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Swedes cite integration issues as a 'problem'

Peter Vinthagen Simpson · 13 Oct 2010, 08:28

Published: 12 Oct 2010 16:05 GMT+02:00
Updated: 13 Oct 2010 08:28 GMT+02:00

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"Xenophobia and democracy issues have come into focus with the Sweden Democrats' (SD) entry into Sweden's Riksdag," wrote Camilla Modéer, secretary-general of Public & Science (Vetenskap & Allmänhet - VA), with Arne Modig from Novus Opinion, in an opinion article in the Dagens Nyheter daily on Tuesday.

"Some commentators argue that SD's success is a result of journalists and politicians concealing facts and problems with immigration. Others argue that a perceived 'taboo' in the immigration debate is little but a cherished myth."

According to the study highlighted in the article, 73 percent of Swedes see integration and immigration as a problem in the country

Camilla Modéer told The Local on Tuesday that the survey is part of a wider study, with Gothenburg's SOM institute and Novus, looking into the connection between scientific knowledge and views held by the general public.

"We know from the previous studies that many Swedes are in a form of 'knowledge-exclusion', making it harder to make important choices and less able to participate in the public discourse," Modéer said, explaining that VA decided to apply what had been learned on a current topic.

The survey shows that 74 percent of the 1,000 Swedes interviewed believe that experts and scholars hold the necessary knowledge to handle the issues of immigration and integration "in a positive way".

However, four in ten respondents remained skeptical of how accurately the picture presented by experts meshes with reality.

While Modéer argued that a healthy scepticism to what is written in the media and elsewhere is positive, she expressed concern over this result, arguing that knowledge was key to making informed decisions about issues affecting society.

"If you don't know, you become frightened and suspicious. It is important that people are given access to knowledge; they can then think what they like of course, but it is important to have the information."

The subset of respondents who believe that integration and immigration is a large problem were more likely to be suspicious of experts, with 65 percent questioning the accuracy of findings presented by experts.

Among respondents who identified themselves as supporters of the Sweden Democrats, mistrust of experts rose to 90 percent, according to the survey.

The survey confirmed that only 35 percent of respondents felt that they personally possessed sufficient knowledge to address the issues in question, and Modéer is clear where the responsibility lies to address this situation.

"Researchers have to reach out and conduct a dialogue with the general public," she told The Local.

In the article in DN, Modéer and co-author Modig argue that being excluded leaves people less well-equipped to make important choices when participating in society.

And those who are excluded, characterized by low-levels of education and low incomes, have less confidence in researchers and experts and less belief in a knowledge-based society than others.

Story continues below…

“They are less satisfied with their lives and with democracy, and have less faith in other people. Many of them can be found among Sweden Democrat voters,” they write.

They authors point out that while education is an important tool against fighting racism and xenophobia, it shouldn't be viewed as a "vaccine".

In response to a question on whether Sweden is existing in something of an "age of ideological austerity" when it comes to the respect for learning, Modéer told The Local:

"Our fundamental idea is that knowledge is becoming increasingly important to our society - we are becoming more dependent on knowledge and it is crucial that the general public has an influence and can gain access to learning."

The Novus Opinion survey was conducted within the framework of their web panel and is based on interviews with 1,000 Swedes from September 30th-October 5th.

Peter Vinthagen Simpson (news@thelocal.se)

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Your comments about this article

16:51 October 12, 2010 by wiserthanmos
Exactly what is the point of this artical? Does anybody understand what they're tried to say here? It touches absolutely nothing!
17:21 October 12, 2010 by WelshSwede
Well, this is the Joke'l
18:13 October 12, 2010 by LuxVeritas
One must say what one feels regardles of the lack of any point, opinon or subtext to this article.

The academic prostituting elite have a lot to answer for.

After studying the works of the likes of Nikola Tesla, Edgar Cayce, Nassim Haramein, Bruce Lipton, Noam Chompsky, Ian Lundgold, Drunvalo Melchizedeck, Max Planck, Albert Einstein, solve conference on physics conclusions (quotes, discoveries and conclusions not divulged or commonly taught), Dr. Claude Swanson, Dr. William Tiller, professor Hans Eysensck who insinuated in letters that there was a conspiracy in 30 of the top universities around the world and hundreds of top scientists.

Given the scope of discoveries, scientifically quantifiable and the types of academics taken on board by the state, elite private interests in university curricular; I see absolutely no reason to trust any state or mass, media or corporate sponsored scientist to bring knowledge to the masses. The evidence to the contrary is astounding, Flue, climate, pollution, to name but a few and the holy grail of the HIV/ AIDS conspiracy which has netted scientists and commercial pharmaceutical foundations billions.

There is infinitely more to say on this subject, sufficed to say trusting one source of information without personal investigation is put your judgment and reasoning at great peril. What am I being told (or not really)? Who is telling me (what associations or group think)? What purpose could it serve (or whom)?

There is a very good reason why the trividium and quadrivium forms of education were removed since the fifties. Don't believe me, I'm not an academic, not a solitary degree to my name, inform (to form within, knowledge and not fallacious forming) yourself.

A person may be dumfounded by the verbosity of Frankenstein academics without integrity, but we are all; with time and patience, able to learn to see between the lines of deception. To allow oneself to be tricked into the despise, trust or distrust of any fellow human for any reason; be it sex, colour, faith or race is amongst the most unintelligent things a human being can do. The state should be our servant, not our oppressive corrupt and thieving oligarchs of elite interest.

Think free, be free, non-conformity to that which we know to be unjust. Democracy of the elite, by the elite for the elite, no occupations, no torture, no plundering, no false flags, no bombing of innocents = no people displaced to foreign countries when they could live in their own, no integration if such issues exist or are perceptions of the weak minded. -You are different from me and my kind brother, you have integration problems, if you do not do as I expect -?? Time to get a real insight into what is acceptable and what is not, what is the idealised concept of what integration entails?
18:14 October 12, 2010 by cowboykodp
@Dumberthana jackass

It means people like you and SD use stats to exaggerate and lie about their claims, while most Swedes don't give a crap and do not really care to really find out the truth. So SD wins when people stay uninformed.

Knowledge is power. You and your buddies should try it.
19:42 October 12, 2010 by rabbemos
Its important to understand why Sweden accepts so many refugees in the first place. It has too because it exports so much armaments and that is the trade off the international community expects of Sweden.

Sweden will only become equitable for immigrants when legislation is passes that forces integration via affirmative action and the busing and integration of students in schools to create true diversity in them.
20:18 October 12, 2010 by coswede
maybe just maybe no immigrants want to be a swede
21:37 October 12, 2010 by vladd777
I think the real problem lies in the fact that Sweden follows the western culture ( except maybe for Lars O and his V partiet ) and the mainstream of immigrants and asylum seekers flowing into the country hate the western culture but are 'secretly' envious of it because it is liberating. Young people especially fit into this mold and they are frustrated because culteral and family mores and norms, under the guise of 'religion' prevent them from integrating completely.

Until families as a whole decide to not be ruled by these mores and norms and accept what they cannot change, the problem will never be solved.
21:40 October 12, 2010 by tgolan
Swedes cite integration issues as a 'problem' so what it doen't mean that they agree with the SD parity but that they would like the major partys to deal with the issue and that it should be discussed not as today a tabu subject
22:02 October 12, 2010 by Syftfel
This is supposed to be news? What took you so long. I knew this 20 years ago. Obviously the social dems did not.
22:21 October 12, 2010 by bramblebush
Something doesn't look right in that phot above. Are those Nuns or penguins? Whatever they are, I'm sure they don't drink beer, eat pork and aren't indigenous....
22:25 October 12, 2010 by asian123
something wrong with the photo above. is it in sweden or afghanistan.
23:04 October 12, 2010 by ww77ww
@asian - it is Swedrabia

Regarding the story - the people have every right to be skeptical of "authorities" and "experts" along with bleedingheart farleftist dreck like cowboy. Such forces have created the disastrous demographics we have today, which will create a nightmare in the future.

Sweden accepting too many immigrants has nothing to do with arms trade - it is about political correctness and the hilarious sham of "white mans guilt" where people of European heritage are brainwashed into feeling shame and wishing to commit suicide to try to save others who are openly hostile to the stupid host.
23:36 October 12, 2010 by wxman
Lots of comments here on both sides of this issue, as is to be expected in an environment of free exchange of ideas and opinions. Of course, as with all things, only time will tell waht the outcome is. Depending on that outcome, it will be interesting to see whether those freedoms prevail or not.
00:34 October 13, 2010 by wiserthanmos
it's funny isn't it? The Swedes are suppose to be the smart and educated ones and yet, they're willingly turn themselves into the slaves for the people that are so backwards, uneducated and lightyears behind them in any which way. It's like the Aliens came to earth and willingly become slaves for the humans. It's so painful to watch you my very dear swedes. How are you goin to look at your children in the eyes and tell them that they don't have a country anymore, 10, 20. 30 years from now?
01:18 October 13, 2010 by Roy E
It is rather curious that such an allegedly intelligently people are engaged in such a monumentally stupid practice.

It's a fine example of what Malcom Muggeridge meant when he observed that modern man has 'educated himself into imbecility'. It's very, very true.
01:21 October 13, 2010 by Swedesmith
@ cowboy #6

A one eyed dwarf with a prosthetic leg and a bad case of hemorrhoids? Just a guess.
01:32 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@ wiserthanmos

Swedes are good people who have great values in their society eben they are not the real creator of those refugees

... only person like you are Arrogant and Stupid enough to say something like what you have said it here, since after all, where are you now? Whatever bad things you said.. you still come here.. mean that here is still much better than your own crap country..
01:52 October 13, 2010 by svenskamerikansk
If you import the Third World, don't be surprised if you get the Third World. It does add 'diversity' , though. I will give you that. And it will move the society closer to the lowest common denominator.

This is just another classic case of 'Be careful what you ask for....'
02:13 October 13, 2010 by DAVID T
if they want to talk about intergration the photo sums up the whole mess
02:42 October 13, 2010 by janswed
Once again immigration and asylum policies should be like an invitation to a cocktailparty, you are invited, and welcome, but please do not start re-arranging the furniture.
02:45 October 13, 2010 by acidfairyy
This is the problem in the UK. If I move somewhere, and hopefully I will come and study in Stockholm in 2 years, I will try my very hardest to integrate; I'm already learning the language.

It's odd why some people don't seem to want to integrate. I presume it has something to do with the large disparities between western European culture and the rest of the world.
04:33 October 13, 2010 by ericrufinosiah
For the holier than thou immigrants,refer to the photo shot,the Swedish invited

and welcome them in as special guests with all the goodies and gave them a

blank cheque in areas ,whereby even native Swedish were not protected.Now ,it

is not the holier than thou immigrants are facing problem but the native Swedish

because,they are quarreling and fighting among themselves ,for the rights to be

Santa Claus to the Holier Than Thou immigrants.The Swedish cultures of taking

care of thy neighbours as thyself seemed backfired because thy neighbours '

population had increased tremendously due to the care " thyself offered " and I

pray that " thy neighbours " wouldn't chase thyself out,when the right time comes.
05:37 October 13, 2010 by porksteak
Doesn't make any sense that Sweden or any other European country for that matter would have a reason to accept a large number of immigrants. These countries are already fully populated and were sending large numbers off to the US, Canada, Australia not so long ago. It's not like they've added extra land or that the new immigrants are thankful or trying to adapt.

Here in the US we have land and an established history of accepting immigrants. Of course that was after we decimated the original inhabitants but that is another story I suppose.
07:10 October 13, 2010 by waffen
The New York Times has an article in their 12 Oct 10 edition about Nederland, Denmark, Sweden and Germany swinging to the Right in reaction to their immigration issues.

They could easily add Norway and Finland as well.

Good. The necessary measures to bring about normality are finally coming into play. The Northern people are finallly beginning to wise-up about what is happening to their Nations.

Next step.
07:29 October 13, 2010 by Takai
Ladies and Gentlemen,

- Sweden has a problem with immigration.

Don´t you all think that is a bit too early to make such statement? Do we really have all information to believe on that? I am not saying Sweden does not have an issue, just saying we lack on information to judge.

The questions:

1. How many immigrants Sweden accepts per year?

2. How many people die in Sweden per year?

3. How many people leave Sweden to live in another country?

4. How many immigrants are taking Social Security help?

5. How many Swedish people are using Social Security help?

6. How many immigrants are working and paying taxes?

7.How many Swedish people are working and paying taxes?

And that is not the end of what we need to know, feel free to make more questions, and/or answer mines. What we need, fellows, is more questions, more rationality, and, of course, more answers. Otherwise we might be falling on that episode in USA in 1938, The War of the Worlds: panic over nothing.

Feel free to ask me if something was not clear for you. Before comments, please ready carefully to avoid misunderstanding.

Thank you.
07:33 October 13, 2010 by flintis
This article is relevant to the following comment:

A man went into a paint shop to buy a can of paint: " a can of red paint please" he said to the shopkeeper, "sorry I've only got yellow" was the reply, the man contemplated for a second & replied, "that's all right i'll take yellow cos' I'm on me bike"
09:03 October 13, 2010 by jbat

Its simple...

Only Swedes have the right to say " Sweden has a problem with immigration ",

What right immigrants like you with full of jealousy and personal problems have to say it so even when Swedes say it no?

Ywah.. give all the benefits to immigrants like you and problem solve? hahahaha....

SD boys SD boys SD boys....
09:15 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@ waffen

only American and party boys like you believe what those "The New York Times", AP, CNN, etc etc etc (aka American war propaganda media) said...

Only less than 6% Swedes vote (accidentally actually haha) for this party, and then they conclude "Sweden swinging to the Right in reaction to their immigration issues". What a big fat liar it is and party boys like you? yeah.. keep on spreading the poison until this country really fall down and then you can go back to your crap country (mission accomplished huh?)

To fill in your stupid brain that full with jealousy, hatred and personal problem (most of this party boys here are disappointed people, some are jobless... yeah jobless with no benefit.. and some are their wife or sambo have no job and also without benefit! sorry for this dear!).. with this current situation that Sweden a better country and that make you all come here hoping to get luck here (but you can't .. and sorry again..).. read latest post in the discussion forum about USA people plan to migrate here...
09:19 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@ asian123

I know your disappointment living here with no job and cannot get benefit either... I bet this morning you are busy in SFI class and in this class, i bet you are too afraid to say anything in front of those Arabs, so you speak like a little coward here...

Do you want a job as a refugee toilet cleaner? I recommended it to you with all benefits same as those refugees get?
09:36 October 13, 2010 by salalah

A comment is not supposed to be a dissertation
09:36 October 13, 2010 by engagebrain
There are clearly people around the world who need a safe refuge and Sweden shows its decency by accepting many from the world's trouble spots.

However very few other countries share Sweden's decency and actually accept refugees in significant numbers.

Sweden need to pressure or shame other countries into sharing the burden of helping the oppressed.
09:59 October 13, 2010 by G Kin

Have you guys in the first world left the third world in peace?.

I suppose you are american?. An additional shame for you to make such comments.

Isn't it you guys that have burnt down Iraq, Afghanistan etc , driving these people from their homes?. Then expect to be left alone in peace and luxry cos the problem is that of the first world.

Sorry, the only option as long as we share this planet earth will be to fight for a better life for all. Problems in Iraq, Somalia etc will meet you In US , Sweden, England etc. The injustices that you guys have enjoyed in the past can not continue in this ever globalising world!.
10:03 October 13, 2010 by Goodwill81
Look at the horrific photo above and you won't need any article to tell you what's happening.

Afghanistan or Sweden? Hm...
10:07 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@G Kin

Sorry.. cleaner is not perfect job for American, so they think they have no responsible for anything they have done in this world.

Everybody in this world know who created those refugees from Iraq, Afghans, Somalia etc if not USA. But now they want to close it with hatred issue toward muslims and 3rd world country so people will forget about what bad things they have really done!
10:10 October 13, 2010 by G Kin

It looks to me you are one of those that do not want immigrants in Sweden since you see them only as a problem?.

Just reflect on what you guys in the west have done in other countries.

Think of Africa in particular. Do you guys really have a reason to complain?. Or are you the elites that always should have it better than anyone else?.

To be honest, no group of people has damaged the world, other people's societies more than you in the west.

10:15 October 13, 2010 by jbat
"Family w/ disabled child wants to move out of USA"


Still there is an American who want to come here while some of Americans living here trying to spread out about what they called it "problem immigration issue".

Not to discourage this people to come here, just to show that this problems actually are fake things.

Hope this another wanna move here US citizens will not behave like those Americans here!
10:18 October 13, 2010 by cowboykodp


This is exactly the point of the article. Most of these people on this web site are as @Jbat says, not very educated and most likely bitter due to being jobless, broke, etc..

With a big tinge of Racism sewn in.

In short, they do not speak from educated information gathering, but from their own dark, sad, and painful hearts.

Compassion does not equal leftwing/communist etc..

Hate however does equal Nazi like mentality.

a day after a recent EDL gathering in England, thousands got together to reject EDL and by extension, SD, and the rest of these internet bigots.

Beautifully said by musician Billy Bragg at the gathering:

"Each generation has had to confront the racists and the fascists, my parents' generation in the war, my generation in Rock Against Racism and the new generation today with the EDL."
10:19 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@ G Kin

Sorry for the missunderstanding...

I am at the other side.. not what you think..

mean that I am not and never supporting the idea of anti immigrant / anti muslims / anti 3rd world country / anti humanity!
10:23 October 13, 2010 by Nemesis
This article needs to be rewritten and links to facts need to be prodced.

Otherwise the article as it stands is designed to add fuel to the flames.
10:49 October 13, 2010 by donutwallah
The safe refuge thing is bogus. Just see how many families fly back to visit their supposedly dangerous homeland once they've been accepted...
10:51 October 13, 2010 by Sam1
Very nicely said...in the place I live in its all the ones who beg social bidrag are the ones who are member of SD, and most have alcoholic problems and drug abuse..

And those who are excluded, characterized by low-levels of education and low incomes, have less confidence in researchers and experts and less belief in a knowledge-based society than others.

"They are less satisfied with their lives and with democracy, and have less faith in other people. Many of them can be found among Sweden Democrat voters," they write.

and the SD supporters even have problems with unfortunate people who are sick o example.

by Swedesmith

@ cowboy #6

A one eyed dwarf with a prosthetic leg and a bad case of hemorrhoids? Just a guess.

So its not just racism its persecution to every one who is different and its hate toward the basic of life diversity and colour.
11:15 October 13, 2010 by wiserthanmos
Relax people, for there will be the days of restributions, where everything is goin to be settle fair and square. Meanwhile, just relax and put a smile on your face and hope for that day is coming sooner than later. Just look around Europe, our side is gainning grounds every day and the lefties are scare shitless of this, that's why they're in the attacking mode, like a gian beast taking the last breath, they know that that their 65 years reign is soon come to an end.
11:21 October 13, 2010 by samwise
the enlightened all-knowing elites strike again.

why don't they throw the 73% uneducated population to some re-education camp until they come up with the "correct" answers on those survey questions.

What they are saying is: your common sense doesn't count, your first hand experience doesn't count, your intelligence doesn't count, your heart doesn't count, the only thing reliable is the numbers produced by the enlightened, verified by some other enlightened peers. The masses should just listen.

How many enlightened "intellectuals" praised communist soviet unions years ago? countless, my friends.

Who said the subprime mortgage packaging is a smart low-risk financial invention? Who used all sorts of formulas and charts to prove their investments were sound? the enlightened experts. The ones didn't go to ivy league schools thought otherwise.

In the heart of the enlightened elites, they can't stand democracy, they can't stand individual liberty. Who are we to have equal rights and equal votes with them? We should thank the enlightened advanced elites that they bother to rule over us. What a sacrifice they offer to the uneducated worthless rednecks.
12:00 October 13, 2010 by cowboykodp

What side is that? The 5-10% of Europeans?

I'll tell you one thing, you might be right about the reckoning coming. Guess what side I and the vast majority of people will be on?

Study your history, and you will find that throughout history the side which comes from a place of love and peace and respect, always wins. While the side that comes from hate, bigotry, racism, and misinformation are .... well, disposed of.
12:20 October 13, 2010 by Sam1
Keep on Smiling forever its good for the face muscles...

What you say will never happens!!! but its good to day dream and smile

12:31 October 13, 2010 by skatty
I think integration and immigration is a problem; when there is not knowledge what integration, immigration and problems are considered! What kind of integration Swedes are looking for?

You can't have a correct understanding of integration, when immigrants have very low chance to get a good job (according to Swedish research), or are limited in their own net of communications, or there is a negative understanding about them.

I mean when immigrants are identified as people, who are living in Sweden for Welfare, then certainly you can't implement integration! The mass would not recognize immigrants as a dynamic part of society, especially in a homogeneous country with Xenophobia!
12:40 October 13, 2010 by Goodwill81
@samwise #45


P.S. They know things are slowly changing but are currently in denial.
12:42 October 13, 2010 by wiserthanmos

I rather be with the 1% that willing to fight for what they believe than on the side of 99% of cowards like you and kind. Go ahead, if you'd like to find out what these 5-10% Europeans are made up then do your worse and see! If want to have peace and stability and reject the lawlessness messy society that in the making and been labeled as racist, bigot or whatever then it's just fine with me.
12:54 October 13, 2010 by anglesaxon
its good to see that more & more people are getting wise to these people.they dont think like us & dont want to integrate or abide by our western laws.its certainly not the fault of the indiginous population who are suffering because of it.look after our people first, thats what they would do in their own country.
13:14 October 13, 2010 by xguild
"its good to see that more & more people are getting wise to these people.they dont think like us & dont want to integrate or abide by our western laws.its certainly not the fault of the indiginous population who are suffering because of it.look after our people first, thats what they would do in their own country. "

Agreed. I often speak out against anti-immigration comments and articles because they always apporach this as a problem of economics which it is not. There is nothing racist about having national pride and wishing to maintain your country as you see fit and I agree with you that citizens of any country have the right to force immigrants to adapt to their society and not the other way around. Sweden is full of Swedes and it is their culture, their society and their choice on how they want the future of their culture to look, if thats racist then you can chalk me up as a racist. I do however object to anyone who tries to manuver around this uncomfertable topic by sighting false information like claiming that it costs too much money as their has never been any evidence to support that whatsover.
13:28 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@ anglesaxon

Only people with racist brain like you can say that.

"dont want to integrate or abide by our western laws" what is this? sample? just because they don´t want to wear nude clothes or at least cloth that can show how big her breast are... so these people failed to integrate. Just because they don't like free sex, then these people failed again.. what a dirty Bush mind you have!

helloo... go to Kista and have a look how those arabs integrate really well with western cultures. For most of the arabs i see there, I can no longer guess which one are muslim..with their sexy clothes, dying hair, tattoos, and eaiting during day of ramadhan.. so those are fail integration right?

what a shitt of people you racist people are... ehh I forgot, most of you are disappointed people at your own country, migrated here to try your own luck, but still no luck, so what else... spread you disappointed feelings toward other races and religion....

And again, put it in your stupid mind that those refugees are not volunteering to become refugees, but American made refugees for oil and Swedes are kind enough to help these suffering people have their second chances of life here.. so what? Jealous?
13:34 October 13, 2010 by jbat
"more & more people".. yeah.. I real racist person, 10 trolls with many different ids, plus all other are mainly American.

"Family w/ disabled child wants to move out of USA"


Still there is an American who want to come here while some of Americans living here trying to spread out about what they called it "problem immigration issue".

Not to discourage this people to come here, just to show that this problems actually are fake things. Go on.. advice her openly in that forum, I want to see how honest you can be to your own countrymen!

Anywa, hope this another wanna move here US citizens will not behave like those racists Americans here!
13:43 October 13, 2010 by svenskamerikansk

You cannot reasonably expect forthright honesty and open debate from people in a society that persecutes freedom of speech. It is most unfortunate that people must live with lies imposed upon them by government. No good will come from the soft totalitarianism of political correctness.
13:49 October 13, 2010 by jbat
"It is most unfortunate that people must live with lies imposed upon them by government"

Yeah you know well about this since your government really expert in making false legitimate reason to attack other countries and create global racism problem to hide its dirty works in Iraq, Afghans, Pakistani, Somalia.. ohh so much dear...

Look at most of the Americans here, they really hate refugees and they don´t feel any responsibility toward these refugees even though it is their own government who create these refugees... now they don´t want others to take care of these refugees too so their government dirty work will remain closed and not really visible...
14:03 October 13, 2010 by svenskamerikansk
G Kin @ 34

I'm quite comfortable with being judged by the enemies and friends that I keep. What is it that you stand for? Are you the of the type that likes to keep people under their boot?

Your inanity has all been heard before. It's boring.
14:14 October 13, 2010 by xguild
"Look at most of the Americans here, they really hate refugees and they don´t feel any responsibility toward these refugees even though it is their own government who create this refugees... now they don´t want others to take care of these refugees too so their government dirty work will remain closed... "

I don't think that's true at all, Americans hate the problems refugees creates just like Swedes do, the recent voting in Sweden proves that without question. My argument is simply that the media has potrayed this as a major economic crisis of some sort without any actual data to support that fact. People don't like refugee's because it pulls them out of the comfort zone that they have created within their society and I support the idea that they have the right to do so even if they are the direct cause of the refugee's plight.

The reason for it is simple, just like Swedish Citizens aren't their government Americans are not their government either. I'm aware of the fact that the country Im from is responisble for many of the problems around the globe, but I did not support any wars, I didn't authorize them personally and I won't stand behind the government pretending that somehow because Im an American its my fault the world sucks and its now my responsibility to help them fix the problem.

I feel for the refugees around the world, but it is not a problem I own and I certainly don't feel that the obligation to solve those problems fall on other countries. Swedes have the right to have their comfort zone and if they don't want refugees in their country that's their right, they don't need to give anyone an explaination. Suffice to say however they don't need to create excuses or lies to support some false idea that its anything other then the fact that Swedes just don't want to deal with the problem.
14:55 October 13, 2010 by wiserthanmos
Not long ago, to invaded another country one needed a lot money, men and guns, but now, to invade an entire Continent one just needed to look like that one in the picture that facing you above. These new invaders don't need to fire a shot, the don't need to do much except having more baby invaders and the societies that they've conquered will bow to their pressure. So let's borrow some quotes from Voltaire to describe the situations in Sweden and Europe..."The multitude of books is making us ignorant." and "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." So chew on it people!
15:26 October 13, 2010 by jbat
"I feel for the refugees around the world, but it is not a problem I own and I certainly don't feel that the obligation to solve those problems fall on other countries."

What a very responsible human this person is... then who create this refugees if not your own government? What an easy excuses.,. then who elected those government if not your own dirty hand?
15:36 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@ wiserthanmos Not so long... just few years ago by American army lead by their dirty, cruel and inhuman leaders supported by citizens like you...

Yes.. keep ignoring your what your dirty government did while pointing your hand to other people...

Sweden and europe invaded by refugees.. haha.. is there any other funny theories you can come out to justified your dirty racist mind?

oh yeah... maybe next funny story will be...

"Refugees with the help of Saddam's ghost are moving WMD from Iraq to here (thats why US can never find it) and is positioning it toward the capital city...so beware!... sincerely from R rated people"
15:38 October 13, 2010 by Goodwill81
@wiserthanmost #59

Well put.

Like some muslim creep said referring to the islam's strive for do

domination over the West - "There won't be a single bullet shot in this war, in this war we're going to gain victory with the wombs of our women."

Well, to mr. Islam-strategist, and to all of you alike, Europe is waking up. We know your dirty, malicious grand scheme but lives of many will stand on the path to your long-desired triumph. The more you press it, defy its laws and culture, the harder it will strike on you once we reach boiling point. You can count on that.
15:56 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@ Goodwill81

yeah.. they are waking up to stand against racist mind people like you too and that party too... look at how many Swedes gather in the city to say no for racist people like you.. yeah.. wake up people!
16:06 October 13, 2010 by wiserthanmos
"Swedes gather in the city to say no for racist"? Yea, when sh.t hit the fan those Swedes will runn like rats.
16:07 October 13, 2010 by jbat
This is from R rated people here, i hear what they are whispering to each other...

"We will put poison in every Europe society so these European people will forget what our dirty government have done to those refugees.. let us bless our own country and curse these European countries for exposing our government dirty work! haha!"
16:13 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@ wiserthanmos

what shhit you are talking about? I cannot see other than your type of racist shiit? Anyway, why on earth they will fear those coward racist shiit like you?..
16:25 October 13, 2010 by Goodwill81
@ jbat

One can tell from 100 miles youre a true Al-Quaida "sleeper". War is not nice, everyone suffers but Americans did what they had to do to make this world a bit safer place by getting us rid of Saddam, Osama Bin Laden and soon Ahmanidejad.

I know that hurts you and your fellow terrorists and so I urge you to join the fight with your talibans in the mountains of north Pakistan. Hopefully, US Special ops. will get you.
16:33 October 13, 2010 by ww77ww
Cowboy and jbat should be deported to live among those they wish to flood what was the western world. We will see how long they survive. Two less brainless farleftist cowards in this world.
16:36 October 13, 2010 by jbat

Typical US citizen.. like govt like goodwill81... lost the debate.. start accusing people with no evidence... I never said I am supporting those evils stupid US created terrorist to create more war... but hwta i said is those war and these refugees are supposed to be under the responsible of your dirty government...n and now Swedes kindly take these responsiblities.. racist like you start screaamingg... what kind of shiit is that?

I think you are true Osama and Akl Qaeeda supporters, this Osama, he belongs to both muslim and US.. and for the US part.. you are one of them right?

Helloo.. everybody can see who create these refugees.. and those war in Iraq, Afghans and many other places started by US not fot peace.. but for OIL... for peace your shiitt... ask Swedes they also know it.. oohh so now the all Swedes support al qaeeda again the evils stupid US created terrorist...
16:48 October 13, 2010 by jbat
"Americans did what they had to do to make this world a bit safer"

what a shitt statement again.. don´t you see all the problems now come from what US did to those countries... safer from what? from Osama the US creation to fight againts Russian (and now they are againts his own MASTER!... why don´t US just let those Russian invade Afghans? why should give weapons and millitary training to uneducated people like Osama and the gangs?).. WMD hahaha...

I still remember some of these American say they invade Afhgans and Iraq to safe Iraqis and Afghans from their current givernment.. now their country have been invaded and destroyed because of this and now there are other country that kindly enough to take care of these suffering people, and if Americans really sincere to help these people, then they should be happy for this to happen. so these people really have been safe, not opposing it like those American here... if you really good.. then do really good thing... not just for "good"...
17:11 October 13, 2010 by waffen

Next step.

Your ranting will not stop the next step.
18:01 October 13, 2010 by Liquidmonkey
i'm all for freedom of speech and to wear what you want


if you immigrate to a country, whatever country, and YOU DECIDE to DRESS DIFFERENTLY than most people, of course people are gonna look at you and yes, you might even feel segregated.

as a result, you will want o live with similar minded people and hence, segregation begins.

but hey, its your choice, so if you want to fit in, dress like everyone else and stop wearing curtains or bee keeping outfits uptown.

yes, its really that simple people.
18:38 October 13, 2010 by wiserthanmos

Stop barking you filthy animal! Can you see people are talking here?
18:40 October 13, 2010 by jbat
@ Liquidmonk...

Like i said before (maybe you don´t read this entire discussion but let me tell you again).. go to Kista and see how many Arabs wearing like westerners and some of them even bring dog along with them.. I bet you cannot guess if those people are still muslim or not.. Just wait for more time when all these arabs forget their own custom and tradition...

So these integration problem just a fake issue... or you want Swede give them some sort of Micheal Jackson kind of surgery to change their skin color to white ? this will cost a lottt man!
20:36 October 13, 2010 by cowboykodp
@All the Racists who know who they are but are in denial;

Where are they going to deport me to? Stockholm?

Lets face it, me and my Swedish brethren will soon be deporting you sorry Nazi wantabees back to your homelands.

"Repackaged Racists" have no place in the modern world.

NEXT STEP: "Sweden with the help of US will purge all you Racist and send

you to......Antarctica" . You can take that to the bank. CIAO.
20:44 October 13, 2010 by wiserthanmos

What are you goin to do bend over? You and your kind love that I know!
20:49 October 13, 2010 by cowboykodp

Be careful, you're letting on too much about your preferences and age.

"Racists are on the march, but they are nothing but a sorry bunch"

Have a nice day.

09:11 October 14, 2010 by Liquidmonkey
@jbat #65

nope, didn't read all 60 posts ;)

but if people go to a country and dress like the people of that country, then where is the problem?

all i'm saying is that people that adapt have an easier time 'fitting in' while others who continue to wear the dress of their country have a much harder time.

if people want to KEEP their customs, then stay in your own country.

again, its really that simple.
09:18 October 14, 2010 by Takai
to Sr. jbat:

I can deduce you have the answers for those questions, with references. Please, post them to prove your point.

to Sr. cowboykodp:

Thank you for your support, it is a sign of good winds when people can start to enlighten themselves in the middle of storms and hurricanes.

What society is waiting for is a serious debate, based on facts, about the immigration subject in this country, which seems to not concern the politicians since they are too busy choosing one side instead.

Just to help some blurred minds.

Swedish does accept refugees and asylum-seekers. Have someone read the laws for accepting these people in the country?

"Refusal of entry and expulsion

Aliens not having permission to stay in Sweden are refused entry or expelled.

Refusal of entry:

The commonest reasons for refusal of entry are that the alien:

* lacks a passport and a permit for entering Sweden

* has no money for his subsistence and fare home

* is passing through Sweden on his way to another Nordic country but does not have permission to travel there

* seeks asylum but is considered by the Immigration Board to have manifestly no grounds for doing so."

source: http://www.immi.se/migration/control.htm

Now, ladies and gentlemen, pay attention to the * number two. Did you know that? I am just as surprised as you, fellows. Does not indicate also what kind of immigrants Sweden is accepting?

That might seem like I am trying to prove immigration is not a problem in Sweden, but what I really want to show is: we lack of information. We can not decide until we have access to the very same information any country has on this matter.

Before posting, please ready carefully. Questions will be welcome. Be my guest if you are bringing knowledge to the discussion.

Thank you
10:09 October 14, 2010 by xguild

"What a very responsible human this person is... then who create this refugees if not your own government? What an easy excuses.,. then who elected those government if not your own dirty hand? "

I think that's a bit unfair, I mean do you personally hold yourself accountable for every decesion your government makes for you? I didn't vote for Bush, I never supported any wars nor do I stand by anything he did. As far as I'm concerned he should have been strung up right along with Sadam, the two had more in common with each other then they had with me (along with a large portion of the American population).

Besides that I'm not saying that I personally should do nothing about nor do I ignore the issue or avoid responsibility as a citizen of the world, I just don't accept personal responsibility for wars or atrocities my government does behind my back while lieing to my face about it. What I'm trying to point out here is that the sentiment that "Americans Created The Problem" is wholy incorrect, Americans did no such thing, their government did it. Americans citizens under Bushes reign where victims of lies and deceit, and today the world holds American citizens personally responsible for the atrocities of their government. Very much like German citizens where held accountable for the holocust. Bush is Americas Hitler, he lied and decieved us all in the name of democracy when what he was really doing was running his own personal (religiously driven) agenda.
13:07 October 14, 2010 by Ansgard
The Emperor Has No Clothes.
20:20 October 14, 2010 by Kowabunga
THe native American indians still have an immigration problem. I see no sympathy for them (especially from African Americans). No have to realize where this is heading. In the USA, they have a thing called BET (BLack Entertainment Television). Now
23:35 October 14, 2010 by jbat
@ xguild

I know not all and maybe most Americans are againts these wars.. its stupid non winning war! Just like another Vietnem war!

Personally, I am really sorry for these. I have been in America long time ago (not sure what year but it is few years before Sept 11), and the person there are really nice.. it is really nice country to live, with so many jobs, very cheap quality foods and goods, very cheap oil too :-) since I never fill in my car tank full with oil with more than 10usd, my American friends work there just as a trolley picker at Kroger super market (just by hand, manually they will walk around the parking lot picking up the trolley one by one.. not like trolley picker you can see here at Ikea after closing) and thats enough to support his daily life including rent, utilities, foods clothes everything...

I am not sure whats now, but from the news I read it doesn't sound nice anymore and I am really sorry for it...

but... still...I will say YES YES YESSSSS... I will try to be responsible for what my government do..

IF I CAN'T, when someone try to help those victims, I will be very happy for it.. NOT opposing it!

I will be ashamed of myself if I do that... because I am a human.. humann humaaaaannn... same as those Swedes in this country...

The term responsibility can be in many forms, in tolerance world, it is related to your capabilities.. Yes, you cannot overthrow your current strong govt, but in this case, you can take responsibility by not opposing what other good people do for this victims.. thats it... And that is my point my friend...

Peace and good night to all!
03:43 October 15, 2010 by manrush
The xenophobes come out in full force.

And the AIDS denialists too.

There are integration problems, but that is definitely not the same as the "Islamification" crap that has been spewed from mouths that lack brains.
08:06 October 15, 2010 by xguild
You know Jbat one of the things I love about my Swedish wife and my Swedish friends is that most of them see hope wherever they look. I find it to be one of the nicest qualities about Swedes that they always see the potential for change and willingness to the right thing, its a very noble trait. Unfortunatly it also makes Swedes very suseptable to deciet and often makes them come off a bit naive.

Here is the bottom line about the US, because I can tell you more about that then anything else. The US has been and always will be the the most powerful, richest and most free nation in the world. The reason for it is this, if you try to take the freedom from any American (you can choose at random) they will kill you, no questions asked. This is the single sentiment that seperates Americans from most Europeans and which gives them more in common with Islamic extremist then anyone else. Islamic extremist are exactly like Americans, you screw with their culture and they will kill you.

Swedes don't understand that, but they soon will because once you let Islam into your country you won't know who is your every day run of the mill Muslim and who is an Islamic extremist ready to strap a bomb to his own ass and walk into a day care because he heard someone bad mouth the corean. More importantly however, Swedes don't have the stomach for war, I have met Swedish soldiers, they are more like boy scout troops then military men.

Im not saying that Sweden should close its eyes to the plight of immigrants being created around the world, nor do I think they should close their borders. But their has to be control, limits and verification of information. As it stands right now you can get off a plane in Stockholm walk into this country and simply start living here without any fear of prosecution. That may seem like a very noble act, but it is extremely dangerous.
10:11 October 15, 2010 by Cornelius Hamelberg
The immigrant vote is important. No denying that.

Finally, immigration is on the agenda. Before the advent of the Sverige Demokrater it would seem that immigration was not an issue. Now that they have succeded in bringing it into focus, everybody is foaming at the mouth and calling them names, instead of looking at what they say and engaging their arguments instead of further tar and feathering them with the negative image that the press has created of them.

Here's what the Sverige Demokrater say:

10:31 October 15, 2010 by Bork
rabbemos is exactly right. The elephant in the room is Sweden's dependency on its weapons sales for economic wealth. Sweden's government is let off the hook and kept out of the spot light because they let in so many refugees. If they start getting restrictive about it, countries will turn on them and highlight their role in the destruction and murder their weapons have caused in other countries, in countries where some/many of the refugees are fleeing from.

So, in other words, don't expect the centrist parties to do anything no matter what the Swedish public thinks. They are not going to risk Sweden's economic prosperity to deal with domestic issues related to the uncontrolled inflow of refugees. Swedes need to begin protesting both Sweden's involvement in foreign wars (weapon sales and aiding the US and NATO) as well as integration problems, uncontrolled refugees inflow, and unemployment. These are all interconnected. No party is addressing the big picture.
12:09 October 15, 2010 by xguild
One of the key cost factors of immigration is always crime, their is no question their is a direct link in every country including Sweden between high immigration areas and the resulting increases in crime in those areas. The best way to combat that is increase is education of the laws followed by sharp penalties for repeat offenders (aka immediate deportation), a three strikes your out rule should be sufficient.

Noteably however cost is not the really as much of an issue in Sweden when it comes to immigration but in most countries it is, in particular in the US and crime is one of the biggest contributors to that cost.
14:26 October 15, 2010 by BCIS
@Kowabunga...What in the hell are you talking about? African/Black Americans are not responsible for the Native American issue in America. And, what in the hell does BET have to do with the immigration and integration issues in Sweden? Most non-whites in America have "their own channel". There are numerous hispanic channels and other channels geared towards other ethnic groups. Get a Clue and get over the people with dark skin, you seem to be way too preoccupied.
21:59 October 15, 2010 by mikewhite
Of course we are taking care not to confuse immigrants, refugees and people seeking asylum ...
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