 by CanadianInSweden
@ATT you obviously must live in a gated community and sheltered off from the real world . no racism isn't right but refugees in Sweden and well everywhere iv ever lived (7 countries)have the same reputation..USA its the Mexicans, in Spain its the Africans, Greece its the Macedonians and Serbs,Italy its the Romanians.there's a very good reason for it usually,a great number of them cause trouble and it gives a bad name to them all.a group of people gain a reputation from experiences with them. that reputation doesn't apply to every single one.. but its risk management. think of it like this...the dutch are know for pot and sex..Americans are fat, war hungry baseball fans..english ,pint chugging football hooligans..doesn't mean every person from those countries is like that but there's enough people in that country to base a reputation. why do some towns ban pitbulls?? are every single one of them dangerous?? of course not...but they got a bad reputation from enough of them being dangerous. my personal experience in Spain,it is widely known to not work for a Moroccan or Algerian, because they will screw you every chance they can get.stick to Spanish and english owned bars..same in Greece,don't work for Macedonians,Turkish or Serbs.. if the refugees came to Sweden,got jobs and followed the law they wouldn't have this reputation,enough didn't and now they do . and yes i had many Moroccan,Algerian,Macedonian and Serb friends, not all are bad. but you need to be more careful with them,get to know them before trusting to much. Something my swedish gf told me my 1st week living in Sweden when i was going into the city (Göteborg) for the 1st time by myself... stay out of..(i forget the name).but its the neighborhood where a lot of the refugees live,its dangerous,malmo has the same type of neighborhoods where the police wont even go.. this is what happens when your immigration policy is equal to a wide open door and a guy on the other side holding a big bag that says free money on it. they come in and think they own the place,and when they are told they don't they sue for discrimination.AND WIN! in Canada we don't have this,nearly as bad anyway.we don't let in the trash people.we require them to have money and education before we let them in. The system isnt perfect and some trash gets threw but in general it works.
14:58 February 26, 2010 by Rick Methven
"in Canada we don't have this,nearly as bad anyway.we don't let in the trash people.we require them to have money and education before we let them in. The system isnt perfect and some trash gets threw but in general it works"

So you must have a real great ability to be able to sort out who is trash or not.

How do you determine if somebody who dresses smart has money and speaks the language fluently without an accent is trash or not?

Of course I know the answer if he is slightly dark skinned, has a hooked nose then of course he must be trash. LOL

Admit it you are one big racist SOB
15:02 February 26, 2010 by ATT

Yes, some prejudices are there and they are to some extend useful. I don't suggest to be naïve. I have middle eastern background and even I trust Swedes much more than an Iranian or an Arab for example when I am buying second hand stuff. As you said, it is a game of probability. It is more likely to be screwed by an middle eastern compared to Swedes.

Racism in my opinion is more serious because it is a deep hatred rather being careful. It is about dehumanization of the other people. It is a sort of feeling that allows normal people to kill the other side without feeling bad resulting in holocaust, or genocide.

So, yes, be careful when doing a business with Iranian but don't hate them! I strongly recommend all of you to see the movie called Farsan which is in cinema now. I think this movie is very successful in showing what I just said.
15:36 February 26, 2010 by Uncle
Rick - as usual, you are a dyslectic moron with inability to understand what he reads, express whatever he thinks and write it properly and do not deserve a reply.

You just undermine the general view of the "more educated open-minded liberals".

Oopps. did I generalise again? And think that most people think the same? Oh, I am sorry..

ATT - you are mixing everything with everything. Racism is not necessarily nazism. Racism does not mean killing everyone but yourself and alike you. By saying that you are careful with Iranis, but less careful with swedes, means that you draw immediate conclusions based on race and therefore - you are a racist. Or rather - "appearist", because you will probably be as careful with an arab as with dodgy looking swede.

However so am I, and every other reasonable person (except the all loving and peaceful Rickie there, who never assumed anything based on appearance, because he is the most open minded person ever, but curses people he never met like they were his colleagues back at the vegetables market).
15:54 February 26, 2010 by ATT

I didn't say that Racism is Nazism but rather I was refering to the deep dislike or hatred or more importantly dehumanization. If this result in a decision to actively eliminate the other party, or not is a different thing.

Such hatred is not present when one prejudices another person based on appearance. Using prejudice, one adjusts its behavior to the environment given previous experiences (as @CanadianInSweden put it, prejudice is a risk management).

So, I still insist that they are different.
16:17 February 26, 2010 by CanadianInSweden
what rick doesn't seem to understand is there is a massive difference between not liking all Arabs and not liking the Arabs in 1 place. like i said Canada has a great system of keeping the trash out.i have absolutely no problem with Arabs/Africans in Canada or most places...i do have a problem with the ones in Sweden,France,Spain,Holland(my personal experience in these countries) because of the loose immigration polices ,. they come here to sweden and totally take advantage of Sweden's generosity,they don't get a job,they don't learn swedish and commit a large part of the crime..they don't care about swedish culture or values,they come here for a easy life.it makes me sick that my taxes are paying for them.

Im not racist at all. im a realist,we i realize we dont live in a perfect world where everyone is good and you do what you need to do to protect yourself and yours from dangers based on opinions from your and others experiences.

so according to rick im a racist against great whites too i guess because i wont jump in the water with one,it might not eat me but there is good enough reason to believe it might from others experiences.
16:36 February 26, 2010 by Rick Methven
"Im not racist at all. im a realist,"

So was Hitler
16:58 February 26, 2010 by CanadianInSweden
are you seriously comparing me to hitler?
17:01 February 26, 2010 by Iraniboy
Wowww This comment simply digs out the route cause of most problems in our world! I need to save it somwhere!!

"I am against generalization regardless if it is for what I believe in or against it. Statements like Swedish people are racist are so obviously wrong that they don't even need a response.

In my opinion, Racism is the father of all generalization. It follows this line of argument: since there are people with a given ethnic background that behave "badly" (whatever that is), we hate all people from such background because they are all the same.

Therefore, I believe to step away from such group hatred, we need to start seeing people as humans and individuals"
18:06 February 26, 2010 by Rick Methven

"Therefore, I believe to step away from such group hatred, we need to start seeing people as humans and individuals" "


The problem with canadianinSweden is that he does not see an individual to him if you are not white Caucasian you are in his words trash irrespective of how look or behave he takes the attitude that because there are some non-white immigrants that misbehave then ALL non whites are trash.

as far as Uncle is concerned he is just another white trash racist. Just take a look at the posts that he has made. The same theme even the same old tired clichés that he has been using like an old vinyl record with the needle stuck in the same groove
19:23 February 26, 2010 by mumsy64
I don't usually jump in on other peoples pointless arguments but I felt like defending us Americans. First off all humans discriminate, it seems to be a part of our make up. My husband served in the US navy. The whites hated the blacks, the blacks hated the whites and the mexicans, the mexicans hated the blacks and the filipinos, and the filipinos hated every one, but especially the blacks. Mr. Methven you are a racist, apparently against your own race. Only a racist would use such an offensive term as white trash to describe another human. You can't tell me that you haven't judged someone based on the colorof their skin.

Anyway as for Americans and our problem with the illegal immigrant problem with Mexico. For many of us it isn't anything to do with skin color. It's money pure and simple, they are illegal, to work here they steal someone's identity, and let me tell you that is a real nightmare. Because they use a stolen identity many play the system, while both parents are emloyed they also collect welfare and other benefits under different names. And yes I know this to be a fact, the state knows it to be a fact, but federal law forbids them to ask one simple question : are you here illegally. Our hospitals are closing ( they aren't allowed to refuse treatment but aren't reimbursed when illegals don't pay), our schools are in trouble, etc. And the argument they do work others won't do. well try that one on someone who's son didn't go to work one day and find out the boss was firing all his skilled workers and hiring illegals for less money and under the table.

Finally, I find it amazing how often you Europeans point to America as examples of racism, I've read your posts and newspapers. As a woman with brown skin I'll take my chances right here in America.
23:54 February 26, 2010 by Alasdair MacCorquodale
I am Scottish. I only spent a highly enjoyable fortnight touring Sweden, about 20 years ago. It is a hugely attractive country. But It is not for a foreigner such as I to attempt to criticise another country's policies.

However I am deeply saddened that Sweden has apparently allowed large numbers of immigrants to acumulate in your country. This is the downside of always attempting to follow '' Liberal '' ideas and policies.

You really should be alert to the real risks of loosing your own country's culture and identity through the thoughtless admission of vast numbers of immigrants. My own politics are Conservative. You appear to be locked into a bogus ''enlightened'' liberal way of thinking that you dare not break out of for fear of the opposition from the Left.

We in Britain have allowed our immigrant communities to reach arond 5 million of Third World origin ( Pakistani, Indian, Nigerian etc.). Plus around 1 1/2 million Eastern Europeans.

this is beginning to arose huge tensions in Britain. I suggest you look to the lessons of the British experience with immigration to see what it holds for Sweden. Racism is a meaningless term whe it confronts with the loss of your own country's identity. These changes can happen with astonishing rapidity.
01:32 February 27, 2010 by jasondave2000
It seems to me that many of you did not even read the article. The story is that BOTH groups were dresses exactly the SAME and contained the SAME NUMBER of males, the only difference between the two being that one group was made up only of white males and the other only of ethnic males. The group of whites were let in without issue and the ethnic group was not only refused entry but also lied to about why...

Furthermore, I doubt very much that anyone here knows the facts of the story better than the APPELLATE COURT, the group of extremely well-educated and intelligent individuals who decided in favour of the plaintiffs...Cut the bs - it was a racist / discriminatory act. Whether you agree or not with one's right to perpetrate such an act or the bouncers' internal motivation, it is irrelevant...Let's not convolute the facts. Call a spade a spade!
01:37 February 27, 2010 by AmJim
I cannot help but agree to most of what "canadianinsweden" has said so far. Some clubs just won't let you in.

@ Alasdair MacCorquodale - My brother has been living in UK for 5 years now. Works in an American oil and gas firm and has origins from one of the third world nations you mentioned.

"this is beginning to arose huge tensions in Britain" Please name a few!
07:49 February 27, 2010 by Rick Methven

" Mr. Methven you are a racist, apparently against your own race. Only a racist would use such an offensive term as white trash to describe another human. You can't tell me that you haven't judged someone based on the colorof their skin"

White trash refers to the sort of white Americans who DO discriminate on the basis of colour how about the KKK how would you describe them?

With regard to judging somebody based on the colour of their skin You obviously do. If you read more of my posts, you would see that I am the White father of a dark skinned boy. I have travelled all over the world to some 88 countries with people of all colours, ethnicity religions. My guiding philosophy has always been and always will be is to judge a person on who he is rather than who he appears to be. Colour is only skin deep. There are people of all race who I like and dislike. Not on the basis of how they look but on the basis of what they do and what they say
06:06 March 3, 2010 by trinaican
@canadianinsweden what exactly does an american, brit or canadian look like that will distinguish them from the other 'foreigners'. And this question applies especially to the americans and canadians which are countries that have been founded on immigration of ALL TYPES of people.


funny you guys printing an article like this when ALL of the pics in your hot spots are swedish looking people...definitely not reflecting the demographic of your readers neither of the swedish population


YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY GROSS. Get yourself out of mental slavery..do you think you have 'arrived' inlife because your able to pick up a blonde??? Your actions are what perpetuate stereotypes..what other women are not good enough for u...god...youre human vomit!
22:26 March 3, 2010 by mumsy64
@rick methven

As for the KKK I would describe them the same as any other racist group.Horribly misguided, and even dangerous. Like it or not white trash is an offensive term. Over here not used just to describe a member of the KKK, but any poor white person.

And I did read your other posts sir and certainly did pick up on the number of times you referred to yourself as a white father of a dark skinned son. I am myself of native american descent, my husband is of Scottish and Irish descent( born in Londonderry), as a result our children are very varied in looks. And we have experienced racism, from many different sources. In one a mexican child at my sons school took to following him around and calling him N-g--r. when we reported it the principal actually looked at my brown skinned son, with the soft afro, and said" You must be mistaken, Eric's Mexican he wouldn't do something like that." Leaving me and the adult witness stunned. I didn't even know what to say to her belief that only whites are racist. While I've travelled no where near as much as you I have done so and I have witnessed racism in many places from many sources, and no I didn't judge you by your skin color but by your words.

You're right colour is only skin deep, That's why whenever a form of any kind asks for race my family always writes down the same answer: human. If it asks for ethnic group there's just one answer for us: American. After all anywhere we travel that's what we are always identified as. And these answer really bugs the government types that want to classify us. I'll be putting them on my US census forms again this year.
10:37 March 5, 2010 by amirhosein
I had heard about such discriminatory acts, though, hadn't been the subject to any.

Thanks for spreading the word.
07:08 March 26, 2010 by Icarusty
Ahaha, listen to some of the defences made here. "Look good" - that's subjective. Phrases like that and "don't fit" can mean anything - meaning it's open to racism.

"As for the KKK I would describe them the same as any other racist group.Horribly misguided, and even dangerous."

No, really? Dangerous? The group responsible for the sustained harrassment and deaths of non-whites, dangerous? Get out.

And "starting fights with the Swedish guys that defend the women" - are you sure it's not the (white) Swedes starting the fights themselves - after all, they are "your" women. Wouldn't want a dirty foreigner chatting up, and heaven forbid, SLEEPING with a white Swedish beauty, eh?

The worst thing about whites (not just Swedes, but all Europeans, Brits and Yanks) is that they refuse to accept racism and discrimination is happening - they pass it off as something else, make a joke, because hey - it won't effect them ever - they're white after all.

The fact is, white populations are still extremely insular in their thought processes. Never mind the laws that supposedly make everyone equal, the majority of whites not only dislike non-whites, but believe they are inferior to them in every way. Therefore when they see a couple such as that mentioned above of the non-white male with the white female (never mind if she's Swedish) the white men in particular get all huffy and possessive about it.

This is in stark contrast to other developed countries of the world with non-white majorities - Singapore, Dubai, Spain are good examples - a large but minority white community, and guess what? They all group together, belittle the locals, complain they don't speak English, think they are superior to the rest... they are let into nightclubs (even the poor, scruffy ones) and they get to talk to the local women without the native men "defending" them - compared to non-whites in white countries, they are given a free ride!
18:22 October 2, 2010 by Julie_Montreal
"Discrimination in a nightclub"? OMG Are you serious? These are private places: they are allowed to choose whoever they want to enter their establishment.

The reasons these clubs they don't allow these guys is simply because that's not what the market demand. Period. No point trying to turn this around into some debate on racism.

Girls in those clubs (if the club are more "trendy") mostly want to see hot, non-ethnic guys (not: short guys, not; ugly guys, not: old creeps guys but 'hot' non-ethnic guys) so that is what the "management" (i.e: the bouncers at the door) will let in mostly Offer and demand. Are you going to also going to take legal action against the club for discriminating against unattractive people?

Of course, you may take this to court, in some cases you may even "win" your case but ultimately, the club's clientele will just move to another club and you'll have accomplished nothing besides winning a few bucks.

Blame girls for having preferences (although that would be pointless of you) don't blame the owner or doorman who is just catering to their clients' preferences (and hey, tough luck if those preferences don't include you)

You have to remember that 'if' they let the arab guys in, they might take the risk that these guys might start approaching girls, making them flee the place faster than you can say it. Me and a some friends had some of these guys (mostly arabs) trying to pick us up. We had to call security because they can be persistent. These guys imagine that occidental girls are attracted to them, when they realized they are not they do not always react well (fortunately we mostly get hot guys approaching us) You can imagine what kind of problems arise as a result of them. Most girls in clubs would rather not deal with these undesirable modern unadapted. Bottom line: No girls = no guys. No girls and guys = no cash. No cash = out of business. Not a smart business move huh? If you want to (and I quote) "Fight Racism" take it elsewhere, you're not going to make girls attracted to you by threatening with legal action.

If you're into blaming might as well blame the fact that ultimately, you're not considered hot. Hell, blame your parents for not paying attention in sexual education classes but don't blame the clubs because that's just you being stupid.
Today's headlines
US election
Donald Trump won't get new Ericsson head's vote
Trump pictured at a campaign rally in Florida. Photo: Evan Vucci/AP

The new Swedish-American boss of telecoms giant Ericsson has revealed he will not vote for the Republican nominee in the forthcoming US presidential election.

Swedes named fourth most gender equal in the world
A file photo of men and women pushing prams in Stockholm. Photo: Claudio Bresciani/TT

Sweden has closed 81 percent of its overall gender gap according to the World Economic Forum.

Sweden: Russian warships in the Baltic 'worrying'
Swedish Defence Minister Peter Hultqvist. Photo: Vilhelm Stokstad/TT

Two Russian warships equipped with long-range missiles have entered the Baltic Sea after passing Denmark.

Why businesses are worried about Sweden's drone ban
A drone filming in Stockholm. Photo: Pontus Lundahl/TT

The Local investigates what Sweden's new drone ban could mean for businesses in the country.

This is the new top boss of Swedish Ericsson
Börje Ekholm. Photo: Magnus Hjalmarson Neideman/SvD/TT

Telecoms giant Ericsson has appointed a new CEO after a turbulent year for the company.

These are Sweden's best universities: ranking
A new university ranking has been released. Photo: Cecilia Larsson Lantz/Imagebank.sweden.se

At least according to this global ranking, which picks 12 Swedish universities among the top-1000.

Swedish pharmacies restrict paracetamol sales for teens
The move is intended to cut paracetamol overdoses. Photo: Nora Lorek/TT

Sweden's pharmacies are banning teens under 18 from buying more than one pack of pills at a time.

The Local List
12 Swedish words with just awesome literal translations
A filthy-minded lobster, i.e. a snuskhummer. Photo: Gorm Kallestad/NTB scanpix/TT

One of our favourite things about the Swedish language is its wonderful compound words, which range from being utterly bizarre to making perfect sense.

Rwandan genocide suspect held in Sweden
A memorial centre in Kigali, Rwanda. Photo: Ben Curtis/AP

A man has been arrested in Sweden suspected of involvement in the 1994 Rwandan genocide which claimed 800,000 lives.

Sweden can extend border controls, EU says
A police officer carrying out a check at Sweden's border with Denmark. Photo: Emil Langvad/TT

EU countries including Sweden should be granted permission to extend temporary border controls by a period of a further three months, the European Commission has decided.

Sponsored Article
Stockholm: creating solutions to global challenges
Sweden cuts 2016 refugee forecast
Sponsored Article
Last chance to vote absentee in the US elections
Is Game of Thrones coming to Sweden?
Property of the week: Kungsholmen, Stockholm
Blog updates

6 October

10 useful hjälpverb (The Swedish Teacher) »

"Hej! I think the so-called “hjalpverb” (auxiliary verbs in English) are a good way to get…" READ »


8 July

Editor’s blog, July 8th (The Local Sweden) »

"Hej readers, It has, as always, been a bizarre, serious and hilarious week in Sweden. You…" READ »

Sponsored Article
This is Malmö: Football capital of Sweden
Will Swedes soon be looking for fairtrade porn?
Sponsored Article
Where is the Swedish music industry heading?
The Local Voices
'I simply don’t believe in nationality'
Why we're convinced Game of Thrones is based on Sweden
People-watching: October 21st-23rd
Sponsored Article
Why you should 'grab a chair' on Stockholm's tech scene
Fury at plans that 'threaten the IB's survival' in Sweden
Sponsored Article
Swedish for programmers: 'It changed my life'
Analysis & Opinion
Are we just going to let half the country die?
Angry elk chases Swede up a lamp post
Sponsored Article
Top 7 tips to help you learn Swedish
The Local Voices
'Alienation in Sweden feels better: I find myself a stranger among scores of aliens'
Sponsored Article
‘Extremism can't be defeated on the battlefield alone’
People-watching: October 20th
The Local Voices
A layover at Qatar airport brought this Swedish-Kenyan couple together - now they're heading for marriage
Sponsored Article
Stockholm: creating solutions to global challenges
Swede punches clown that scared his grandmother
Sponsored Article
Why you should 'grab a chair' on Stockholm's tech scene
Fans throw flares and enter pitch in Swedish football riot
Sponsored Article
Where is the Swedish music industry heading?
Could Swedish blood test solve 'Making a Murderer'?
Sponsored Article
One expat's strategy for making friends in Stockholm
Swedish school to build gender neutral changing room
Sponsored Article
Nordic fashion in focus at Stockholm University
People-watching: October 14th-16th
Man in Sweden assaulted by clowns with broken bottle
Nobel Prize 2016: Literature
Watch the man who discovered Bob Dylan react to his Nobel Prize win
Record numbers emigrating from Sweden
People-watching: October 12th
The Local Voices
'Swedish startups should embrace newcomers' talents - there's nothing to fear'
How far right are the Sweden Democrats?
Property of the week: Triangeln, Malmö
The Local Voices
Syria's White Helmets: The Nobel Peace Prize would have meant a lot, but pulling a child from rubble is the greatest reward
jobs available