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The Referendum - Vote to Leave the EU!

Footballers & Ex Pats - what happens next

LLHope
post 23.Jun.2016, 09:38 AM
Post #16
Location: Stockholm
Joined: 1.Jan.2014

QUOTE (Kari @ 23.Jun.2016, 01:53 AM) *
Then there is this article about a Swedish baker in London. He tried to import something from Norway. Norway is a non-EU country but with a treaty with EU. But there were so m ... (show full quote)
And this is why UK (and others) should vote LEAVE. The EU Single market is protectionist, it is not about free trade. Prices to consumers are higher than they should be. Food is the classic example, the EU artificially inflates the price of food in order to support inefficient farming mainly in France and Italy (food is around 20% higher price than it should be). Other examples of the protectionism is clothes, shoes which also are around 14-20% more expensive than they should be. EU Consumers are being drained of disposable income to fund stupidity and ridiculous bureaucracy.

...when you look closer and behind the recent regulations that are promoted under the guise of environmental moves (i.e. Vacuum cleaner power consumption, coming soon Toasters and Kettles, and after that halogen lamps will be outlawed) you will find that it isn't the "green" groups pushing for the regulation changes, but actually significant number of German manufacturers. The requirements are always just at the level of current german manufacturer product specifications in terms of power consumption etc wink.gif and the aim is to give advantage to them whilst making it harder for other EU manufacturers and also importers from outside of EU to catch-up ...when they do, regulation changes to the next "green" measure.

...and I am completely surprised how there is absolute silence from the current Swedish government with regards the TTIP discussions that are on-going with the USA ...Sweden tries to be very protective of it's state owned businesses/services, they appear to not realise nor care that they will be attacked and dismantled if the agreement goes through!
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Kari
post 23.Jun.2016, 12:19 PM
Post #17
Location: Sweden
Joined: 16.Jun.2016

QUOTE (LLHope @ 23.Jun.2016, 10:38 AM) *
And this is why UK (and others) should vote LEAVE. The EU Single market is protectionist, it is not about free trade. Prices to consumers are higher than they should be. Food ... (show full quote)


There is free trade between the EU-countries. As far as I know both Sweden and UK are for free trade generally. But if UK leaves...

As for food, it became cheaper in Sweden after we joined EU. Don't know about UK.

TTIP is complicated though I'm wary of Americian lawyers preventing laws for environment and health.

But what will happen to EU-citizens in UK and UK-citizens in EU-countries? Maybe nothing to those already living in UK. But in the future? The Leave-promoters have not given any real information. Maybe they did not find it important. So we just have to wait - for two more years. Will young people in EU wanting to study in UK have to pay high fees (and vice versa)?

Complicated visa regulations, high visa fees and constantly changing rules?

Also, the Leave-campaign is rather xenophobic. I get the impression that many Brits feel "out with the EU-immigrants and never let them in again". Though it seems they are mixing them up with refugees: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/polit...t-a7085396.html
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Model T Ford
post 23.Jun.2016, 03:08 PM
Post #18
Joined: 31.May.2013

The referendum will result in Britain staying in the EU, thanks to the assassination of Remain supporter Jo Cox.
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Kari
post 23.Jun.2016, 03:50 PM
Post #19
Location: Sweden
Joined: 16.Jun.2016

I don't think that would have swayed a Brexit thinker.

But many were undecided. You know what you have but not what you will get. I'm holding my breath for the result.
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Model T Ford
post 24.Jun.2016, 02:38 PM
Post #20
Joined: 31.May.2013

I quite underestimated the stupidity of the UK electorate in the EU referendum.

They have voted for what OurAdolf wants without realizing it.

If the USA does the same, we will be back in the Hobbesian state of nature.
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Kari
post 25.Jun.2016, 08:56 AM
Post #21
Location: Sweden
Joined: 16.Jun.2016

What will happen to the Erasmus programme? Swedish students who are planning to some day study in UK wonder. Will there be high costs and therefore only possible for the rich? And British students planning to study in EU wonder too.

QUOTE
The opportunities are endless.

But are they now?
QUOTE
It is not clear at this early stage what the impact of the recent UK vote to leave the EU will have on the Erasmus Programme.

http://www.erasmusprogramme.com/
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Hisingen
post 25.Jun.2016, 10:45 AM
Post #22
Joined: 5.Jul.2012

QUOTE (Model T Ford @ 24.Jun.2016, 02:38 PM) *
I quite underestimated the stupidity of the UK electorate in the EU referendum.- - -

I think that, in fact, you under-estimated you own stupidity, and not that of 17.4 million Brits who voted Out and the 16.1 million Brits who voted In. That is a total of some 33 million whose vote was not about Trump.
Were you under the impression that they were thinking about Trump when they voted? If you were, then you grossly under-estimated their purpose.
Whether it was for In or Out, they had little thought for the problems that the US is experiencing or might experience at its own election time.
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LLHope
post 25.Jun.2016, 02:40 PM
Post #23
Location: Stockholm
Joined: 1.Jan.2014

QUOTE (Kari @ 25.Jun.2016, 07:56 AM) *
What will happen to the Erasmus programme? Swedish students who are planning to some day study in UK wonder. Will there be high costs and therefore only possible for the rich? ... (show full quote)
You don't seem to realise that Erasmus+ is also available/open to non-EU citizens. Would be rather odd (and extremely petty) if the they made specific exclusions for the UK!!! biggrin.gif

As for higher education in general (you asked elsewhere in a thread) England introduced fees to citizens and non-citizens back in 1998, it is expensive even for the English to go to university. Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland also have some form of fee. Scotland's is a bit silly where you can have free education depending if you meet their definition of youth (i.e. under 25, no children, not married or in civil partnership etc...) otherwise there are general fees.
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Kari
post 25.Jun.2016, 03:42 PM
Post #24
Location: Sweden
Joined: 16.Jun.2016

Well, nobody seems to know yet, not Erasmus.

In general, education is free in Sweden. There is a fee for non-European students in Sweden. Will British now have to pay this fee? And in other EU-countries as well?

People in Gibraltar voted Remain and are now worried about their future.
QUOTE
Shortly after the referendum result was confirmed, José Manuel García-Margallo, the Spanish foreign minister, told a national radio station: "It's a complete change of outlook that opens up new possibilities on Gibraltar not seen for a very long time. I hope the formula of co-sovereignity - to be clear, the Spanish flag on the Rock - is much closer than before," he said.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/24...fter-brexit-vo/

The Spanish want Gibraltar back but the people of Gibraltar want to stay under British rule. I don't why this rock is so important. Military reasons? Tourist income?
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LLHope
post 25.Jun.2016, 04:23 PM
Post #25
Location: Stockholm
Joined: 1.Jan.2014

QUOTE (Kari @ 25.Jun.2016, 02:42 PM) *
Well, nobody seems to know yet, not Erasmus.
Erasmus+ is for EU and non-EU, even they know that! What they don't know is what the future holds for Erasmus+, simple as that.

QUOTE (Kari @ 25.Jun.2016, 02:42 PM) *
In general, education is free in Sweden. There is a fee for non-European students in Sweden. Will British now have to pay this fee? And in other EU-countries as well?
It is Sweden who decides who pays for and who doesn't pay for education fees in Sweden. Non-EU fees were introduced because the universities and non-EU immigrants were abusing the system when it was free. Universities abused it by signing-up non-EU students who came to Sweden on student permits but never attended the courses (they disappeared either into Sweden or elsewhere within Schengen), at the same time the university got funding for the student without having to invest in additional tutors and/or infrastructure.

It might have escaped your attention that UK is STILL a member of the EU, hasn't yet even given in any notice to quit the EU, and when it does it will continue to be a member until negotiations have ended and the framework agreed. No-one knows when this will happen nor how long it will take, during the time from now until then UK is still part of the EU.

QUOTE (Kari @ 25.Jun.2016, 02:42 PM) *
The Spanish want Gibraltar back but the people of Gibraltar want to stay under British rule. I don't why this rock is so important. Military reasons? Tourist income?
Spain lost Gibraltar several centuries ago, they also lost Mallorca but the Britts gave it back to them some time ago (now they just go there and in drunken stupor trash the place! It is a strategic location, the Straights of Gibraltar is the most transited place in the World not just with regards shipping but also animal migration. Spain should be careful, if they continue to claim Gibraltar and the UK finally agree to hand it over, then the Catalans have a good precedent for claiming back their independence from Spain, which they lost due to the same treaty that gave Britain Gibraltar wink.gif

This is also why it is unlikely that Scotland could become an independent EU Member State, it requires majority vote from existing members. If Scotland tries to break from the UK and go for EU Membership, then Spain is likely to veto it. They cannot give Catalans a precedent showing it is possible to become independent from a union and become a full EU Member.
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Kari
post 26.Jun.2016, 02:00 PM
Post #26
Location: Sweden
Joined: 16.Jun.2016

QUOTE (LLHope @ 25.Jun.2016, 05:23 PM) *
Spain lost Gibraltar several centuries ago, they also lost Mallorca but the Britts gave it back to them some time ago (now they just go there and in drunken stupor trash the p ... (show full quote)


But there is a big difference. UK voted to leave EU but Scotland voted to stay. Scotland is forced to leave EU and the EU fundings. Spain has not voted to leave EU.

What about Northern Ireland? Would NI (or the Catholics) vote to be a part of Eire now? Or will there be a border with customs and border control between Eire and Northern Ireland?
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LLHope
post 26.Jun.2016, 02:18 PM
Post #27
Location: Stockholm
Joined: 1.Jan.2014

QUOTE (Kari @ 26.Jun.2016, 01:00 PM) *
UK voted to leave EU but Scotland voted to stay.
There has not been ANY referendum in Scotland with regards should Scotland Leave or Remain in the EU.

The referendum was should the UK Leave or Remain, the legislation passed through Parliament was clear, as well as in the speeches by Cameron beforehand...It would be a UK referendum and the result is UK. The leader of the SNP asked way before the referendum for a Veto for Scotland if it didn't like the vote biggrin.gif ...but that was refused by the UK Prime Minister.
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Mib
post 26.Jun.2016, 08:21 PM
Post #28
Joined: 7.Jul.2006

Scotland requires Westminster to allow them to hold another referendum. But, the indications are that this would only be considered after the negotiation between the EU and the U.K. has been completed. Then, maybe it would be appropriate.

However, the oil price has collapsed and that means Scotland would need to find the money to go it alone. Also, it needs all members to agree for them to join and Spain is reluctant as it would encourage the Catalans to seek the same. Finally, if I'm correct, all new members are required to join the Euro. So, all in all, I see no reason Scotalnd could join the EU. They ultimately could be on their own and in a far worse position.
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Gjeebes
post 26.Jun.2016, 09:45 PM
Post #29
Joined: 20.Feb.2012

QUOTE (Kari @ 26.Jun.2016, 02:00 PM) *
But there is a big difference. UK voted to leave EU but Scotland voted to stay. Scotland is forced to leave EU and the EU fundings. Spain has not voted to leave EU...

Scotland voted to stay in the UK. And now the "UK" has voted to leave the EU. That's democracy for ya. Quite straightforward really.
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Kari
post 26.Jun.2016, 09:58 PM
Post #30
Location: Sweden
Joined: 16.Jun.2016

But most of the Scots wanted to be in a UK within EU. So it stands to reason that they might want to leave UK now.

People only whine about the EU fee but how much did Scotland receive from EU fonds? Of course they would not be well off as an independant country outside EU. But better off as in independant country within EU.

No nation has left EU before. But an autonomous region: Greenland. It took them three years.
QUOTE
Greenlanders voted 52/48 to leave the EU. There followed a series of difficult and protracted negotiations between the Greenland and Danish governments, and the Danish government and the European Commission, particularly with regard to fisheries
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-35233683

52-48 %, sounds very familiar.
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