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Think tank: cut wages to boost immigrant jobs

TT/The Local/pvs · 30 May 2011, 10:48

Published: 30 May 2011 10:48 GMT+02:00

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Swedes born overseas are often in work, but not as often as Sweden-born citizens and Timbro has argued in a new report that high wages for jobs requiring little or no formal qualifications are a problem.

"More would have found work if there were jobs with lower wages than there are today," said Jenny von Bahr at WSP Analys & Strategi, the firm commissioned to compile the report.

According to von Bahr the reasoning has its basis in elementary economic theory - cut the price of something then you increase demand.

"The government has ignored this. They have had a one-sided focus on various reception measures," she said, referring to assistance offered to the jobless in the form of training and education in order to break into the labour market.

When asked if a person should be able to survive on their salary, she replied:

"You have to have your first job at some point. Integration increases if you get a job, even if your first is not really well paid," von Bahr said.

Lasse Thörn at the Swedish Trade Union Confederation (Landsorganisationen – LO) did not agree with Timbro's analysis.

"Lower incomes cut purchasing power. If employers have goods to produce they can manage it with the base level salaries that are in place today."

The government has proposed a number of other measures to help more immigrants find work and to improve their integration into Swedish society.

"The discrepancies in the employment level between foreign born and those born in Sweden went up to 11 percent in March 2011," wrote migration minister Tobias Billström, integration minister Erik Ullenhag and labour market minister Hillevi Engström in an opinion article published on Monday in the Sydsvenska Dagbladet newspaper.

"That difference is unacceptable."

Story continues below…

In the article, the ministers outline a number of initiatives to improve employment prospects for immigrants, including improved Swedish language training, tax breaks for low-income workers, as well as taking a closer look at how Sweden's welfare system is shaped.

On Monday, the three ministers are participating in a full-day seminar to discuss employment among overseas-born Swedes.

TT/The Local/pvs (news@thelocal.se)

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Your comments about this article

11:22 May 30, 2011 by crofab
I think we should cut wages for free market think tanks first. Imagine how much resources this will free up for the rest of the economy!
11:24 May 30, 2011 by truthworthy
Why not, i think it is good idea. it is better than having no job.
11:51 May 30, 2011 by bolababu
Indeed! ..the real problem should be addressed, not this crap about reducing wages. Sweden should address its racism towards immigrants. The new method for oppressing immigrants is waking up to finding yourself in Kronofogden, i read about this here on the local sometime ago and didn't believe it until it happened to me. Parking ticket, no reminders, just kronofogden and even when the debt is paid, you are black-spotted for a further 3 years. All hail sweden!
11:52 May 30, 2011 by TwoToTango
Yes! Brilliant!

1. Import buttload of immigrants

2. Lower the working classes wages

3. ?????

4. Profit!

No way this could go wrong in any way. I particularly like how no group of people could ever be blamed for the lower standard of living of a chunk of Sweden's population. Tomorrow will be a more tolerant world.
11:54 May 30, 2011 by johnny1939
@crofab I agree w/ you.

...lowering wages is not the answer. There are jobs that need to be done and are not like cleaning parks and streets & "scenic places". Not wonderful jobs but a place to start. My first job abroad was as a clerk in an insurance company and not well paid at all but I made do talking about depressing I would have much rather been gardening. At that time insurance company work was as low as you could get money wise

Perhaps we should limit immigration too so all that come will be able to get a job.
11:55 May 30, 2011 by unseen
its better than black labour markets anyways.
11:58 May 30, 2011 by the_partisan
Or maybe actually create a real incentive for people to get education and work instead of sitting home and collecting welfare checks.
12:17 May 30, 2011 by glamelixir
Seriously??? seriously????

In Argentina, construction workers are forced to get any salary they are offered just people from Bolivians will go to the country and offer to do the same thing for half the price. Soon after, all salaries are reduced just because. This neo liberal politics have already failed worldwide. Why is Sweden always one step behind in this matters?

Look at Brazil! Look at how they have grown. Brazilian law asks to hire three Brazilian per every foreigner to new companies opening in the country, to avoid unemployment among the locals while still boosting investment in their lands.

I am not saying that is what Sweden should do, the problem here is quite the opposite (for those who read fast, fight and missinterpret), what I am stating is that Sweden shoud search for new original policies of integration not for bergain salaries for foreigners.

This man's decision will only generate more hate among immigrant/native groups as natives will feel that literally immigrants have come here "to take away their jobs by taking less". Besides, in the long run, that only loweres the standard of living for the entire country. But maybe that is exactly what big corporations are looking for...
12:25 May 30, 2011 by RationalG.
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
12:41 May 30, 2011 by occassional

Typical quango head-up-the-jacksie thinking.

First allow all and sundry in, then make sure that the standards are lowered to accommodate them. It beggars belief.

Is there no end to this suicidal train of thought ?
12:41 May 30, 2011 by Grindsprint
This conclusion, although corect, is forbidden in socialist sweden. Allowing flexible wages in all parts of the labor market would work wonders
13:12 May 30, 2011 by djmarko
there are several job openings in Sweden, at least in the local job adverts, there seems to be loads of jobs, if you check jobserve and linkedin, there are still vacancies, why cant they be filled?? lack of skilled workers?? is the recruitment policy hindering firms hiring qualified people, do people only get jobs through networking rather than facing a grilling interview process? it seems once you are in the system, it is far easier to change jobs as opposed to not having any experience in the Sweden job market, the UK has learnt from this in the late 80s, hire the best talent irrespective of race, creed and you will see results, lowering wages is definitely not the solution, in fact that is the most stupid solution ever given!!!
13:23 May 30, 2011 by karex

The law in Brazil was created to solve the opposite problem: most Brazilians seem to think that only imported labor is good quality - that local talent is somehow inferior. So, a foreigner will always be the first choice for any vacancy just because they are not local. It's a cultural defficiency. When Brazilians move overseas then they can see that contrary to popular belief, in many sectors Brazilian talent is far superior. Plastic surgery, for instance.
13:39 May 30, 2011 by Swedesmith
Stink tank.
13:53 May 30, 2011 by Grokh
thats retarded lol and this kind of thing proves that imigrants are not welcome because people will get pissed their salaries are getting cut all thanks to some morons that cant even speak the language.

this kind of line of thought is worthy of some idiot that would sell his mother for profit.
14:05 May 30, 2011 by eddie123
this is the stupidest comment and suggestion that i have read all year - and i read a lot. lower wages indeed. such nonsense. the problem is not with the wages. sweden doesn't pay better than her neighbors. we don't even have a minimum wage here and people get screwed all the time. companies make massive profits all the time and they can afford to pay better wages and still hire additional hands. it is irresponsible and misleading to argue for lower wages in an expensive society like sweden. just imagine the costs on housing, transport and food. how can timbro argue for lower wages. it's just pathetic.
14:10 May 30, 2011 by Great Scott
Timbro is a joke, it is pampered by Sweden's current government. Both have their hands in each other's pockets, so this twaddle is worth nothing. Their idea is to cut wages of the lower paid if I read this right, surly they mean the higher paid.

Timbro gets 25,000,000 SEK per year and consists of 21 people, so that lot are on at least 1,000,000 SEK a year each. May be they should look to see how over paid they are.
14:26 May 30, 2011 by farnoxo
Well clearly the majority of people posting here have a very limited grasp of basic economics (but well developed sense of xenophobia). Labour market flexibility at the lower end of the pay scale does generally lead to higher employment for lower skilled workers (with the downside of less job security).

What I cannot understand why the issue is sold as a solution for immigrants, I mean getting more low-skilled people into work will also help 90% of supporters of Sverigedemokraterna ... oops...maybe not, I don't think their supporters actually want to work :-(
15:12 May 30, 2011 by Marc the Texan
I am very market oriented in my thinking and that is why I do NOT want Sweden to cut wages for low skilled jobs. This will only encourage more third world immigration to Sweden. More Swedes will be forced onto the dole since they are not ready to accept the same living standards as someone who has been living without electricity or plumbing. And why should they have to? More government assistance will be needed to subsidize low wage earners. This is simply shifting the financial burdens of private enterprise onto the state. It would be fine if Sweden was closed to immigration because there would not be an open-ended and insatiable labor pool. Competing with workers who are satisfied with lower living standards will only serve to drive your living standards down. Note to Sweden, the world can produce exponentially more would-be poor immigrants than Sweden could ever hope to absorb. The problem with some of the more market-oriented solutions is that on net, what is best for the global economy may not always be best for a national or local economy or more specifically, the people of Sweden.
15:25 May 30, 2011 by star10
This is not a think-tank. It is a dumb-tank.
15:26 May 30, 2011 by Beavis
Make Sweden follow EU hiring law, end of problem.
15:33 May 30, 2011 by skatty
There are some problems with this suggestion. I suppose this suggestion can be translate to this:

"A Swede-born overseas, who has already been considered as an underclass, unqualified and unskilled person, suppose to start a low paid job as the first job (start point) to be economically developed (which may not be happened!), to be integrated in Sweden, no matter if he/she can survive on the low wage or not! "

The elementary economic theory says that there should be a demand in the first hand, and actually there is not such a demand to force thousands of people to become cleaner and car washers.

The traditional jobs, which usually immigrants worked in Sweden, have been reduced for some reasons; and the kind of immigrants, who have been entered in Sweden as refugees are not the same working class of the 60s and 70s. In one hand, the traditional jobs of manufacturing have moved to Asia and east Europe, the low level unskilled jobs are mostly automated and need fewer work forces; and in the other hand, the refugees, who have come to Sweden since 80s are very mixed of working and middle class background, some have even much higher education than Swedes.

You want to solve the problem; I suggest entering more Swedes to low level jobs and giving higher job position to immigrants. There are many immigrants with very high university education from Sweden, who survive with low level jobs like taxi driving; and in the other hand there are Swedes with low education, who serve in high positions, take for grant some of the Swedish politicians!
15:42 May 30, 2011 by zircon
Collecting welfare checks- the voice of reason in what they call welfare economies? (Maslov's economies built in echelons of welfare?)
17:15 May 30, 2011 by jomamas
1) bring in immigrants

2) lower wages and living standards

Go to hell you communist freaks!


GET RID OF THE IMMIGRANTS - if anything - foreign direct investments in their own countries to help them along.
18:25 May 30, 2011 by swedejane
@crofab +1. You nailed it.

This is nothing more than a race to the bottom. It's shocking to me that a so-called "free market think tank" would seriously suggest this. Seriously, this is something a child would think up. If immigrant unemployment is that much of a problem, then they should perhaps re-evaluate their immigration policies and begin limiting immigration so that the labor market has time to absorb new workers. Lower wages is definitely not the answer.
19:58 May 30, 2011 by planet.sweden
"According to von Bahr the reasoning has its basis in elementary economic theory - cut the price of something then you increase demand"

God help us, she really means it.

It's known as the race to the bottom luvvie, and its a zero sum game.

These Timbro types need to get their noses out of their text books and get some experience of the real world before they come out with these tried and failed policies. Bunch of rosy cheeked right wing kids with no clue at all.
21:54 May 30, 2011 by soultraveler3
Why not change the laws / attitude so that the skilled immigrant workers already here can actually work in their profession instead?

Let the many Swedes that choose not to attend uni take the lower skilled, lower paying jobs like people have to everywhere else in the world. That would at least be a start.

Lowering wages is just bad news all around. There already is a big social gap between native and foreign born Swedes. Lowering the pay will make that worse and I doubt that it will result in many more jobs. Why hire more people, even at a lower rate, when you can keep them as praktik workers almost indefinitely?
06:51 May 31, 2011 by calebian22
What is the definition of skilled labor? As some of the posters have mentioned, in some countries this is already a problem for other reasons. Look at the carpentry trade in some states in the US with high illegal populations. Wages have been severely reduced in the last 15 years, because illegals have a nail gun placed in their hands by a greedy contractor. They know nothing about building regulations, but they can fake it. (New built houses are very hit or miss in the US) Then many wonder, why it is difficult to hire a high quality building contractor.

The Swedish government is going to choose which jobs are low skilled? No matter which side of the spectrum you are on, do you really trust your government that much? Or is it okay as long as it doesn't affect you?
08:57 May 31, 2011 by skatty

Actually, a good question. High or low skill in theory depends to the education and job skill both in blue and white collar jobs, but in reality different countries have their own classifications of skilled and unskilled labour, depends to their own political and economical needs. As an example, an educated high skilled refugee (like a teacher, an accountant …) can be simply classified as unskilled worker for political and economical reasons. The skill of a teacher in his/her own country is useless in Sweden.

There are some differences between US and Sweden in this matter. The Swedish labour market traditionally didn't accept immigrants for white collar jobs, most of immigrants have been blue collar factory workers or low skilled workers after WWII, and white collar jobs have been for Swedes, even though some few immigrants could enter to this category. At present, Sweden give white collar jobs just in the sections, which might be a need for immigrants like medicine and some University research jobs because the global structure of market has been changed since 30 years ago, but generally the interest is mostly to keep completion in blue collar and low level jobs and not higher lever.

This is in contrast with US labour market, which its interest is to bring competition in all level of market blue and white collars jobs and businesses. So, an educated immigrant or refugee has more chance to get a better position, if he/she works hard to the top. This can never happen in Sweden, no matter how hard the immigrant works, there is a protection to keep Swedes in the white collar positions, and it's the reason that so many high educated immigrants from Sweden drive taxi! The best example is the Swedish government itself, where thousands of its employees are white old Swedes, but in US or Canada there is such a huge mix of immigrants in government in all level.
10:12 May 31, 2011 by technoviking
The true goal of "multiculturalism" isn't to just bring the third world to Europe.

It's to make Europe into the third world.

We can all live in hell together!

Instead of cutting wages how about cutting immigration instead. There's a thought.
12:08 May 31, 2011 by Keith #5083
Is it just remotely possible that this apparent absurd suggestion is simply a way to discourage more immigration? If so, then a similar attitude needs to be adopted to welfare benefits. Lowering wages will simply mean that more people won't bother seeking work but will just rely on benefits - which in this enlightened society will continue to be paid to support the family/children of 'non-income' groups.

Integration is perfectly achievable, and is being achieved, in relation to benefit payments.

Additionally, more 'policing' needs to be done to eliminate welfare fraud. I get so amazed to see a continuous trend to draw benefits and work 'black', even boasting about it! This is the reality of the supply/demand equation.

Lower the benefits after an initial period and - miracle - more people will be in work.
14:07 May 31, 2011 by jacquelinee
hmmmmmmmm? Lets see..... get educated, get integrated get job at decent salary ( seems likely for some motivation there )


Now that is a MUCH better incentive to get someone to look for work. Lets give them less than they would get on welfare, there's the ticket to get more people working! We are IMMIGRANTS...not stupid! And what about the SWEDES in low paying jobs? But on the plus side, the money that will be saved can be re-alloted in the form of education for the "Think Tank" group .PEOPLE WANT TO WORK FOR A SALARY THEY ARE ABLE TO LIVE ON! HELLO! Who are the stupid group in actuality. Why did they call this bunch a "THINK group"? Intellignt thought pattern is SO oblviously NOT a requirement for this group. But, in true Swedish form, lets up their budget and create more "THINK TANKS" I am sure the earners of low wages will have no problem taken a wage cut to pay for brainstorming for the brainless.
14:13 May 31, 2011 by DavidtheNorseman
@farnoxo - you said, "Labour market flexibility at the lower end of the pay scale does generally lead to higher employment for lower skilled workers"

This is true as far as it goes (if you mean employment rates - the idea is to stick the unskilled in an underclass forever so the bottom-dwellers and their descendants will always be bottom-dwellers), but recall that slavery also leads to total employment (and concommitant abuse).

What its real goal is is massive profit margins for the over-class and the elimination of collective bargaining/protections for the majority of society.

It is a demand for an increased share of the rents for the privileged class. It always fails to take into account the social de-stabilization and violence that accompanies such (thinking of the many Spartan and Roman slave revolts)......
15:41 May 31, 2011 by soultraveler3
Skatty in comment 30 is spot on.

Sweden makes it so difficult to skilled people to work here. In my small SFI class of about 40 people, we had two engineers, a chemistry teacher, a doctor and me (pharmacy.) Those are just the ones I know of. None of us are working in those fields because we can't without going back to school for multiple years.

I've been working in pharmacy for 10 years and have had a very successful språkpraktik in a pharmacy here (the manager said she'd hire me right away if she could.) I was told that in order to work here I'd need to go back to uni for almost 2 years. The job is the exact same here minus screwing around with insurance and preparing prescriptions! There's no qualification / licensing test available like there is in most other countries. On top of that I'd earn about half of what I was making before.

I talk with my old SFI classmates when I see them and have heard pretty much the same story across the board. I just don't get it.
19:30 May 31, 2011 by donfabricio
Why does Sweden makes it hard to professionals coming from developing countries to work here? Well the answer is pretty simple, because they want little brown nose people telling them what to do at work because these folks are often more qualified than some of their senior managers.

I had an eye surgery today, and guest who was my surgeon? Yep you guessed it, it was fellow from Iran.

Same story from my SFI class too, engineers, pharmacists, and even Doctors. The technique they often use to turn foreigners away from jobs is "you don't speak the language" then you like oh okay I'm going to learn the language that's easy, then you come back few months later, and they find another excuse, they always keeping moving the bar, from one excuse to the other it goes on and on.

My advice to folks here is start your own business, I don't think these folks are ready. The impression I've got from this country is they will tolerate foreigners, but they will never accept them as equal, ever. You see that in their demeanor when a brown nose drives by with a nice car or ends up dinning in one of their posh restaurants, the look in their faces is almost like "are you lost"? I often see women holding on tight to their purses when I walk in a bar or a restaurant, freaking unbelievable. Oh and I'm always the last person they seat next to either on the tube or on the bus, that is once there's no longer any available seats, lol.
19:42 May 31, 2011 by infidel2012
For a country that gives out Nobel Peace Prizes? Swedes really are stupid...

Think Tank?

Allowing mass immigration of muslim terrorists posing as asylum seekers? Hello!

Good Job... Not : (
08:30 June 1, 2011 by Keith #5083

People with good suntans don't seem to have those problems in my area. Maybe in a large Metropolis you have Osama to thank for some 'negativity'.

But then what you describe is a universal problem. I do know how you feel, as a whitey I experienced pretty much the same in Dubai and Oman. I think it's all something to do with 'herd/peer group menatality', isn't it?
13:33 June 1, 2011 by Uncle

"Well clearly the majority of people posting here have a very limited grasp of basic economics (but well developed sense of xenophobia)"

Well, as a specialist in liberal thinking and economics, could you please be so kind as to explain to the right wing pig raiser, such as I am, how is such a giant of economics planning to handle the following situation?

Reducing wages should theoretically create an economic vacuum that shall be filled with oh, so eager to work children of Mohammed (that could not find the time to educate themselves for some reason).

However, such a vacuum is indeed created only if the unemployment benefits are dropping also. Otherwise it would be still beneficial to sit at home and plan the next daughter circumcision or suicide bombing, instead of cleaning poo from the canalisation system, right?

But that means that the beloved by socialists sick, stressed and just "between the jobs" people shall get less money just because Ahmeds and Jihads would like to do something, but cannot make a calculation of 2 plus 2.... How does this situation is reconciled in the mind of such a capable economic theoretician?

In addition, could Nobel prize in economics candidate please explain to an idiot, why the current "high entrance" level to the job market does not create a will to get an education among the incoming immigrants (given that it is free of charge), but rather creates frustration and excessive moaning about the racist swedes that do not hire them? Mmm? Why economical theories do not work in this case?
21:43 June 1, 2011 by jacquelinee
@Uncle I would like to educate you a bit. I know that is hard is Sweden, as everyone has a "betyg" that looks very good on the surface, but very little depth of actual educational content is involved in the curriculem. (but that is an entirely seperate issue) In response to your statement concerning the children of Mohammed that could not find the time to educate themselves - Here is a list of the 20 Greatest Innovations by Muslims as well as a few of the many great 20th century Muslim scolars and scientists.....1) Coffee 2)Pin-Hole Camera 3)Chess 4)Parachute 5)Shampoo 6)Distillation 7)The Crank Shaft8) Metal Armor 9)The Architectural Pointed Arch 10)Surgery 11)Windmill 12)Vaccination 13)Fountain Pen14) Numerical Numbering 15)Soup 16)Carpets 17)Pay Cheques 18)Earth is in sphere shape 20)Gardens 1988 - Naguib Mahfouz-The Nobel Prize in Literature 2000 - 2007 [chemistry, geometry, literature] In electrochemistry, Iranian scientist Ali Eftekhari electrochemistry, electrochemical reactions 2002 - 2007 [science and politics] Abdul Kalam India-notable scientist and engineer, 2005 [computer science] Jawed Karim invented the web browser-embedded video player and co-founded YouTube OH! And by the way, I am a Christian Caucasion Canadian of Scottish, Bristish and French descent. Next time you get pain, get a flu shot, plant your garden, need an operation or have your morning coffee, you can thank the Muslims you low minded bigot.
00:36 June 2, 2011 by Uncle
Haha... jacquelinee.. the discussion here is about uneducated immigrants. And guess what? Under "immigrants" nobody talks about german and finnish ones.

As for the inventions.

Coffee-invented in Ethiopia. The idea started to get cultivated by the muslim invaders.

Chess-invented in India. Original name -Shatranj.

Parachute was invented in Italy, the first design is displayed in the British Museum. First person to implement was Veranzio who jumped from the tower of Venice 1617.

The word shampoo is derived from Hindi chāmpo which means "Head Massage".

The first clear evidence of distillation comes from Greek alchemists working in Alexandria in the first century AD.

A Roman iron crankshaft dating to the 2nd century AD was excavated in Augusta Raurica, Switzerland

Metal armour (idiotic definition of a range of items)... First iron armor was found in Greece. Iron plates were used by Ming dynasty in China. Chainmail was invented by the Gauls.

Pointed arch (or Ogive) was invented in pre-Islamic Near east. Nothing to do with muslims who just continued to build the same buildings.

Surgery - Greek "hand work". A first trepanation was found on a skull from neolitic times. First tooth surgeries were found in skulls from India (3300 BC) and Egypt (2650 BC) long before Islam.

The windwheel of the Greek engineer Heron of Alexandria in the 1st century AD is the earliest known instance of using a wind-driven wheel to power a machine

The earliest documented examples of vaccination are from India and China in the 17th century.

Fountain Pen - correct. Muslims.

Numbers as we know them - arabic. As for the Numbers invention - The first known system with place value was the Mesopotamian base 60 system (ca. 3400 BC).

Evidence of the existence of soup can be found as far back as about 6,000 BC

The hand-knotted pile carpet probably originated in southern Central Asia between the 3rd and 2nd millennium BCE. No Islam involved.

Cheques first used by Romans 1 century BC and Indians 321 to 185 BC. First cheques appeared in NON-ISLAMIC Persia in the 3rd century.

Early Greek philosophers alluded to a spherical Earth, though with some ambiguity. Pythagoras (6th century BC) was among those said to have originated the idea.

There are 9 muslim Nobel Prize winners, whereas 5 out of them were Peace prize winners (given to people who agree to stop killing people). 2 were in Literature and one was persecuted for their work in home country (Turkey) whereas other sustained assassination by muslim extremists. Only 2 (out of 1,2 to 1,5 BILLION) got a scientific prize.

Next time you go to a muslim blog, at least confirm that it is not lying. Thanks for the "education".
00:47 June 2, 2011 by jacquelinee
It takes a lot to get a Swede motivated and actually do some work and research something....glad I could be of help. Let me know if you need some incentive

in the future ;-)
00:54 June 2, 2011 by ludfan
Immigration is never the problem... Immigrants move to 1st world countries to better themselves and their life and provide better opportunities for their children. When hiring, put some blinders on and ignore name, gender and race, review CVs for the best, qualified candidate for the job, pay them the market rate, and let competition motivate the lazy ones (immigrant or otherwise) into improving their education and skill set. While you are at it, limit welfare/unemployment benefits to a finite period of time (let's say 12 months for example), after which you have to EARN your living... there's a thought, EARN your living.

I am one of those very productive IMMIGRANTS in the US, self made, self supported, paid for my own college, and am very well paid for my skills. I have never collected a dollar from the government in welfare / unemployment.... AND I started with a low paying job (minimum wage which was $4 / hour then) while attending school, english was my third langugage.

Laslty, my mom's extended side of the family (more than 100 members) all immigrated to Sweden, all are working hard, paying taxes and are very productive IMMIGRANTS in Stockholm. My uncle lost his legs in a war before he immigrated to stockholm, yet he didn't sit on his ass waiting for government pity, he has a full time job in a hospital repairing wheelchairs and has raised a family, bought a house, and pays taxes like everyone else. Stop being "un-human", we are all created equal!
01:04 June 2, 2011 by jacquelinee

Well said. A brain at last!
13:15 June 2, 2011 by skatty
By reading the recent comments, I should say there is one general misunderstanding about the nature of immigration to Sweden between many Swedes and some immigrants.

Because the kind immigrants, who have immigrated to Sweden from working class has been shifted to refugees, in the last 3 decades, many Swedes conclude that generally immigrants are people, who are living in Sweden for welfare, and of course the political system let populations continue to think in this way, because there is a political benefit in it.

Refugees, who move in Sweden and would be accepted as immigrants should go through a process to be accepted and qualified to the productivity level in from beginning to the end, and mostly do it. They learn Swedish language, they complete their education, some apply for University, some find job as worker (blue collar jobs) and many pay tax. But still there are much more unemployed immigrants than Swedes.

Now, the question is if this unemployment is about the immigrants, who yet have not finished the Swedish process of preparation or about they, who have already finished the process. And this is the TRICKY PART of the media and government. Actually, the unemployment rate is about they, who already passed the process and not they, who are in the process. The people, who are using the welfare in different forms, are fully qualified people according to the Swedish standards with the ability in communication. BUT, government focus on the immigrants, who are in the preparation process with the language problems, BECAUSE GOVERNMENT CAN JUSTIFY A REASON, AND FIND AN ALIBI BY FOCUSING IN PREPARATION PERIOD.

As a matter of fact there is no problem with immigrants in the preparation period, the problem is for they, who have already passed the process and suppose to have a job, but they don't have with all of their qualifications and educations.
14:01 June 2, 2011 by jacquelinee

A valid argument, but I must pose this question as well. Does anyone have the statistics ofhow many Swedish born citizens are on social assistance? I would like a comparative report? I sure know a lot of them myself and in a limtited and small area of the population. I am not defening the "takers" You will find them in any demograpic, muslims, buddists, christians, athiests, Chinese, Mongolians, Austrailians, Indians, North Americans AND Swedes. You have hard working, educated, contributing members of society and you have the abusers who milk the system for all they can get in all races and religious persuasions. SWEDES INCLUDED!!!!

I have a huge problem with ignorance. And any Swede ( or other person) who says all immigrants, muslims, hindi, Iranians, somalians, blacks or other ethnic groups are leeches because of their race, religion or origin are just ignorant. Then I guess it is just the same to say that Sven Svensson is just the as the American Hillbilly (of swedish descent) who appeared on the Jerry Springer show ( I apologise, I could not find the date of the airing) Sven must be sleeping with his girlfriends mom while his "old lady" makes the money. All Swedes are the same right? I personally do want MYSELF (as a white person) judged in the same group with that idiot on Jerry Springer, but that is EXACTLY what many people postings here are saying. And I am NOT saying all pig farmers are ignorant buffoons just because some of them evidentally are.
16:20 June 2, 2011 by skatty

I cannot give you the statistics about the Swedes, but you may find it on "scb.se", or send them an email and ask directly about a comparative report (I myself do it sometime for different reason).

I suppose that I can guess what you mean with ignorance. There are many immigrants, who have huge problems with ignorance in Sweden as well; however, I don't blame Swedes very much for it!

First of all, the problem of ethnics groups is not just a problem of Sweden, many western countries have the same problem less or more; however, it appears in different ways, in different countries. The Swedish one is one of the oddest one, because of its background. We are talking about a homogenous country, which its main immigrants were working class, mainly from Europe; a country without a colonial experience (like main Europeans country, no direct cultural connection with ethnics), with a population filled with ecstasy of being the best in the world! From the cultural point of view it's one of the hardest countries to be adapted for an outsider, depends to the outside's background. Farther countries have harder, and darker skins have harder, more differences with Swedes make it harder to live in Sweden. The labour market is not a dynamic one, which is prepared for immigrants with different background, the language is practically useless anywhere else, the system remarkably discriminate between insider and outsider, the economy extremely depends to export and sustain a loss by global changes. Swedes are proud of their welfare system and even though it has been reduced for years, but they still are proud of it, and use it as a baton on the head of anyone, who doesn't feel comfortable with the Swedish principals.

May be this document help to compare Sweden with Canada, if you are interested to read it:

17:03 June 2, 2011 by Uncle
@ jacquelinee

at least you have enough dignity not to argue your statements above and continue as nothing happened. Good.

Secondly, saying that there are immigrants who work hard and pay taxes is not a valid argument, although it is true. The article at hand is trying to present a problem that exists among immigrants and it is higher statistical unemployment compared to the rest of the country's society. There IS a problem there. Period.

My view of the solution is not make the low paid jobs even lower paid and creating huge inequalities between immigrants and those who got the job "fair and square" although doing the same job. This in effect will automatically lower unemployment benefits since we need "encourage" people to start working and not only "encourage" employees to start hiring.

All that is needed is lower employee taxes on the employers. Like this - the salaries are still reasonable and higher than benefits and at the same time, the employers are encouraged to hire immigrants/students and all those who just did not think to study when they were 17. Simple and effective.
23:49 June 2, 2011 by jimmy1988
The Big problem of Sweden is: The government should focus more on Swedes at least motivated them to have more kids, if this happens there is no need immigrants, the government focus more on immigrants and the reality is: Many immigrants in Sweden leave at Welfare System. Example: Why a muslim come to Sweden instead of Saudi Arabia or Dubai that are rich countries? Because in Sweden they have welfare plus free pass to criminality, in Muslim Countries they are not allowed to do most things they do in Sweden.
22:07 June 3, 2011 by jayseah32
Just put all nations on notice..."no more immigration into Sweden until further notice, illegals to be deported immediately." Resolve issues, then reinstate immigration if it is found to be absolutely necessary.
01:10 June 5, 2011 by Gabriel Grubb
In other words let in more and more cheap workers to work for less and less to make the rich even richer! To make MORE swedes unemployed! What on earth are NEW Swedes! More Muslims fostered on us against our will to make Sweden and the rest of Europe an islamic state within 30 years? The liberals are like Lemmings revelling in their own demise!
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